|
|
|
GeeMack
SFN Regular
USA
1093 Posts |
 Posted - 02/01/2006 : 13:44:02 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Bill Scott...
Originally posted by me...
Apparently he also advocates the modification or repeal of certain laws...
Which laws gee?
The First Amendment to the Constitution of the United States, Bill.quote:
For the sake of moving forward I will just agree for the moment that the pervs can remain anonymous as long as they have not yet committed a crime.
Good. After you prove someone has committed a crime than you can run your mouth about it.quote:
My beef is with the ACLU, who willing defends the pervs under no legal obligation to do so, for the sake of the pervs "personal freedom" to be a perv in private.
Then in light of your previous comment, until you've proven they committed a crime, there's not an issue. The fact that you continue to dwell on it only serves to reinforce the notion that you misunderstand the issue completely.quote:
Tell all of the boys across the country who have been raped by NAMBLA members, sympathizers and spin off groups since 2000 that the ACLU was protecting the ID of these pervs so that they may go about their deeds in secret and move from town to town undetected.
Any chance you were an altar boy, Bill, or maybe a member of a church youth group?  quote:
Look if you want to take the stance that personal freedom of pervs is more important and trumps tracking child pervs from the net then that is your right to have such an opinion and to voice it.
You must be involved in some other discussions on some other forums because nobody here at SFN has said anything like that. If you keep your forums straight, you won't keep making yourself look so foolish. 
|
 |
|
|
Jason Barker
Skeptic Friend
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2006 : 13:47:39 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Right. We invaded Iraq 3 years ago and society has not collapsed yet, so what W. did I assume was was not a huge deal. (sigh)
Nope, it hasn't collapsed. Iraqi society collapsed, although some would claim it had already collapsed before we got there. |
Homer: He thinks he's so big, with all his money and wealth. But there's one thing he can't buy with his money.
Marge:What's that?
Homer:........a dinosaur. |
|
|
|
Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2006 : 17:16:01 [Permalink]
|
quote:
but any member innocent of acting out his fantasies has the same rights as any of the rest of us.
(bill) Not if his fantasy includes the highly illegal activity of man/boy rape.
So... now you are the thought police?
Well, I think you should be imprisoned Bill. There is no doubt in my mind that you have had the though to do physical violence to another human being at some point in your life. So has every human, at some point. The act of striking another human being is definitely illegal, and if you think that thinking about doing something illegal constitutes a crime... get your ass down to the local precinct and turn yourself in.
Or, more egregiously, you are a clear enemy of free speech. Since free speech is a guarnteed right, and you are opposed to it, and you want to restrict the free speech of others, you have commited another thought crime. Another reason to get yourself down to the precinct and confess your crimes so you can be locked up.
|
Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
|
|
|
|
filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2006 : 18:09:30 [Permalink]
|
Is anyone else finding this whole discussion tedious? We put forth the fact of the rights guarenteed by the Constitution to all citizens, that the ACLU defends, and the only replies thus far have been rants. And repetitive rants at that.
I grow bored....
 |
"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
|
|
|
|
Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2006 : 21:19:14 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Is anyone else finding this whole discussion tedious? We put forth the fact of the rights guarenteed by the Constitution to all citizens, that the ACLU defends, and the only replies thus far have been rants. And repetitive rants at that.
That is Bill's MO....
Rarely have I had the displeasure of dealing with anyone so immune to reality as Bill seems to be.
|
Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
|
|
|
|
Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2006 : 23:42:08 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dude
quote:
Is anyone else finding this whole discussion tedious?
<snip>
That is Bill's MO....
Rarely have I had the displeasure of dealing with anyone so immune to reality as Bill seems to be.
Verlch? |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
|
|
|
R.Wreck
SFN Regular
USA
1191 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 16:56:56 [Permalink]
|
Bill, aren't the "homo child pervs" god's children too?
Seems the ACLU has a more christian spirit than you do. |
The foundation of morality is to . . . give up pretending to believe that for which there is no evidence, and repeating unintelligible propositions about things beyond the possibliities of knowledge.
