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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
 Posted - 08/03/2001 : 08:31:38 [Permalink]
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quote:
Who is "we"? Public schools? Most can't adequately teach students the "Three R's".
While this is true, I think the main issue shouldn't be whether or not schools should teach it. I think it should be whether or not they are allowed to. Let local school districts decide. Federal standards should only apply to the "Three R's".
I think birth control is a perfectly acceptable topic in health class, as it deals with sex already.
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Ma gavte la nata! |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2001 : 21:23:26 [Permalink]
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quote:
Who is "we"? Public schools? Most can't adequately teach students the "Three R's". Now society is going to heap values, morality, and sexual conduct into the curriculum?
Teaching children about birth control and the prevention of sexually transmitted disease is the responsibility of the parent or guardian. I will agree that many parents/guardians are doing a piss-poor job.
We - as in society in general. Unfortunately, many parental units are ill equipped to teach responsible reproduction to their children. Until a generation grows up that is well versed in sexual reproduction prevention methods then it is not a job that we as a society can leave to parents - then there will always be children who will remain uneducated and view sex as an illicet pleasure and a form of rebellion. Leading to the potential for abortion. As things stand we are in the middle of a catch 22.
He's YOUR god, they're YOUR rules, YOU burn in hell! |
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Garrette
SFN Regular
USA
562 Posts |
Posted - 08/10/2001 : 08:10:41 [Permalink]
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It's up! I'm back! My addiction can continue!!!
Sorry for the delay, but Florida and Code Red conspired against me.
More later, perhaps, but let me say to Trish that you're expanded explanation sits much better with me; sorry if I mischaracterized any of your response.
I'm against abortion personally, too, as was my ex-wife. And while I wish others would not choose it, I would treat a friend who did in much the same fashion as you when you helped your friend.
I'm all for educating children. My own are very well educated and their mother and I will keep adding to that as they get older, but there is no state obligation, moral or legal, to provide it; parents, parents, parents.
I'm conflicted about the idea of making safe havens to drop off unwanted children. I fear the long term repercussions. In regard to any particular child that is already born then it is a good thing, because the mother now can safely drop it off somewhere as opposed to murder it. But in view of women not yet pregnant it could possibly provide them a rationalization to not worry about birth control because there is no consequence for conceiving or bearing an unwanted child. So the potential is there for a rise in the unwanted children that the abortion supporters claim is a reason to allow abortion.
I have nothing to substantiate this analysis; just my own reading of it.
More later.
My kids still love me. |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 08/10/2001 : 08:58:36 [Permalink]
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quote:
But in view of women not yet pregnant it could possibly provide them a rationalization to not worry about birth control because there is no consequence for conceiving or bearing an unwanted child.
{cringe!} I can see it now: "What would a man know! Do you know how painful a birth is, not to mention 9 months of pregnancy?! No woman would call that "no consequence!!!"
I wouldn't say that in a room full of women, Garrette! 
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Ma gavte la nata! |
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Lisa
SFN Regular
USA
1223 Posts |
Posted - 08/11/2001 : 02:58:55 [Permalink]
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quote:
quote:
But in view of women not yet pregnant it could possibly provide them a rationalization to not worry about birth control because there is no consequence for conceiving or bearing an unwanted child.
{cringe!} I can see it now: "What would a man know! Do you know how painful a birth is, not to mention 9 months of pregnancy?! No woman would call that "no consequence!!!"
I wouldn't say that in a room full of women, Garrette!
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Ma gavte la nata!
Touche! I'm on a constant diet now in my struggle with weight. Do you have any idea what my ass would look like after getting pregnant? ::Shudder::
Lisa
Chaos...Confusion...Destruction...My Work Here Is Done |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 08/11/2001 : 08:39:47 [Permalink]
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quote:
Touche! I'm on a constant diet now in my struggle with weight. Do you have any idea what my ass would look like after getting pregnant? ::Shudder::
Lisa
It does change and not always for the better. 
quote:
More later, perhaps, but let me say to Trish that you're expanded explanation sits much better with me; sorry if I mischaracterized any of your response.
No problem. I can see how you could misread some of what I said. Unfortunately, I've run across the attitude that women should be forced and undergo certain procedure to ensure that she can no longer have children later one too many times. I really have something against it.
quote:
I'm all for educating children. My own are very well educated and their mother and I will keep adding to that as they get older, but there is no state obligation, moral or legal, to provide it; parents, parents, parents.
As is mine. However, there are parents out there that are uneducated regarding contraception. Unfortunately, they will leave their children uneducated. Without education the possibility of moving away from abortion as a form of birth control is not an option. I think we need to educate our society regarding this issue. While parents are ill equipped to educate their children access to the information should be readily available to children of ages where they are becoming sexually active.
