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Soso Koba
New Member
USA
6 Posts |
 Posted - 05/08/2003 : 20:35:48
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Quick note: This first essay is the least thought out of them, but I always consider it important because it was the first one that I wrote.
Posted this at other political forums, usually with mixed results, but here goes.
Note: the che-lives link might be dead, malte and the liberal facists do not like dissenting opinions of realists you see, but check anyway, the responses are interesting.
I advocate stalinism as a step to start the evolution of goverment to an evantual outcome of Utopian anarchism, which is the most perfect form of goverment, but is impossible to achieve because noone is really good natured no matter what they tell you.
For this to work you have to be EXTREMELY objectivist, if you're not, you'll come out thinking that whoever would want this is a brutal monster who doesn't value human lives. But you see, I DO value human lives, and as I do, I feel that some sacrifices SHOULD be made for the greater good, because the evantual outcome will make up for all those lost lives.
Posting from here:
http://www.che-lives.com/cgi....ic=1178
Removing Inefficencies
The communist economy is designed to be as efficent as possible, so what happens when a wrench is thrown into the cogs of the new economy?
Well everything stops, well maybe not -stops- outright, but it slows things down, and enough of these wrenches will evantually stop the communist machine.
So what are these wrenches of inefficencies? Mostly they include criminals, what are criminals in my eyes? Enemies of the majority, if the majority of people LIKE a goverment, and someone has the nerve to speak out and cause trouble, he is an enemy of the majority AND a criminal. What else slow down the machine? Stupid people. Yes we all HATE stupid people, and maybe there are some things they are actually good for, but most people would rather that they don't exist, the MAJORITY would rather they don't exist, and so, the majority comes first, in communism, an individual doesn't matter, the people as a whole do. And what other groups? People who are parasites of the majority, eg. the elderly, the mentally retarded, the mentally ill, I mean certainly it is a shame they were born that way, it would be a shame if I were born that way wouldn't it? But still, no matter how bad we feel for them, they are simply sponging off the majority in order to live, and what do they give in return? Nothing apart from some corny bulls*** answer like 'love', 'love' does NOTHING for the state, NOTHING for the majority, why should the people suffer because a few individuals have a special place in their being for 'love'. So what are these unfortunate people? Criminals! So you see, most EVERYONE who holds back society as a whole is a criminal, I mean, if one is able to reform his/her ways, they should be given another chance, if not, there's not point, an old person is not going to magically become young and useful, but a murderer from a bar brawl might, he needs a second chance for maximum efficency of the society, of course if he makes repeated errors, his is a permenant criminal and is removed.
Where do all these criminals get removed to? Hard to say, sending them to other countries is expensive, why should we let them feed even MORE from the majority? Of course killing them gets you frowned upon by other nations.
While I personally vote for killing them off, some people are more humanitarian (and I wish they were criminals too) and so what would the compromise be? I think giving them their own little community, if they're so self sufficent and useful as people think, let them try fending on their own.
With these problems gone the machine can move alot more succesfully, and this might seem brutal and unhuman, but surely as a communist you agree with darwinism? Why not social darwinism, survival of the fittest? Because we're people? Thats very close minded.
Look at the ant colony, one of the most efficent structures in existance, the ants NEVER put themselves first, and what happens to sick ants, well, they die, why should they be helped along when they hinder the other ants. Ants are the PERFECT communists, they lack identity and individuality, and considering that will be the evantual outcome of human evolution, why fight it? We should strive for this earlier, we can transcend what we are right now.
Now naturally some communists pass this off as being nazism, but its not, nazism focused on an INDIVIDUAL race transcending humanity, but in this form of communism, the MAJORITY transcend humanity, by carefully weeding out the problems of the majority, the CRIMINALS and the INEFFICENCIES.
Why is wanting the best for most of the people so wrong, improving things is RIGHT, and to improve things, sacrifices have to be made, the french revolution was full of it, and the french managed to take over most of europe in a decade! An amazing feat! Think what we could do today with the same instance, but better techology and oppertunities to improve!
