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ktesibios
SFN Regular
USA
505 Posts |
 Posted - 07/09/2003 : 13:42:38
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For once my supply of curse words has proved completely inadequate.
Don't we condemn cults for exactly the same behavior?
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"The Republican agenda is to turn the United States into a third-world shithole." -P.Z.Myers |
Edited by - ktesibios on 07/09/2003 13:44:57
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 07/09/2003 : 16:44:22 [Permalink]
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It ain't Hogwarts, is it?
Any parents who would send their children, however unruly, to this gulag should be forced to join them.
And Jay Kay makes an excellent argument for retroactive abortion.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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wonkavision
New Member
USA
16 Posts |
Posted - 08/03/2003 : 12:52:08 [Permalink]
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| I'm surprised that they aren't trained to fetch as well. I don't even know where to begin with what is wrong with this. A good percentage of these childrens who act out have personality or mood disorders, and such an approach will only further damage their psyche. Forcing submission with draconian tactics is not the way to help these children, which I assume is ostensibly the point of this program. Or is the objective simply to make life easier for the parents unfortunate enough to have a mentally ill child, regardless of the child's welfare? And is the methodology of this program to squash all sense of free will, individuality, creative thought, and skepticism in these children? Because, that is what they will accomplish if they are successful with such blind and heavy handed tactics. It would seem that what is being placed at the highest value (or only value actually) is to make the children obedient with no emphasis being placed on the actual mental health of the children. Although they may be able to show immediate results, they are ignorant of, or cavelier about, the long term damage that this program can cause. Children who suffer from a pathological fear of abandonment should be thrilled to be awoken in the middle of the night to find that their parents have sent them away, restrained by thugs, don't you think? Children suffering from depression should react well to having their thoughts and wills invalidated, yes? Children who suffer with bouts of impulse control simply need to have their will crushed, is that the theory behind this? And here we come to the crux of the issue, there is no theory behind this. There is no methodology behind this. There has been no attention paid to conducting this first in a controlled environment with study groups. Their claim is, "hey it works." Any parent who would send their child off to a behavioural training camp with no methodology, no premise, and no history of scientific study may very well be one of the factors in that child's behavioural problems, and perhaps the child should be removed from that environment, although not to auschwitz. And here's another issue- where is the schooling worked into the schedule? These children spend at least a year with no form of academic education? That is reprehensible to say the least. And this place being called Tranquility so blatantly smacks of Orwell that I'm surprised the irony went over even their heads. |
So shy a good deed in such a weary world... |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2003 : 20:28:14 [Permalink]
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I have an unruly teen. She's 13, what else are they at that age? They obviously know better than you, they are 13 and no longer need to listen to mom.
I deal with behavioral problem in children the same way I deal with them in dogs. Patience, understanding, positive reinforcement, and the added plus when dealing with homo sapien, reason. It's just at 13 they are so very unreasonable.
edited to add:
These kinds of parents ought to be shot. Just for general purposes. |
...no one has ever found a 4.5 billion year old stone artifact (at the right geological stratum) with the words "Made by God."
No Sense of Obligation by Matt Young
"Say what you will about the sweet miracle of unquestioning faith. I consider the capacity for it terrifying and vile!"
Mother Night by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
They (Women Marines) don't have a nickname, and they don't need one. They get their basic training in a Marine atmosphere, at a Marine Post. They inherit the traditions of the Marines. They are Marines.
LtGen Thomas Holcomb, USMC
Commandant of the Marine Corps, 1943
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| Edited by - Trish on 08/04/2003 20:29:15 |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2003 : 21:42:34 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Trish
I deal with behavioral problem in children the same way I deal with them in dogs. Patience, understanding, positive reinforcement, and the added plus when dealing with homo sapien, reason. It's just at 13 they are so very unreasonable.
Funny you should say that. I've never heard anyone else say the same thing as me.
When my two were born, not liking humans or human babies even more and not knowing how to deal with them, the only thing I could think of was to treat them like dogs.
Where you and I differ is, as a teenager with my boy there is no reasoning at all....I guess you more or less said that too but I have given up. We don't talk and next year he won't be a teen anymore. Thank goodness, it's easier not to talk to adults.
