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Computer Org
Skeptic Friend
392 Posts |
 Posted - 05/17/2004 : 14:47:17 [Permalink]
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Thanks. (Sarasota) Would you somehow tell Linda at JREF.
(This might be serious business. I suggested she log everything in sight and give it to some security-type. I suggested FBI --- for only the second time in my life.)
Thanks again. (Supper time here so will be leaving the Library soon.)
Sorry for the trouble ----- but then what computer-person doesn't like REAL weirdness, particularily a computer-skeptic.  |
Do thou amend thy face, and I'll amend my life. --Falstaff |
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Computer Org
Skeptic Friend
392 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2004 : 14:49:26 [Permalink]
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| Thanks. I'll send her the info. (Any ideas as to "How?") |
Do thou amend thy face, and I'll amend my life. --Falstaff |
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Vic Daring
New Member
49 Posts |
Posted - 05/17/2004 : 21:56:57 [Permalink]
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CO, You should be able to just reply any info to Linda's e-mail. In my limited dealings with Linda and the other Admins and moderators at JREF, I've found them to be very fair, reasonable folks.
I can tell you the reason they've had to tighten the screws on registrations is a few banned members have registered for the sole purpose of spamming/mass posting the board and, from my limited understanding, some have taken extraordinary measures to hide their identities. Randi does make a few enemies.
If you need me to vouch for you, let me know and I'll drop Linda an e-mail or a PM or something and explain where you popped up from. |
The man in black fled across the desert, and the gunslinger followed. |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 05/18/2004 : 06:11:13 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Vic Daring
Don't know how many people here post or read at the James Randi Forum (www.randi.org), but if you do, you know things have gotten very weird there.
I'll continue to read and post at JREF as long as its available, but the hubbub led me to explore other skeptic communities and I found this one and I think I'll grab me a chair.
Who knows, you may be seeing others wandering in as well.
So I guess that's a, "Hello, pleased to meet ya," post, which I usually abhor but, well, there it is.
Howdy, Vic. Welcome to the board.
Quite a few of us here hold Randi in high esteem and we recognize the current spate of problems as the unfortunate result of message board evolution whereby a reorginazation is sometimes in order, banning of trolls and ad-hominem muckrackers, and seperation of subject matter has to be enforced.
It's just a normal life cycle for a EBBS. Once he gets it settled, the normal denizens will probably return, but it might not be very much fun for the next couple of months while he gets things sorted out. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Computer Org
Skeptic Friend
392 Posts |
Posted - 05/19/2004 : 07:39:47 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Vic Daring
CO, You should be able to just reply any info to Linda's e-mail. In my limited dealings with Linda and the other Admins and moderators at JREF, I've found them to be very fair, reasonable folks.
I can tell you the reason they've had to tighten the screws on registrations is a few banned members have registered for the sole purpose of spamming/mass posting the board and, from my limited understanding, some have taken extraordinary measures to hide their identities. Randi does make a few enemies.
If you need me to vouch for you, let me know and I'll drop Linda an e-mail or a PM or something and explain where you popped up from.
Many thanks. It has all worked out; I'm now a member on the JREF boards.
When Valiant Dancer says "Quite a few of us here hold Randi in high esteem . . . ." he's very accurate. Just earlier I refered to M. Randi as "ArchSkeptic" which is about as high a compliment as I'm capable of. (Well, maybe "SuperSkeptic" . . . . but, actually, I think that an "ArchSkeptic" is an even better skeptic that a "SuperSkeptic".  )
quote:
Originally posted by @tomic
quote:
Originally posted by Computer Org
(I could bet BANNED from the Public Library's computer privileges for looking at the uncensored photos from A.G. Prison.)
Now that's a scary thought. If you did get banned for real research on a very newsworthy subject and such a thing happened I would think you'd have grounds for legal action.
@
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Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law!
There ought to be limits to freedom - George W. Bush
If you think that George W. Bush plays rough with freedom in the Union, you should see Florida under his younger brother Jeb. Florida is designed for, and run by, the land developers and is, in many ways, more fascist than was Germany under the NAZIs.
(Not that I mean that Jeb has changed the level of fascism since taking over as governor; I think that Florida always has been, and probably always will be, inherently fascist. I've read (and heard) about things happening in the Florida State Pennitentury at Stark that make anything we've seen or heard about in A.G. Prison in Iraq look namby-pamby by comparrison. Werry, werry bad place for Freedom and/or Liberty, Florida is.) |
Do thou amend thy face, and I'll amend my life. --Falstaff |
| Edited by - Computer Org on 05/19/2004 08:13:58 |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2004 : 13:03:11 [Permalink]
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quote:
I become fascinated and deeply skeptical of the 'blind', vigourous skeptical attack against any concept, whether ghosts or otherwise.