T. H. Huxley
The Cattle Prod of Enlightened Compassion
|
|
|
|
HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 19:09:41 [Permalink]
|
I suspect most if not all people here agree with the general standard: "Sexual relations between consenting adults are, and should be, protected as a matter of privacy."
That does rule out the sexual exploitation of children, as they are not "adults," and are not considered to be emotionally and intellectually able to "consent." With me so far, Bill? The abuse of minors is certainly a terrible crime, one that should be punished severely under the law.
Serious crime, be it terrorism or child molestation, must be fought. But should Constitutional rights be eliminated in the process?
Bush seems to think so, in his defense of torture of terrorist suspects, and in the use of unwarranted spying on Americans in pursuit of terrorists. He holds to this position even though in both cases he's shown no evidence that these rights violations actually aid the fight against terrorism, and despite the fact there were legal and effective existing alternatives.
It seems your attack on the ACLU is like Bush's attack on the Constitution: In both cases, the complications of legal due process are seen as irritating barriers to an unbridled, crusading rage.
Bill, your regular use of "homos," and "fags" as anti-gay terms of contempt for pedophiles demonstrates not only your loathsome bigotry against gays, but also that you are either unaware of or choose to ignore this: If the pedophilia of men preying upon young boys is caused by homosexuality, then logically it must be equally true that the pedophilia of men preying upon young girls is caused by heterosexuality. (And why does it seem that the latter form of pedophilia is not equally abhorent to you? Because molesting little girls doesn't involve your hated "fags"?)
Clearly, Bill, you are flying false colors in this whole discussion. You are desperately trying to use people's disgust with NAMBLA in order to bash gays, as well as the ACLU's protection of due process.
Zip up, Bill, your agenda is showing.
|
“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 02/02/2006 19:13:37 |
|
|
|
Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 20:16:32 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Zip up, Bill, your agenda is showing.
I'm hoping he's gone and turned himself in for his "thought-crimes".
|
Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
|
|
|
|
H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2006 : 20:20:59 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by HalfMooner
Clearly, Bill, you are flying false colors in this whole discussion. You are desperately trying to use people's disgust with NAMBLA in order to bash gays, as well as the ACLU's protection of due process.
Exactly. Anyone not willing to join his homophobic lynch mob must obviously be in collaboration with the criminals.  But remember: we're the extremists and fanatics--not him.
|
"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
|
|
|
HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2006 : 00:59:47 [Permalink]
|
H. Humbert thunk: quote:
Exactly. Anyone not willing to join his homophobic lynch mob must obviously be in collaboration with the criminals. But remember: we're the extremists and fanatics--not him.
Thank you.
Why do I have this ongoing deja vu thing about constantly trying to teach the Golden Rule to professed Christians? Don't they learn anything "Christian" in Sunday School these days? As a recovering Christian, I remember my first exposure to the concept of tolerance was a Sunday School hymn which included the words, "Red and yellow, black and white, all are precious in His sight."
That was more than half a century ago. Now they teach the kiddies to hate fags?
|
“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 02/03/2006 01:01:04 |
|
|
|
Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2006 : 08:06:08 [Permalink]
|
This is a an answer to Bill Scott's post in the thread "Bill O'Reilly Lies", however since it's about the ACLU and NAMBLA, I feel it more appropriate to post it here:
quote:
Originally posted by Bill scott
The thread started with Bill O and went to ACLU. One of my problems with the ACLU is that they choose to fight for the rights of men who operate a site that is in favor of man/boy sex.
Doesn't everyone deserve equal protection under the law and the constitution?
quote:
ACLU throws children under the bus in name of free speach for those that desire a day when man/boy sex will be legal.
Can you speak more plainly, without allegories? Some of the SFN-readers are non-English natives and have enough work decoding spelling and grammar. Are you saying that ACLU abuses children?
quote:
Legaly, yes ACLU has ground to stand on.
