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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 12/03/2004 : 04:23:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
Just keep dust in your eyes and your minds off the truth!
I seem to recall the Bible having something to say about that; something to the effect of; "Don't sweat the dust in your neighbor's eyes until you backhoe the gravel pit out of your own."
Verlch, you wouldn't know the 'truth' if it leaped up and bit you on the bag!
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 08:43:11 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
quote:
Just keep dust in your eyes and your minds off the truth!
I seem to recall the Bible having something to say about that; something to the effect of; "Don't sweat the dust in your neighbor's eyes until you backhoe the gravel pit out of your own."
Verlch, you wouldn't know the 'truth' if it leaped up and bit you on the bag!
You are quite correct. It does say that we can only remove the splinter from our neighbor's eye when we remove the plank from our own. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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TG
Skeptic Friend
USA
121 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 09:49:08 [Permalink]
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Dr. T. N. Tahmisian was a physiologist at Argonne National Laboratory in the mid-fifties whose primary field of interest was the effects of radiation on insects.
http://www.anl.gov:80/Science_and_Technology/History/hopperscap.html
Based on the lack of any other info on him, the quote provided by verlch appears to be the only notable thing he ever uttered. |
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Storm
SFN Regular
USA
708 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 10:38:48 [Permalink]
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What if Creationism does Exist and Evolution is it's evidence?
Does that make any sense?
What if a God, Spirit, Force, did exist and Science was how it worked...
How it thought...
So through humans it manifests and comes through us in Science and it's Theories...
Order.. |
Storm |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 11:01:20 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Storm
What if Creationism does Exist and Evolution is it's evidence?
Does that make any sense?
What if a God, Spirit, Force, did exist and Science was how it worked...
How it thought...
So through humans it manifests and comes through us in Science and it's Theories...
Order..
That's one of the Old Earth Creationist's speculations. Don't let YECs hear you voice it, they go insane at the mention.
But once again, there's no supporting evidence.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Storm
SFN Regular
USA
708 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 11:21:30 [Permalink]
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But what if the evidence is in the methodology and theories of the Applications of Science?
Is there a difference between Creationists and Old Earth Creationists? Do tell. |
Storm |
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Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 12:15:58 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Storm
But what if the evidence is in the methodology and theories of the Applications of Science?
Is there a difference between Creationists and Old Earth Creationists? Do tell.
Young-Earth creationists believe the Earth was created 6000 years ago, contrary to all paleontologic evidence we have, and that the fossils are the results of animals and plants killed in the Flood.
I'm not sure, but I'd guess OECs at least agree that Earth is really, really old. |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 13:50:26 [Permalink]
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Storm said
quote:
But what if the evidence is in the methodology and theories of the Applications of Science?
It sounds like you are saying the order in the universe is God.
That is akin to the christians saying, "look around you at the mircle of life - that is proof of God". Just because there is order in the universe (ie physical laws) that does not necessitate a God.
Maybe there is a God and he loves us
Maybe there is a God and he hates us
Maybe there is a God and he doesn't care
Maybe there is a God, but the only ones who have got it right are the mormons.
Maybe there is no God
Maybe my cat is God
Maybe the owl hiding in a $1 bill is God
Maybe Verlich is God
There is no empirical evidence for any of these, therefore the skeptic can only say - "gee that is an interesting idea, where is the evidence?".
I have no idea if there is a God, I only know that there is no evidence of Him/Her/It.
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If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 14:17:46 [Permalink]
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OECs have a number of claims. The most common one is that the days of the 6 day creation were atually multiple millions of years long. How they reconcile this with the Bible is a mystery to me.
The Intelligent Design movement is the bastard child of these ideas.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 14:33:05 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
OECs have a number of claims. The most common one is that the days of the 6 day creation were atually multiple millions of years long. How they reconcile this with the Bible is a mystery to me.
The Intelligent Design movement is the bastard child of these ideas.
It actually comes from several Biblical passages dealing with God saying that one day for Him being as a thousand years for man and an undeterminate amount of time passing between the void and God saying let there be light.
It's twisted, but it works out as OEC recognize the context of ancient people's understanding of large numbers and posit that this was a limitation of the authors of the Bible. (It's why YEC hate them.) |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Peptide
Skeptic Friend
USA
69 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 14:36:04 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by TG
Dr. T. N. Tahmisian was a physiologist at Argonne National Laboratory in the mid-fifties whose primary field of interest was the effects of radiation on insects.
http://www.anl.gov:80/Science_and_Technology/History/hopperscap.html
Based on the lack of any other info on him, the quote provided by verlch appears to be the only notable thing he ever uttered.
And more importantly, if all it took for something to be true was the opinion of a scientist then all of our houses would be powered by cold fusion. Somehow, in the creationist world science is ruled by fiat instead of evidence.
Quotes mean nothing without the evidence that lead to the opinion. |
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moakley
SFN Regular
USA
1888 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 20:34:24 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
Just keep dust in your eyes and your minds off the truth!
And once you have your absolute truth, as verlch does, reason is no longer necessary. |
Life is good
Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 12/03/2004 : 21:44:48 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
OECs have a number of claims. The most common one is that the days of the 6 day creation were atually multiple millions of years long. How they reconcile this with the Bible is a mystery to me.
The Intelligent Design movement is the bastard child of these ideas.
The OEC's clearly can't make up their minds...lol...They might as well as be spinless and just stay out of the debate and continue sitting on the fence! |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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| Edited by - verlch on 12/03/2004 21:45:43 |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2004 : 01:22:26 [Permalink]
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quote:
Posted by StormWhat if Creationism does Exist and Evolution is it's evidence?
Does that make any sense?
No.
When you multiply entities without need, then you are failing to apply a basic methodology of science.
There is no need for a supernatural element to explain evolution.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 12/04/2004 : 02:24:36 [Permalink]
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quote:
The OEC's clearly can't make up their minds...lol...They might as well as be spinless and just stay out of the debate and continue sitting on the fence!
Except for the ID blitherers, that seems to be pretty much what they are doing.
It is merely an attempt to reconcile the Bible with the available geological evidence. Whether or not it is working depends upon who one asks. At least it is closer to the facts than YEC and more honest then ID.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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