There are a great many skeptical topics where I refuse to waste my time in debunking an obvious fraud for the umpteenth time. I prefer the positive positions of science (particularly the so-called "hard" sciences) and will leave the silliness to those who have more time on their hands. Nobody is going to change the minds of people who believe in "extraterrestrial" visitations and it is a waste of my time (and theirs) to argue with them about nonsense which, according to experts, seems to have begun at the same time with the then ultra-secret "Skyhook" program. I have friends who are true believers, but I will not get into a discussion of Roswell (or any other alien spacecraft ideas with any of them. There is this desire to believe in UFOs and nothing will change their thinking (or, oppositely, mine).
It is similar to the "We never went to the Moon" stuff. There is no arguing with any of of them about that, either. Arguing with such people simply wastes my valuable time (and theirs). I do not like proselytizing. For the same reason, I follow my non-proselytizing ways with others. The world will not end for me if people believe in flying saucers or other such nonsense.
ljbrs |
"Innumerable suns exist; innumerable earths revolve about these suns in a manner similar to the way the seven planets revolve around our sun. Living beings inhabit these worlds."
Giordano Bruno
(Burned at the stake by the Roman Catholic Church Inquisition in 1600) |
| Edited by - ljbrs on 05/31/2004 13:14:57 |
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Badger
Skeptic Friend
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2004 : 13:50:46 [Permalink]
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Hey, Vic.
Welcome.
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If you think it's work, you're doing it wrong. |
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2004 : 18:09:49 [Permalink]
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quote:
I do know that two things are happening in "skepticism". First, and most odious, it has become popular to be skeptical. Nothing is more disasterous than for the "in crowd" to glom onto a turf.
quote:
Second, and a good thing IMO, is that skepticism has sort of gone the way of Buddhism: Toward the Middle Path. That is to say: In the olde days of yore, one was skeptical in one direction, usually against some piece of logical garbage. In this sort of "New Wave Skepticism" (purely my phrasing), one tends to be skeptical toward both directional extremes.
Lukewarm skepticism is not skepticism. There is no half-way point where people can ignore evidence in favor of agreement among their friends. The "New Wave Skepticism" is simply credulous thinking in disguise. I do not see how skepticism could ever become popular. Going halfway with one's skepticism does not count as skepticism since much baloney is left intact. In a way, however, being halfway skeptical is better than being a true believer, and perhaps it is a beginning toddler's step in the right direction. It is not a place to become complacent, however.
Therefore, tentatively welcome the newcomers and hope that they grow in their objectivity. Give them a chance. I can imagine that it is very, very difficult to give up beliefs learned as a child.
I never had those beliefs (they tried), so it has been much easier for me. I was a skeptic for as long as I can remember -- certainly much before I was four years of age. I only feel truly comfortable with scientifically-minded people, including skeptics.
ljbrs   |
"Innumerable suns exist; innumerable earths revolve about these suns in a manner similar to the way the seven planets revolve around our sun. Living beings inhabit these worlds."
Giordano Bruno
(Burned at the stake by the Roman Catholic Church Inquisition in 1600) |
| Edited by - ljbrs on 05/31/2004 18:20:16 |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 05/31/2004 : 19:07:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
I do not see how skepticism could ever become popular.
I find that being skeptical almost always means taking an unpopular postition unless you happen to be with a group of skeptics and even then you have no guarantee of holding a popular opinion.
@ |
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law!
Sportsbettingacumen.com: The science of sports betting |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2004 : 09:48:18 [Permalink]
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Hey Vic.
Haven't been on the JREF fora for quite awhile. Didn't know they were attempting to split the social posts from JREF pertinent subjects. I thought they'd had that under control when they reinstituted Banter (or whatever they called it besides Banter). Like I said, it's been awhile. |
...no one has ever found a 4.5 billion year old stone artifact (at the right geological stratum) with the words "Made by God."
No Sense of Obligation by Matt Young
"Say what you will about the sweet miracle of unquestioning faith. I consider the capacity for it terrifying and vile!"
Mother Night by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
They (Women Marines) don't have a nickname, and they don't need one. They get their basic training in a Marine atmosphere, at a Marine Post. They inherit the traditions of the Marines. They are Marines.
LtGen Thomas Holcomb, USMC
Commandant of the Marine Corps, 1943
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Luke T.