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I'm conflicted about the idea of making safe havens to drop off unwanted children. I fear the long term repercussions. In regard to any particular child that is already born then it is a good thing, because the mother now can safely drop it off somewhere as opposed to murder it. But in view of women not yet pregnant it could possibly provide them a rationalization to not worry about birth control because there is no consequence for conceiving or bearing an unwanted child. So the potential is there for a rise in the unwanted children that the abortion supporters claim is a reason to allow abortion.
I have nothing to substantiate this analysis; just my own reading of it.
This was a concern also. However, I would rather see those children safe rather than have them murdered or thrown away. This was in response to a child being found in a dumpster locally, had it been found a short time earlier (I think the guesstimate was 15-30 min) it might have survived.
This is a preventative measure only. A step in the right direction for those who are scared and don't know what to do with this baby. It's a better option than throwing a baby away.
He's YOUR god, they're YOUR rules, YOU burn in hell! |
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Hat Monster
New Member
United Kingdom
16 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2001 : 18:49:38 [Permalink]
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My personal view of abortion is likely to infuriate many. Brought up out of the reach of the tentacles of the Catholic Church, I came about opinions mainly directed by their merits rather than their ethics.
Abortion is a good thing. What would you prefer? A dead foetus or a maligned criminal killing your sister? Most of the foeti aborted are those which the parents would not have had the resources to bring up in a proper way, and would probably have led a life outside the law. Adoption is not the answer. This brings in it's own problems. Would you give away your child? How would that child feel when (s)he finds out?
Foeti are not human beings. Foeti are organs, albeit temporary ones. There is no difference between a foetus and a kidney, except that the kidney does useful work. Both are redundant.
One should not confuse "could in future" with "has not yet". A foetus has no life. It has none of the characteristics of life. It shares it's characteristics with viri, and viri are considered not to be life forms.
A foetus has less "ethical" value than a human brain. The foetus has never lived. It could have, but has not. The human brain is the person. It is the memories. It is the essence of existence. It was someones lover, someone's parent, someone's sibling. A foetus was none. Where are the campaigners for proper treatment of brains?
When will people stop being used as tools by the various religions?
H@ |
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 01/22/2002 : 20:34:07 [Permalink]
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The only differences between a zygote and an unfertilized ovum are that the zygote has added a SPERM to the ovum, which ovum would otherwise go its merry way without becoming fertilized.
I sometimes think that the big arguments against abortion secretly have to do with that IMPORTANT SPERM and/or the fact that women should be baby-making machines where every ovum MUST BE FERTILIZED at all costs, and little more -- the more babies the better.
ljbrs 
"Nothing is more damaging to a new truth than an old error." Goethe |
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 01/23/2002 : 06:23:59 [Permalink]
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A little facetiousness never hurt anybody, right?
I just saw a special on the Biography Channel (or A&E) on Monty Python. One clip discussed when they got a "Hollywood" budget after "The Life of Brian" became a hit. Their budget was used to make "The Meaning of Life". They apparently blew just about the entire budget on one song: "Every Sperm is Important". A whole village set, with hundreds of villagers (children, nuns, and all!) singing and dancing to this song. Very humorous.  It began with a dad coming home to his wife and something like 42 children.
They were making fun of Catholics...
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Sum Ergo Cogito
Edited by - tokyodreamer on 01/23/2002 06:25:03 |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 01/23/2002 : 15:12:43 [Permalink]
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There's one chapter in Billions and Billions by Carl Sagan that talked about abortion. He points out that until 1869 the Catholic Church had no problem with abortion nor did the laws of the US. It wasn't until the newly formed AMA got involved that abortions became more difficult for women to obtain. But in 1869 a Jesuit declared that he saw a fully formed human in the spermatazoa through a microscope. That's when the church went against abortion. Interesting.
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There is no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our world. It underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another, to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've known. Sagan |
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Jesus
New Member
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - 04/13/2002 : 12:18:23 [Permalink]
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Tarquin Have you considered that maybe YOU were a candidate for abortion? Some babies are born messed up, I was born an alcoholic junkie, adopted 6 months later, and had a pretty normal life. The fact that so many people can toss a life away because it hasn't been born sickens me. The selfishness is too extreme how does my abortion afect you in any way ? Mind your business !I see kids abused everyday slowly ,sadly , turning to stone inside because there parents don't pay attention to them.The girls will wind up pregnent themselves by some old loser.I myself would not know or care if I had been aborted
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