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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
 Posted - 12/06/2004 : 17:59:01 [Permalink]
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Storm wrote:quote:
The Vampire of Hollywood who is fictional is played out in the characters of the present Goth Age.
But, the goths aren't "real" vampires in that they don't derive any supernatural abilities from their blood-drinking (those who do). For the most part, they're a bunch of kids romanticizing the vampire idea, and trying to put themselves into the stories they enjoy by living them. Of course, they fail, since the blood-drinking doesn't do anything except provide a tiny bit of nourishment, with a much higher risk to health than, say, a hamburger. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Storm
SFN Regular
USA
708 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 18:33:50 [Permalink]
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Whoever said that a vampire was only a supernatural figure. That is Supernatural hogwash. Although thee were many there were also real cases of blood monster human beings drinking blood. The only diiference is that these Goths are alive and not undead. But the deinking of the blood is very much the same as actual vampies. In fact as you look through folklore you will also find that the vampire was also a sexual creature often returning to make love to his wife. |
Storm |
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 18:51:45 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Storm
Have you read any other than skeptical on the subject? or are you Just a debunker H. Humbert
Actually, it was reading stories about the supernatural which led me to research possible causes. After much study, I found that only skeptic literature ever really offered any plausible answers.
I believe that is the difference between you and me. I sought to understand these things. You seek merely to perpetuate them. You are intrigued by the way in which these stories kindle your imagination. I wanted to separate fact from fantasy and find out what was actually going on.
Thus, you reject any sensible conclusion out of hand, because you desperately desire that something, anything out there exists which disrupts the mundanity of life. You don't accept reasonable explanations because you are not a reasonable person. You seek excitement and adventure, and so are more than willing to abandon critical thought for gleeful credulity.
That's fine, of course. Where you went wrong was when you began to take yourself and your subject a little too seriously. Somewhere along the line you forgot that it was a game, and now you expect science to provide rational explanations for your irrational fantasies.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
| Edited by - H. Humbert on 12/06/2004 18:54:36 |
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R.Wreck
SFN Regular
USA
1191 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 18:52:18 [Permalink]
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quote:
Just do not compare me to Verlch
OK, but I have observed that your posts have a certain verlchian quality. The verlchiferous denial of actual scientific knowledge. The verlchilacious insistence that just because it can be imagined, it must exist. A treasure trove of verlchovian lunatic fringe web sites as references. And a truly verlchanian penchant for jumping from one unsupported assertion to another. But I'm sure you're really nothing like verlch. |
The foundation of morality is to . . . give up pretending to believe that for which there is no evidence, and repeating unintelligible propositions about things beyond the possibliities of knowledge.
T. H. Huxley
The Cattle Prod of Enlightened Compassion
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 18:55:33 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by R.Wreck
OK, but I have observed that your posts have a certain verlchian quality. The verlchiferous denial of actual scientific knowledge. The verlchilacious insistence that just because it can be imagined, it must exist. A treasure trove of verlchovian lunatic fringe web sites as references. And a truly verlchanian penchant for jumping from one unsupported assertion to another. But I'm sure you're really nothing like verlch.
I nominate this as post of the year.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
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Storm
SFN Regular
USA
708 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 20:11:52 [Permalink]
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H.
It is not only about imagination. It is about real documented facts read the great book by Paul Barber I mentioned. If you do not see what I mean at least I can hope you will like the section on the exact physic of the decomposition of the body.
Don't misinterpret my perpetuation for not seeking to understand these phenomenon.
My biffest goal is to understand. It is just that I am not as Skeptical as you.
There is such phenomenon that dusrupt mundane life. But you know that H. Humbert. Read Claude Bernards Anomolist definition.
Oh and I never said it was not natural these phenomenon. Surely the decomposition and the ignorance of how it works can lead explantions for the phenomen but there are some that are some that are not just ignorannce of decomposition. And it is in those documented unexplained phenomenon and anomolies that my interest lay.
Are we really so different you and I H. Humbert |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 21:20:13 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Storm
Whoever said that a vampire was only a supernatural figure. That is Supernatural hogwash. Although thee were many there were also real cases of blood monster human beings drinking blood.
Well, if you wanted to talk about real-life blood drinking, why not just say so, instead of bringing the term "vampire," which is loaded with mythology and the supernatural, into the discussion? Conversely, if you're sure that goths aren't undead, why bring them into a discussion where you ask "But what has been labeled Vampire does it really exist?" Goths haven't been labeled vampires by anyone but themselves, and they are piss-poor vampire wanna-bes.
Do some people drink the blood of others? Sure. Whatever creams your Twinkie. Nothing likely "to stimulate the mind, to contemplate the thoughts, to apply Science, Critical thinking, and to defend convictions" there. Might as well ask "does blue exist?"quote:
But the deinking of the blood is very much the same as actual vampies.
