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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
 Posted - 09/29/2005 : 20:13:51
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Was talking to Dude in chat last week and mentioned something about not consuming meat and potatoes at the same meal. Found some info on it. Neither the meat nor the potatoes are bad for you, but the consumption of both at the same meal have an adverse affect. It was, at the time I took the class, presented as a potential cause of obesity.
from http://www.beyondveg.com/cordain-l/macronutr/macronutr-ratios-1b.shtml
quote:
As far as I know, there are no good, recent data evaluating the effects of varying protein/fat mixtures upon insulin/glucagon responses in humans. Most of the data involves manipulating carbohydrate, with varying amounts of fat; protein is usually held constant. The Westphal et al. [1990] paper evaluates protein/carbohydrate mixtures on serum glucagon responses. Pure dietary carbohydrate (50g glucose) shows no rise in plasma glucagon, whereas pure protein (actually 93.5% lean beef, 6.5% fat, as mentioned above) causes the greatest rise in glucagon after 1 hour; with roughly equal areas under the curve after 3 hours when comparing pure protein to protein/carbohydrate mixtures (50g glucose/50g protein).
Thus, there appears to be a dose/response effect on glucagon with protein/carbohydrate mixtures, and from the data, it can probably be interpreted that there is a dose/response effect with pure protein. As far as insulin response goes (as opposed to glucagon response), fat/carbohydrate mixtures cause a greater rise than carbohydrate meals alone, presumably because of the stimulatory effect of fat upon glucose-dependent insulinotropic peptide (GIP) [Collier et al. 1988].
Thus, as indicated by the question, there is a dose-dependent effect of dietary protein upon glucagon secretion which is largely independent of either carbohydrate or fat.
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...no one has ever found a 4.5 billion year old stone artifact (at the right geological stratum) with the words "Made by God."
No Sense of Obligation by Matt Young
"Say what you will about the sweet miracle of unquestioning faith. I consider the capacity for it terrifying and vile!"
Mother Night by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
They (Women Marines) don't have a nickname, and they don't need one. They get their basic training in a Marine atmosphere, at a Marine Post. They inherit the traditions of the Marines. They are Marines.
LtGen Thomas Holcomb, USMC
Commandant of the Marine Corps, 1943
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 09/29/2005 : 21:10:39 [Permalink]
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Interesting, and thanks 
Will give it a thorough reading.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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gezzam
SFN Regular
Australia
751 Posts |
Posted - 09/29/2005 : 21:29:44 [Permalink]
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I work on the theory that you can eat and drink whatever you want....
Just as long as you use more than what you put in, you won't gain weight.
All it takes is half an hour or so of excercise each day, use the stairs instead of the lift, do small things like tie your shoelaces whilst standing up and try not to use the remote control on the telly all the time and all will bode well.
It works for me, I love rich fatty foods (and beer.........boy I love beer) and by following these simple rules my weight is the same at 34 than as it was at 18..... |
Mistakes are a part of being human. Appreciate your mistakes for what they are: precious life lessons that can only be learned the hard way. Unless it's a fatal mistake, which, at least, others can learn from.
Al Franken |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 10/05/2005 : 22:52:42 [Permalink]
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Gezz,
Glad to hear that, mine isn't, but that's neither here nor there. I was just trying to get some info for Dude. Had heard this mentioned in a bio class many years ago. And as a rule, have tried to follow the no protien and starch combo. I eat both of course, just not at the same sitting. Not really difficult. |
...no one has ever found a 4.5 billion year old stone artifact (at the right geological stratum) with the words "Made by God."
No Sense of Obligation by Matt Young
"Say what you will about the sweet miracle of unquestioning faith. I consider the capacity for it terrifying and vile!"
Mother Night by Kurt Vonnegut, Jr.
They (Women Marines) don't have a nickname, and they don't need one. They get their basic training in a Marine atmosphere, at a Marine Post. They inherit the traditions of the Marines. They are Marines.
LtGen Thomas Holcomb, USMC
Commandant of the Marine Corps, 1943
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2005 : 05:17:56 [Permalink]
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| Personally I want to lobby to change the cause of death as written on many things, I feel it is degrading to the dead that we say "Heart Attack due to excess weight" Sounds much better with "Ate delicious food to death", or "Suicide by Mcdonalds" |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2005 : 05:45:24 [Permalink]
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"Bread 'n gravy, chicken chow mien,
Too much fancy eatin',
Will only bring you pain.
The doctor says, 'Hold on there;
Not another crumb!'
Gimmie some... gimmie some...."
Agreein' with Gezz and BigPapa.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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R.Wreck
SFN Regular
USA
1191 Posts |
Posted - 10/06/2005 : 15:53:25 [Permalink]
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quote:
Sounds much better with "Ate delicious food to death", or "Suicide by Mcdonalds"
Which of course are two very different things. |
The foundation of morality is to . . . give up pretending to believe that for which there is no evidence, and repeating unintelligible propositions about things beyond the possibliities of knowledge.
T. H. Huxley
The Cattle Prod of Enlightened Compassion
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 10/10/2005 : 08:42:29 [Permalink]
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Gezzam,
That's great that those rules work for you, however, if the majority of people in America ate what they wanted while exercising an hour a day and doing a little extra walking, they would still end up obese. Just think about what most people want to eat. One of those little Ben and Jerry's ice cream containers that you get at the grocery store has 800 calories (nearly half of what the average adult American needs in a day) and my husband and I would both love to put back one of those (each) every night after dinner. And that's just to start.
While I don't explicitly work out every day, I ride my bike 32 miles a week and walk quite a bit on a daily basis. But if I don't consciously limit my calorie intake to about 2000 a day, limit my intake of red meat, and make sure to eat plenty of vegetables, fruit and whole grains, I gain weight immediately every time.
I think your good fortune has more to do with your personal biological makeup (and perhaps also you crave beer and such in moderation) than it does with your lifestyle habbits. Especially if you weigh the same as you did when you were 18. My gawd, my husband is 32 and he's have to lose almost 50 pounds to be as skinny as he was when he was 18 - and he's not fat and eats very healthy foods now. |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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| Edited by - marfknox on 10/10/2005 08:44:04 |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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woolytoad
Skeptic Friend
313 Posts |
Posted - 10/10/2005 : 11:03:12 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by marfknox
Gezzam,
That's great that those rules work for you, however, if the majority of people in America ate what they wanted while exercising an hour a day and doing a little extra walking, they would still end up obese. Just think about what most people want to eat. One of those little Ben and Jerry's ice cream containers that you get at the grocery store has 800 calories (nearly half of what the average adult American needs in a day) and my husband and I would both love to put back one of those (each) every night after dinner. And that's just to start.
While I don't explicitly work out every day, I ride my bike 32 miles a week and walk quite a bit on a daily basis. But if I don't consciously limit my calorie intake to about 2000 a day, limit my intake of red meat, and make sure to eat plenty of vegetables, fruit and whole grains, I gain weight immediately every time.
I think your good fortune has more to do with your personal biological makeup (and perhaps also you crave beer and such in moderation) than it does with your lifestyle habbits. Especially if you weigh the same as you did when you were 18. My gawd, my husband is 32 and he's have to lose almost 50 pounds to be as skinny as he was when he was 18 - and he's not fat and eats very healthy foods now.
or perhaps as Gezzam said
quote:
Just as long as you use more than what you put in, you won't gain weight.
if there is a net loss of calories, you should be ok.
Of course he fails to mention how much he weighs |
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