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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard
USA
3834 Posts |
 Posted - 05/07/2005 : 01:36:24
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quote:
Originally posted by sweetmiracle in the Creation/Evolution forum
For a non-US take on this, check out http://www.spiked-online.com/Articles/0000000CA910.htm.
"The connection here to the culture surrounding alternative medicine, or those parts of the environmental movement whose distrust of big business and government becomes focused around the idea of a scientific establishment that is covering up the evidence, is clearer than a connection to old-fashioned Christianity."
It's interesting you should bring this up because I've been pondering the disconnect around this very issue.
Here we have the religious right wing which usually includes more from the "Bible is literal" group, totally unscientific and proudly anti-intellectual. Yet there are supposedly more college graduates, (business degrees?, I'm not sure), among Republicans than Democrats.
Then you have the left radical fringe that includes an awful lot of folks who reject the science of medicine in favor of various snake oils peddled for the same corporate profits, a point which usually misses them. The left often includes the crowd that buys into many a ludicrous government conspiracy and tends to include the UFO, crop circle and other paranormal believers. Yet the right claims the left has all the "intellectual elites" in its ranks. And I think it's safe to say the Democrats are more formally aligned with the side of science and evolution in the classroom than the Republicans as a whole.
So here's a strange take on this situation. The majority on the right are the educated business folks who primed up the religious base to gain political power. But it may be backfiring as the religious fanatics fill the ranks a bit too quickly and overtake the educated majority.
While on the left we have the educated majority that understand science but the more flaky fringe claim the left side as well. When one tries to take the evidence based world approach the folks from the fringes join in and drown out the scientific positions with their own nonsense.
I have been quite discouraged to hear unsupported conspiracy nonsense on both Air America and Democracy Now radio stations. On Air America they had the 'university chemist' who goes around giving speeches that the mercury in your tooth fillings cause Alzheimers. On Democracy Now they sucked up the story from the AP reporter who wrote a piece implying researchers at NIH used foster kids for studying AIDS drugs after making some deal with the states involved. The truth in that story was the program wasn't well run but there was zero evidence any child was 'experimented on' in the way the author claimed. (If anyone is interested I'll copy my posts from the Mike Malloy Show's forum about the truth of the story.)
My pondering of these interactions has brought me to the conclusion I need to keep a clear separation of the religious fanatics anti-science and the average Republican's take on science. It's so easy to lump them all together. There is a big split between the intellectual Democrats and the fringe Democrats so why not a similar split among Republicans? I have been failing to give them credit for potential awareness of science along with their clever awareness of marketing and business. I wonder if there is anything to tap into there in the struggle to keep the human mindset above the level of superstition, conspiracy and myth.
Told you I was in a weird mood tonight.
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Shacal
Skeptic Friend
USA
51 Posts |
Posted - 05/11/2005 : 15:32:05 [Permalink]
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| I would be interested in a link to the Mike Malloy forum thread. I would be interested to see how other members of the forum responded to your position. |
"The problem with communication is the illusion that we have accomplished it" |
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bloody_peasant
Skeptic Friend
USA
139 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2005 : 05:32:33 [Permalink]
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quote:
The majority on the right are the educated business folks who primed up the religious base to gain political power.
I don't know if I necessarily agree with this, as I think the majority on the right are educated business folks who are also part of the religious fundamentalist base. Being educated in business, in no way educates one for critical thinking, at least beyond what it takes to make a profit.
Sure there probably is a minority of educated right wingers who are closet atheist or at least not literal fundamentalist. I think they are in the minority number-wise, but probably are in the majority, $$ wise and power/influence wise. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2005 : 08:02:05 [Permalink]
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| You know... every time I read the title of this thread I'm thinking "Oxymoron". |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 05/12/2005 : 09:22:16 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bloody_peasant
quote:
The majority on the right are the educated business folks who primed up the religious base to gain political power.
I don't know if I necessarily agree with this, as I think the majority on the right are educated business folks who are also part of the religious fundamentalist base. Being educated in business, in no way educates one for critical thinking, at least beyond what it takes to make a profit.
Sure there probably is a minority of educated right wingers who are closet atheist or at least not literal fundamentalist. I think they are in the minority number-wise, but probably are in the majority, $$ wise and power/influence wise.
The right has been using the so-called family value issues to court Christians for a while now. There was a time that a Republican presidential candidate couldn't get elected without crossover votes from the heavily democratic southern states. Nixon called it the silent majority. Later it became the moral majority. I do absolutely believe that the right recognized and acted to bring blue-collar workers who had nothing to gain by voting republican into their fold by appealing to issues that are not strictly conservative in terms of the economics and conservative philosophy. They saw an opportunity and they went for it. Their success is obvious.
The fact that Bush may be the real deal is incidental. Republican platforms were designed to gain the support of democrats who happened to be people of faith by pandering to their religious concerns by becoming Gods party, at least in word.
Now there is a battle within the ranks of the Republican party over how much influence the relatively new RR should actually have. Remember, republicans used to favor less government. The RR wants more regulation in the matters that concern them. And that means more government. They want more say. They want a theocracy. This is a dilemma for the traditional conservative's who don't want to loose votes.
Barry Goldwater is turning over in his grave…
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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