I love my dog more. |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2003 : 22:00:42 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by wonkavision
A good percentage of these childrens who act out have personality or mood disorders, and such an approach will only further damage their psyche. Forcing submission with draconian tactics is not the way to help these children
Personality disorder....hum! Whatever!
Only thing I can say is, if there was a god to thank, I should get down on my knees and be greatful there wasn't anything like that when I was a kid, my parents probably would have sent me there. I've seen reports of places like that before and shutter at the thought of what I would have done or what would have been done to me.
IMO this type of place is a result of todays fast paced world, the generation of 'I want it NOW'. Everything has to be perfect.
I was the 'black sheep' of the family and today I'm the one they envy (when they are not cursing me), or so I've been told.
The point being, leave things alone, give things some time and a chance. Don't be so quick to want a solution. Things have a way of working out. Nothing is ideal, make the best of what you have.
Looking back, I gave my parents hell as my boy is doing to me now. I have more important things on my mind, he'll be ok.
Although as revenge, I might consider sending him there, heh,he. |
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ktesibios
SFN Regular
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 08/04/2003 : 23:06:23 [Permalink]
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I know how I would respond if I had the misfortune to be subjected to this kind of idiotic petty sadism masquerading as therapy: the moment I reached legal adulthood I would legally change my name and disappear, letting my parents go to their graves without ever knowing anything more of me.
That is, assuming that I had enough self control left to refrain from putting them in said graves.
The really twisted thing is that it doesn't take an advanced degree in psychology to know that adult independence isn't something that's magically conferred on you by your parents. It's something that you have to learn, and there's a certain amount of trial-and-error and (gasp) rebellion involved. I think that Len Deighton put his finger on it when he wrote that children can never love their parents as much as the parents love them, because if they did they would never leave home, and then humanity would end. Apparently some folks just can't face that, or the idea that "child" is not synonymous with "obedient little robot".
It's telling that the Kays have to hide their prison camps in third-world countries like Jamaica and Costa Rica. This suggests that what they're doing would land them in the slam if they did it within U.S. jurisdiction. And that raises an interesting possibility.
IIRC, in an effort to crack down on the exploitation of children in other countries by pedophiles going on "sex tours", Congress passed legislation making it a Federal crime for a U.S. citizen to travel abroad for the purpose of committing what would be statutory rape here, irrespective of the legalities where the act is committed . If so, it ought to be made equally illegal to transport a child out of the U.S. for the purpose of subjecting them to what would be illegal abuse here, whether or not it's legal elsewhere .
Hold just a few of the @#$%wads who hand their kids over to these disgusting sadists accountable, and the whole thing will come crashing down. Of course, you'd probably have a jillion jackleg preachers and right-wing politicians screaming "persecution"... |
"The Republican agenda is to turn the United States into a third-world shithole." -P.Z.Myers |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 08/05/2003 : 00:26:27 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by ktesibios
jackleg preachers and right-wing politicians screaming "persecution"...
What does jackleg mean? |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 08/06/2003 : 08:46:41 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Snake
quote:
Originally posted by Trish
I deal with behavioral problem in children the same way I deal with them in dogs. Patience, understanding, positive reinforcement, and the added plus when dealing with homo sapien, reason. It's just at 13 they are so very unreasonable.
Funny you should say that. I've never heard anyone else say the same thing as me.
When my two were born, not liking humans or human babies even more and not knowing how to deal with them, the only thing I could think of was to treat them like dogs.
Where you and I differ is, as a teenager with my boy there is no reasoning at all....I guess you more or less said that too but I have given up. We don't talk and next year he won't be a teen anymore. Thank goodness, it's easier not to talk to adults.
I love my dog more.
Give him a few years. When he's had to make his own way or has kids of his own, he'll understand. I just keep waiting for my kid to get old enough to understand. |
...no one has ever found a 4.5 billion year old stone artifact (at the right geological stratum) with the words "Made by God."
No Sense of Obligation by Matt Young
"Say what you will about the sweet miracle of unquestioning faith. I consider the capacity for it terrifying and vile!"
Mother Night by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
They (Women Marines) don't have a nickname, and they don't need one. They get their basic training in a Marine atmosphere, at a Marine Post. They inherit the traditions of the Marines. They are Marines.
LtGen Thomas Holcomb, USMC
Commandant of the Marine Corps, 1943
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