Define "actual vampire." You've said, at least twice now, that you're not talking about anything supernatural, and talking about real-life blood drinking is a pretty limited and boring subject, so I'm forced to ask you just what the heck we're supposed to be discussing in this thread? What were you intending "to stimulate the mind, to contemplate the thoughts, to apply Science, Critical thinking, and to defend convictions?"quote:
In fact as you look through folklore you will also find that the vampire was also a sexual creature often returning to make love to his wife.
Yeah, some goths get all hot-n-heavy over blood drinking, also. Your point? Would you like us next to critically examine and stimulate our minds over spanking fetishes? How about coprophilia and/or "water sports?" Autoerotic asphyxiation? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 22:23:59 [Permalink]
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quote:
Autoerotic asphyxiation
Is that another way of saying 'choking the chicken'?
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If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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way
New Member
USA
35 Posts |
Posted - 12/06/2004 : 23:57:00 [Permalink]
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| This is the most tripped out, woo woo thread I've read in a long time. I second the nomination for verlchian "post of the year", I'm still laughing. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2004 : 02:04:14 [Permalink]
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The problem that we have in this thread is that vampirism and lycanthropy (werewolves) are very interesting subjects with a rich history in folklore. Second to gods & related items, they are some of our most venerable myths and they are still believed today, in one form or another, world wide. I don't consider the topic woo-woo at all. It's more like a study of legend and human nature, and it is very well documented.
Unfortunatly, we have not been treating it as such. Storm has finally given us a subject that, while involving the supernatural, is not nearly as whacko as her previous ones, once you seine out the bullshit. Even the 'goth' nonsense and Hollywoo-woo has a bit to add.
This one is worth some serious research for serious documents related to it.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2004 : 05:44:09 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Storm
In fact as you look through folklore you will also find that the vampire was also a sexual creature often returning to make love to his wife.
Those are called inccubi (male) and succubi (female). |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2004 : 08:19:27 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by furshur
Storm I have noticed that there are many stories about this guy named Santa. Apparently, there are many documented cases of him performing supernatural acts (movies, books, legends). Do you believe in him? Surely stories this widespread couldn't just be made up. Right?
By the way Verlich have you noticed the similarity between Santa and Satan. Santa draws our attention away from the 'true' meaning of christmas just as Satan does.
Kinda SCARY, isn't it???
Oh, but the proof is there. Santa is an ANAGRAM of Satan.
Of course, the evil Freemasons are behind it to get our children.
(snicker) |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2004 : 08:26:53 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by furshur
quote:
Autoerotic asphyxiation
Is that another way of saying 'choking the chicken'?
No, but people who practice this particular fettish too long have other names. Denaturizing human flesh.
It is a sexual fettish whereby, to prolong coitus, one partner strangles the other breifly. Due to the nature of the sexual act, it is very dangerous and some people have died due to it. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
| Edited by - Valiant Dancer on 12/07/2004 08:27:52 |
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Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2004 : 08:43:12 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Storm
H.
It is not only about imagination. It is about real documented facts read the great book by Paul Barber I mentioned. If you do not see what I mean at least I can hope you will like the section on the exact physic of the decomposition of the body.
Don't misinterpret my perpetuation for not seeking to understand these phenomenon.
Well, I don't know what, exactly, you're referring to, but the advice still stands: don't trust everything you read. Some of those documented evidences may seem very convincing, but not be at all real. Daniken, for instance. Sometimes, an apple is just an apple and a dead body's just a dead body. |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 12/07/2004 : 09:02:11 [Permalink]
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quote:
Storm said
That is Supernatural hogwash. Although thee were many there were also real cases of blood monster human beings drinking blood. The only diiference is that these Goths are alive and not undead.
This is one of the funniest things I've read in a while. The only difference is "goths are ALIVE AND NOT UNDEAD".
Yeah that is just a minor point...
I have assumed of coure that the term 'undead' refers to the walking dead as seen in movies such as "Plan 9 from Outerspace" and does not mean 'not dead'.
I think I see a similarity between Storm, Verlich, Fundies and the like; they live very very exciting lives.
Storm and her ilk believe people can do actual black magic. There are ghosts, spirits and UFOs all around us. Storm is sure that There is more going on than meets the eye...
Verlich is sure there are conspiracies that involve human sacrifice, demons, and secret societies. He is trying to save us, he is one of the few that can see the truth, as if he is living in the "Invasion of the body snatchers" or something.
Fundies know that miracles occur all of the time. Demons are trying to decieve you and steal your children. The second coming is imminent. They have to save the world from the flesh and blood devil that is out there. If they are strong one day soon they will fly up through the air and live for ever.
This is all pretty exciting stuff and it sure beats the hell out of the reality of being a general contractor or a pet grief counsler.
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If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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