Could we begin breeding people to work like animals, most of you eat food grown by animals breed for sowing fields, whether you're a vegetarian or meet eater. Is this so wrong? Are humans NOT animals? Humans should thusly be bread for certain things, big humans are for hard manual labour that is designed by intelligent humans, this might one day divide up the human race, but considering our ultimate form is being virtual clones of one another, this won't really be a problem. Now you think 'ahh! This will make classism between the different types of humans!' WRONG, if we eliminate the CRIMINALS who try to take advantage of this, and CREATE classes, there would be no classism.
Now someone actually replied to this thread, I know other people viewed it but noone else responded. Read my replies as guest to further explain how I feel, because its hard to place into the essay, I need to argue to have things like that pop into my head.
You could say I'm a vicious old person hating man now, but I'm not, I like my grandma and grandpa, it doesn't change the fact I think they're entirely useless for anything except being a grandma and grandpa, but I still love them.
Would I put my own grandparents to death for the good of the state? Well, it depends on the situation doesn't it?
In the United States as I am right now, No I would not put them to death, in a society as I described, yes maybe I would, I wouldn't be willing, I wouldn't enjoy it, but you have to be objectivist you see.
Goverment is always evolving but it seems to have gotten stuck on capitalism, Capitalism is like getting C's in high school, you're not really making anything that much better but aslong as you're passing who really cares. It works, and its a comfortable society, noone supposedly worthwhile has anything BAD to say about it and all those dirty hippies don't matter.
Well you should care for them then! You should be objectivist, look at china, someday china will reach a more utopian form of communism, but it will have become so intertwined with capitalism it will have all been a waste, because capitalism is like the forbidden fruit that once you've tasted you'll want more of it and so china will be corrupted into a second USA. Only without a revolution.
To stop this, NO liberties should be allowed, except but occasionly, indoctrinated people are loyal people, loyal people will keep communism.
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"Soso, this creature softened my stony heart, she is dead and with her have died my last warm feelings for all human beings.. It is all so desolate here inside, so unutterably desolate." -Josef Djugavishili (Stalin) upon the death of his wife. |
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Soso Koba
New Member
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2003 : 20:36:48 [Permalink]
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Another section from the book of evolutionary stalinism, though the previous one was mostly just a copy and paste from the book, mixed with my posts at another forum.
Why evolutionary stalinism is evolutionary?
Evolutionary stalinism is a goverment that is designed to evolve and react to any situation easily, it also speeds up the evolutionary process of mankind.
Mankind's future is evantually extinction, and evolutionary stalinism speeds this up, now I can guess what you're thinking here, everyone gets killed, thats speeds up extinction, but read on and try not to think so generically and simply.
Firstly I will explain how evolutionary stalinism will be progressing the biological evolution of mankind.
Realising that evantually mankind will all become one big race, evolutionary intends to speed this up and cause a even greater change than nature would and at a much faster pace. Interracial marriages is not some encouraged as it is forced, you will be placed with the mate that will produce the best off spring for you, people with undesirable genes will not be allowed to have children, simple as that. Because of this, prostitution and rape will become big problems very quickly. This is why stalinism is needed to put a halt to these quickly, prostitution will be outlawed everywhere or we'll have genetically inferior babies running around everywhere, and women who are victims of rape will have to have an abortion and the male who perpetrated such a crime will not only be never allowed to produce offspring, but ALSO have his genitals removed to prevent further problems with these individuals. All of this is to try and create perfect humans, or humans suited to their paticular task, such as muscular humans doing physical jobs, intelligent humans doing jobs that do require intelligence. All children will be given a test at age 12 to see what they are most suited for. Sooner or later when we've reached the type of humans that can no longer be improved for each task, they will begin mixing with eachother, and create supermen. Nazish this seems, but its not focused on one paticular groups superiority. By doing this humans WILL evantually become nothing more than indentical clones of eachother and the whole process would take 750-1000 years at the most which in a cosmic sense, IS TINY! And with genetic engineering it will go even quicker, maybe even shortened to 250-500 years.