Skeptic Friend
140 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 10:08:38 [Permalink]
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Hello. I just registered here because someone (my wife) saw this topic while surfing around and I feel I need to correct a couple things. :D
I was a moderator on the JREF forum until very recently. I resigned, along with another moderator and a forum Admin, over this whole mess.
But I need to make this a test post just to see if I have worked the registration process here correctly and this goes through.
I will give the whole story in my next post. |
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Luke T.
Skeptic Friend
140 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 10:35:44 [Permalink]
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Okay, this seems to be working.
All right. First, the Iraqi photo topic had nothing to do with the current situation except for the fact that Hal Bidlack chose to use that topic to voice his ongoing frustration with the forum. Hal Bidlack was assigned complete control over the fate of the forum by James Randi a while ago, and tinkered with it in ways that upset a lot of people. For several months (since at least last November), he has expressed publicly and privately that he thinks most of the topics on the forum are not worthy of the JREF mission and need to be purged. He actually did purge a lot of topics a few months ago.
Hal has been toying with the idea of “splitting” the forum for a while. He feels that those topics which give the place a sense of community don't belong there. Like any community, people posted topics about their kids, photos of their cats, talked about what they had for lunch, and so on. This drove Hal nuts. And you can quote me on that. “Hal went nuts.”
The Iraqi photo topic was one in which a forum member displayed the now infamous prisoner photos and asked people to caption them with humours captions. Admittedly, this was in bad taste. The topic was actually censored by the acting Admin, Pyrrho. Pyrrho had actually been doing a great job of getting the forum on a decent track. Anyway, someone started another topic criticizing Pyrrho for censoring the Iraqi prisoner photo topic, and that was when Hal stepped in to announce that he was enacting his plans to split the forum. A new forum, skepticalcommunity.com, would be for all topics not related to JREF, and the JREF forum would only be for serious topics.
Many excuses have been given for why this was all necessary, all of them total bunk, in my opinion. The latest excuse is that JREF is in the process of legal proceedings of libel against someone and they need the forum to look nice and pretty and formal.
Anyway, after Hal's bombshell, Randi himself made a rare post stating that no such changes were occurring, all was well. This sent Hal into a tailspin of depression whereupon he began making private and public statements about harming himself and resigning not just from the forum, but from the JREF board of directors as well. This was the culmination of many statements made by him that he hated the forum and the people in it.
The next day, Hal was suddenly on top. Randi had given him the green light to proceed with his plans. It was all very bizarre.
Hal made a public statement to the effect that 95 to 97 percent of the topics on the forum were not deserving to be on the forum. Thus, the “proud to be a 97 percenter” protest movement was born, and myself and another moderator and Pyrrho all resigned.
Skepticalcommunity.com is now online, but supposedly completely unconnected to JREF. It is being run by Girl6 from the JREF forum. An excellent choice. She calls herself “skeptica” on the new forum. Come on over!
The JREF forum has not yet made the transition to the new style, whatever that may be. Not even Hal has an idea of what he wants it to be. Like I said, all very bizarre.
Many JREF forum members left months ago during some of Hal's other shenanigans and formed up on mu.nu/forums in Renata's World. Renata is also a member of the JREF forum.
So the diaspora has begun. JREF forum members are scattered to the winds.
I have been a member of the JREF forum since two weeks after it was born. Three years ago. Long before Hal came on the scene, and long before any kind of censorship began occurring. The Wild West days. I no longer post there. I am waiting to see what happens to it. If it is just a piece of dead wood when Hal is done with it, I may never return.
It's all about heavy censorship and an unstable personality.
Feel free to quote me on anything I have said. I have been completely open and upfront with Hal for months about what I think of what he is doing, and everyone kn |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 10:36:48 [Permalink]
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We would appreciate an accurate accounting Luke and I'm sorry if we got anything wrong but there is a tremendous amount of material over there about the forum issues and there's no way I had time to read all of it.
@ |
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law!
Sportsbettingacumen.com: The science of sports betting |
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Luke T.
Skeptic Friend
140 Posts |
Posted - 06/08/2004 : 11:26:32 [Permalink]
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There is a lot of discussion, @tomic, in that you are so right. I understand if it is all confusing and hard to follow. Hell, it is confusing to those of us who have been in the middle of it. 
And since I left there, I have no idea what else has changed. I've signed up on the unaffiliated skepticalcommunity forum and have been on renata's forum since it began last year. Those are my new internet homes now.
It's just a crying shame to see a really great thing like the JREF forum be torn down and rebuilt in Hal's image.
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