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audie123
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
 Posted - 03/11/2004 : 19:25:11
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Throughout the ages people have risen who demonstrated the sine que non of being human. Via human intellect they demonstrated the creative and shall I say, mystical energy that flows from the frontal lobes of the human brain. With that frontal lobe, far more developed than any animal, they were able to harness the diverse powers of their brains and offer us glimpses of holy genius.
When people ask me for proof of God (whatever "god" is, I haven't a clue and once I figure out God how could it ever be God?) I often remind them of Plato, Aristotle, Galileo, Newton, Einstein, Da Vinci etc. I state if there is a god then these figures (and many more I dare say) are god's (or the gods') messengers. They are apostles of possibility, disciples of curiosity.
Could it be that to tap into the power of our mind is a holy act? Can we imagine that if there is some force out there that there may be a connection between that force and our minds?
Could it be that reason, in and of itself, is a religion? That harnessing our mind to think, to create, to stretch our imaginations, are forms of worship?
Think about and suppose we are created in the image of "God." If that is a physical image surely we would have met this being by now. I dare say that if such an "image" exists then our brains are that image, and the designer is worshiped whenever we use it to rise above ignorance and myth.
Einstein stated that man is most free when he is free to think. I would add, that I am most spiritual when my mind is free to contemplate, to wonder, to invent, to consider, to debate, and to doubt and question. These are our spiritual acts.
If reason is religion, skepticism is our act of communion. It is in skepticism that we step out of established ideas and explore new territories of our potential. When we allow our minds to be inquisitive we have baptized ourselves into unlimited possibilities.
When that happens, I feel quite holy.
I welcome your input.
Peace,
Audie
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ConsequentAtheist
SFN Regular
641 Posts |
Posted - 03/11/2004 : 20:33:48 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by audie123
If reason is religion, skepticism is our act of communion.
And if reason isn't religion? Defining/describing reason as religion seems to me no less superfluous than the Pantheist describing the universe as God. |
For the philosophical naturalist, the rejection of supernaturalism is a case of "death by a thousand cuts." -- Barbara Forrest, Ph.D. |
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audie123
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2004 : 03:33:59 [Permalink]
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In using the word "religion" I speak of the potential of human transcendence, with reason, that is, the process of rational investigation, as the means, ergo, skepticism as the mode. The so-called "supernatural" is found to the human mind, and observable reality, or the material, the subject of the method, human curiosity. Therefore, the term "religion," was an expression to define man's attempts to honor that which they did not understand. Reason as religion, is a way of honoring that which we are investigating apart from constraints of language (eg. God, angels, theism, a-theism, etc.).
It is one thing to deny the existence of God (or gods), it is another to deny the words of human language that have been used in human history to account for that which was not understood and/or that which was perceived to be more powerful and/or that which was used to avoid personal responsibility.
Since "God" (or gods) and all supernatural language is one of the and/or's above, there is no discomfort in recognizing and affirming the utility of human language in so far as reason is given its due course to enable understanding of "what is."
My daughter once told me that rain was the result of "the angels crying." I asked her to keep thinking and exploring the nature of rain so that she could better understand what she was claiming to be a supernatural event. Since she was not criticized for harboring a nonsensical belief she felt more free to investigate the matter.
At a later rain, she explained to me this fascinating process of weather. The so-called supernatural had been replaced via creative inquiry (and dad's positive skepticism) and found to be quite an interersting phenomena to her.
As I have stated to my students in the past, the supernatural is the natural yet to be understood. A student once challenged me and said I was professing Atheism. My response? If there is a God, there could be no supernatural as any act of God that is pereceive above and beyond his or her creation, is natural to the nature of man's definition of god and therefore not "super-nature" (above nature) but rather the routine natural to a god. Therefore, if there is a God, he, she, or it, is the ultimate atheist.
I then left her with this statement to consider, It is one thing to ask if I believe in God, yet another to ask, "Does God believe in you?" |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2004 : 04:42:29 [Permalink]
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I'm not sure what you're saying here, Audie. Are you saying that there is a god, and therefore that there are "mystical" and "spiritual" things?
Are you using the term religion as Tim Gorski does below?
http://church.freethought.org/intro.html
To some who are without belief in the supernatural, the very terms "church" and "religion" have come to mean what they have been unable to honestly accept. It is the position of The North Texas Church of Freethought that this is an unnecessary handicap. A church is merely a group of individuals and families among whom there is a consensus about the relationship of human beings to one another and to the larger world.
Unbelievers simply hold that the world outside of human thought, feeling, and imagination is best known through the tools of evidence and reason. Similarly, religion is no more than an assembly of beliefs, attitudes, feelings, and behaviors with which people relate to one another and the universe. Freethinkers simply cannot find a place for the supernatural in this.
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I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2004 : 09:52:29 [Permalink]
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I think you are using the words "religion" and "spirituality" interchangably. "Religion" is a set of beliefs which assume a higher intelligent power. "Spirituality" tends to indicate a feeling of connectedness to the universe or diety.
Therefore, an atheistic astronomer can have a spiritual moment when looking at the stars.
Reason = Religion. No. Religion requires a belief in a being which cannot be empirically measured. Reason requires logical proof and/or empirical evidence.
It is sometimes postulated by those who seek to give a supreme being credit for their own achievements that God did these things and they were only the vessel. A God is not required for reason. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2004 : 10:48:39 [Permalink]
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ADJECTIVE: 1. Of, relating to, consisting of, or having the nature of spirit; not tangible or material. See synonyms at immaterial. 2. Of, concerned with, or affecting the soul. 3. Of, from, or relating to God; deific. 4. Of or belonging to a church or religion; sacred. 5. Relating to or having the nature of spirits or a spirit; supernatural.
NOUN: 1a. A religious folk song of African-American origin. b. A work composed in imitation of such a song. 2. Religious, spiritual, or ecclesiastical matters. Often used in the plural.
ETYMOLOGY: Middle English, from Old French spirituel, from Latin spritulis, of breathing, spiritual, from spritus, breath. See spirit.
OTHER FORMS: spiri·tu·al·ly —ADVERB
spiri·tu·al·ness —NOUN
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I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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ConsequentAtheist
SFN Regular
641 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2004 : 17:39:42 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by audie123
In using the word "religion" I speak of the potential of human transcendence, with reason, that is, the process of rational investigation, as the means, ergo, ...
quote:
'That's a great deal to make one word mean,' Alice said in a thoughtful tone.
'When I make a word do a lot of work like that,' said Humpty Dumpty, 'I always pay it extra.'
'Oh!' said Alice. She was too much puzzled to make any other remark.
'Ah, you should see 'em come round me of a Saturday night,' Humpty Dumpty went on, wagging his head gravely from side to side, 'for to get their wages, you know.'
(Alice didn't venture to ask what he paid them with; so you see I can't tell you.)
- Through The Looking Glass by Lewis Carroll
What, precisely, do you think you're transcending, and where do you think you'll be when you get there? |
For the philosophical naturalist, the rejection of supernaturalism is a case of "death by a thousand cuts." -- Barbara Forrest, Ph.D. |
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