Sooner or later these superhumans will themselves become obselete even as we find more efficent means to do our work, it won't be a sad ending, but rather a new beginning. Very slowly robots will begin doing jobs that human used to do, robots are cheaper to maintain than people and don't make errors, humans make errors and they don't require such careful regulating during their production as humans do. Very slowly specialised robots will do jobs humans did, and untimately humans will become useless and won't be permitted to reproduce anymore and thats when we die off except for a few, exceptionally elite and expensive produce humans who will direct the robots until artificial intelligence reaches such a point that not even these leaders will be needed. This is the outcome of the human race, capitalist or communist, but evolutionary stalinism, is forcing evolution to go quicker, if this is iminent then why fight it? I think we want to speed up our transcendence.
As for the actual goverment evolving, it will slowly change from its stalinism to ultimately, utopian anarchism (which will be entirely possible with everyone being the same and none having advantages over another). Evolutionary stalinism once again speeds up evolution from the slow pace the world is going right now, at this rate we'll never reach utopian anarchism. With stalinism indoctrinating the people into behaving as they should, the transcendence into the final form of government will go smoothly and quickly.
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"Soso, this creature softened my stony heart, she is dead and with her have died my last warm feelings for all human beings.. It is all so desolate here inside, so unutterably desolate." -Josef Djugavishili (Stalin) upon the death of his wife. |
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Soso Koba
New Member
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2003 : 20:38:03 [Permalink]
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I should have posted this with the original topic to explain what objectivity means to the evolutionary stalinists rather than what it means to ayn rand.
The Objectivity of it all
This does not involve the revolution, this has nothing to do with what comes after, nor does it have anything to do with the far ahead future. This chapter is purely to explain why objectiveness is important to evolutionary stalinism.
Objectiveness is the most important feature of humanity, and when all the humanity on the planet is essentially destroyed, there will remain a few people left, the leaders who will stay objective. The most intelligent people are objective, being objective is not lacking any sort of compassion or emotions or sympathy for any of your fellow human beings. Objectivity, is ignore these feelings for the greater good of the society. Objective people take it one step at a time, while people who don't, refuse to even take a step forward, they want to improve everything around them at that very moment and do nothing else. Its refusing to let anything alter your plans, not to the point of failure. Objectivity to failure, is digging a tunnel under the ocean which collapses and flood and you keep sending people down their to dig more everyday. The objectivity I speak of is, thinking you have a setback, you make sure to note the mistake that caused that collapse, but you won't stop trying to dig a tunnel under the ocean, you instead dig a new tunnel and use your new information, and if that tunnel collapses too, you use that information and dig a new. You keep digging tunnels until one of them succeeds in going under the ocean entirely, you stay objective. As you will see a person who has lost their humanity, will have objective, but it will be objectivity to failure, that is why leaders are so important.
To see what happens when people don't have objectivity, look at the results of Gorbechev's Glasnost, unless his objective was turning the russian economy to nothing, he failed miserably. Gorbechev didn't think ahead, he didn't have a goal apart from to open up things with the west. That goal failed for the most part, and he ruined Russia and killed the Soviet Union while he was at it. Lacking an objective ends up hurting more than helping, and lacking objectivity, lets your objective fail too. To see objectivity to the point of failure, look at Stalin's farming collective, he kept trying to do something that wouldn't work, he didn't alter his plans to make it more succesful, he just kept trying, and kept killing farmers who refused and ended up causing a massive famine. Stalin refused to have the objectivity to realise that his initial plan wasn't going to work and he needed to change it. Stalin is a great teacher for us, but he isn't the perfect example of success. Someone which did succeed, was Franklin D. Roosevelt, who, no matter you may dislike him and his country, was objective. His goal was to get the american economy back on its feet, and to help the people who needed it. And he did both, succesfully. Some plans he tried didn't work, and so they were dropped and he tried new plans. Some of these new plans were voted out by congress, but that didn't stop him, he kept trying to get them passed until they were. He realised he couldn't please everyone during the Depression so he pleased the people who needed it most, and the people who would be most helpful to him. Like earlier noted pleasing everyone might be beneficial for the moment but it will cause many problems in the future. This is why FDR is respected and revered by socialists and capitalists alike today, because he was objective.
Seeing that objectivity is the most important part of this society, is the most important thing a follower must realise or he will immidiatly pass off this entire society as evil, because he is only thinking about the moment. If there is no objectivity in the followers, the entire revolution fails, the entire goverment fails, the entire dream fails, everything fails. This seems like a strong plan and goverment, but is in fact extremely delicate, the word authoritarian can kill it, objectivity can kill it. Things which are no danger to any other goverment, are like poison to evolutionary stalinism. When explaining our dream to someone, use our objective as the first thing you explain, the objective is most important. If people hear something like 'utopia' they are triggered to think that we have good intentions, say 'authoritarian' and then explain how it gets to utopia. It won't matter, all they heard was 'authoritarian' and everything else they hear won't be thought about or absorbed.
Upon this explanation, it is hoped the reader realises that the objective is the most important thing and thinking objectively is important for reaching this utopia. Explain backwards for people, let them see the final outcome first.
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"Soso, this creature softened my stony heart, she is dead and with her have died my last warm feelings for all human beings.. It is all so desolate here inside, so unutterably desolate." -Josef Djugavishili (Stalin) upon the death of his wife. |
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Soso Koba
New Member
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2003 : 20:39:53 [Permalink]
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This is not entirely completed and gets kind of silly, because I got bored, at the end. Its about the new society in early days, while law, punishment and money are still necessary.
Society Outline
This will explain how the society operates, simply and straight forwardly so its easy to modify and understandable by the masses
One of the features of this new goverment is the ability of the goverment to raise and lower prices on anything it wants, but because the goverment is not lead by a group of beaureacrats where few know anything about that decision their making, this goverment will have seperate leaders for each decision to be made and they will specialise entirely, and probably exclusively on their own paticular field. No leader of one speciality will be able to influence another.
The leaders are not elected but born into leadership, they are the extreme social elites, modified by gene engineering when it becomes possible for the state to do this. But for the early days the leaders will be children of forced couples mixing the most desirable genes, repeatedly until their offspring becomes as close to perfection as possible at the time. Leaders are necessary to be perfect because we cannot have an average human running a country where he is not democratically elected. He will be raised from birth into one way of thinking, and will be trained to be void of emotion, outlandish as this seems, its entirely possible.
The problem of corrupt leaders who control an entire branch of the goverment comes into question by alot, after all, they are forced into power whether they like it or not, and the state may not be such a good judge of character. Leaders doing irrational things will probably be noticed by other leaders and will thusly, the leader becoming corrupt will be executed before any trouble can be stirred and a replacement will come in. Naturally while we perfect the brainwashing process numerous leaders will need replacing early on.
Another necessary feature during the early days is a large amount of leaders, as said earlier the brainwashing process will not have been perfected and the most important people in our country may crack under the pressure. To prevent all this strain being placed on one individual, they will have counselors, who also will have power over an entire set of specialities. Eg. The leader of the army will control the leader of the, infantry, navy and airforce, and the leaders of these will further have subordinates under them, much as it is now, the new state will be somewhat based on the military.
But back to the state. The state is able to control prices, if the people early on are troublesome the state will have the ability to raise prices on certain goods, or shut off trade of a good altogether if a community is causing too much trouble. If there is a large set of murders in one town, the state will turn the faucet to shut off all luxury items, if it continues, the state will raise the price of everything else, if it continues still, nothing will be sent to community for sale. With this at stake the community will go on a witch hunt most likley and hunt down the criminals themselves. This is the reason why currency will still be in use, we cannot rely on people to do the right thing early on, that is why we must use force. Currency can be thrown away once everyone is indoctrinated, as can police services, there just won't be a use for them.
Because the state will want to keep track of its people, everyone will be given a indentification card. Wages and various other earned amounts of money can be placed on these cards, and certain people can even have prices raised for them if they commit petty crimes. A man who runs a red light might have prices of items raised by 1% for him. The money earned by these goto helping lower the prices for model citizens, so nothing is wasted. This will also encourage the people to follow the law and show good effort.
The laws are fairly lenient, but lawyers will not be provided as it costs the state money as the people will not be able to afford lawyers and lawyers themselves are useless in this society anyway. For misdemeanors there will be no trial and the person will just have to suffer the cosequences of it, including in misdemeanors now however are sexual misconduct, which are considered by the author to be over blown and not really that dangerous to society, unless of course they harm to victim in a more than acceptable way, in this case, a bloody nose is acceptable, however, a broken arm becomes assault and a felony. When it comes to felonies all punishments are the same, execution. However it will be easy to escape this if you can convince a unbiased judge that you will be unlikley to commit the crime again and will thusly remain productive. If your record says you have atleast two prior felonies you will have no trial and be executed promptly. The state and people will not pay for prisons so criminals can live to do nothing productive or efficent.
Another set of punishments which will most likley will stop being used once the reconstruction is finished, is deportation or a work camp. For religious clergy, they are given the option of deportation, work camp, or remaining and having heavy taxes on everything the church owns. Many times however, espcially if the church has been troublesome, the clergy will given only the deportation or work camp options. Other victims of these punishments will be dissidents over all, we want to give the world a good view of our new country so anyone who doesn't like it will be given the oppertunity to leave. Once leaving the state is no longer optional the remaining dissidents will be placed in work camps, and evantually the punishment for all dissidents will be execution.
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"Soso, this creature softened my stony heart, she is dead and with her have died my last warm feelings for all human beings.. It is all so desolate here inside, so unutterably desolate." -Josef Djugavishili (Stalin) upon the death of his wife. |
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Soso Koba
New Member
USA
6 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2003 : 20:41:47 [Permalink]
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It's a theory I created one day and decided to continue thinking about, its gradually become more and more anti-humanity the more I wrote about it. Originally it was to show the goverment evolving from a stalinist goverment slowly into utopian anarchism by indoctrinating the people enough to be raised not wanting to break the law. Changing gradually from scare tactics to rewards for good behaviour until it just wasn't necessary.
When I really thought about this it seemed a stupid theory. People, if given independence will abuse it, no matter how their great grandmother behaved in the police state. So I started leaning more towards crushing the human spirit and personality where they won't want to abuse the independence given. Humans gain personality through enviroment, if the enviroment doesn't have any feelings or personality, what do you think the child will turn into? Someone who won't be greedy, selfish, hateful, racist, jealous or sinful, a perfect person, like jesus, only without compassion.
Looking at earlier chapters of the book compared to the later ones shows a big difference in my thinking. Also I began caring more about humanity being truelly equal (and the more I thought, I realised that equality is only what the majority make it out to be), and for this the people had to have no jealousy or greed or humanity. Then it changed from humanity benifiting from all of this to me questioning whats the point in it all,
I was asked this by a couple people and my retort had always been that there was no point in them either but I wanted to improve things, but then I realised life does have a point and that is to leave a legacy. If you're not remembered your life was meaningless.
I wanted to focus on the state being remembered rather than the individual, the United States is just made up individuals, US citizens will be remembered but the country won't because it has no legacy, unlike rome which stamped its label on everything and claimed it as ROME'S achievement, the USA doesn't do this, or when it does it has to share credit with the people who really did it.
I care more about the state than some individual, so I want my state to leave a legacy that will be remembered forever, like rome. So noone gets more credit than anyone else.
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"Soso, this creature softened my stony heart, she is dead and with her have died my last warm feelings for all human beings.. It is all so desolate here inside, so unutterably desolate." -Josef Djugavishili (Stalin) upon the death of his wife. |
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Tim
SFN Regular
USA
775 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2003 : 03:27:25 [Permalink]
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Yes, the link you placed in your first post is dead.
I will cut and paste the rest of your posts, put them on my pocket computer and check them out at work between broken machines. That was quite a lot of work for a first post. Give me some time, and I'll get back with you. |
"We got an issue in America. Too many good docs are gettin' out of business. Too many OB/GYNs aren't able to practice their -- their love with women all across this country." Dubya in Poplar Bluff, Missouri, 9/6/2004
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