I'm glad you see that.
quote:
Does that make it right to help defend the rights of a group where everyone knows damn well man/boy sex has already taken place? No, of course not.
Explain how this is not a massive ad-hominem against the rest of the members. You're judging everyone on the basis that two of the members of NAMBLA are convicted criminals?
You find all them guilty by association. If we wanted to play the same game, we could call Christian ministers and priest child-molesters too. Hell, you are a professed Christian too, as were the murderers and rapists in the Crusade. Do you see where this is going?
There are several issues here, and even if you can't separate them, I can examine them as separate:
NAMBLA is a web-site whose members think that a certain law should be repealed. It is the constitutional right of it's members to express their opinion, and promote their ideas with their privacy protected. If a couple of the members break this law does not automatically mean that all of the members breaks the law.
I'm a member of a web-site*[1] in Sweden that promote the repealing of another certain law. It is my constitutional right to express my opinion in that forum without having my rights violated. Some of the members have broken that law, and got busted.
Am I a scumbag?
I would expect ACLU to defend the constitutional rights of everyone. Once we let the constitution to be compromised, there is a huge risk that the ideals of the constitution will get lost. If that happens, not only are the privacy of NAMBLA members at risk, but sooner or later it will backfire on you.
quote:
Now since everyone seems to have an opinion about my veiw on homo sex I will give it to you. I do not think anyone should be beat up, threatened, or worse over different beliefs.
If it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck...
You are using the same emotionally loaded language, syllogism, rhetoric, generalisations, and guilty-by-association-fallacies as bigoted homophobes. What conclusions do you expect we should draw from what you are typing?
quote:
And if someone does any of the mentioned to any human for having different views on life they should face the law and penalty for doing so.
Yet you are perfectly fine with people having their constitutional violated when their opinions are different than yours... That's some double-standard you are expressing.
quote:
My personal belief is that homo sex is not natural in any worldview.
Your examples prove that you have problems separating issues.
Sex and the act of procreation are two different things.
Even the village idiot understands that two animals of the same sex cannot have offspring.
Having sex is pleasure. (It's supposed to be pleasurable anyway)
quote:
Place 50 hetro men and 50 hetro women on their deserted, but tropical Island, and let them have sex until they want no more. At the end of their 70 years go back to the Island and you have... well, you will have several generations by then.
Place 50 homosexual men and 50 homosexual women on the island, and you will have offspring. Because the drive to procreate is different from the sexual preference.
quote:
No mater how you want to spin it reality dictates that this is an unnatural practice.
Having sex with yourself will not give any offspring either so, by your reasoning, masturbation is also an unnatural practise. (And if you try to convince me it's something you do not practise at least every once in a while, I won't believe you. And in order not to force you to lie about it, I don't expect you to answer to this).
quote:
It is my 1st amen. right, backed by the ACLU, to have such views. If that makes me a bigot, homophope, hate filled, etc... in your eyes then I am sorry for that. It still does not change the way I think about them.
If not bigoted homophobic, then by any measure hypocritical.
Edited to add:
*[1] Oh I almost forgot...
The web-forum in Sweden I was referring to was www.sporthoj.com a site for people who love sports- and super-bikes. The law we want repealed is the one that regulates speed limits for bikes, and prohibit us from making wheelies. While there are members from the forum who are guilty of speeding and wheeling, not all members are outlaws. Even if some people think we are a menace to society. 
Edited again, this time for clarification. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 02/03/2006 08:25:25 |
|
|
|
HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2006 : 12:43:52 [Permalink]
|
Bill, you back here now? Good!
Could you please address at least one the issues I presented yesterday on this thread?:
quote:
Bill, your regular use of "homos," and "fags" as anti-gay terms of contempt for pedophiles demonstrates not only your loathsome bigotry against gays, but also that you are either unaware of or choose to ignore this: If the pedophilia of men preying upon young boys is caused by homosexuality, then logically it must be equally true that the pedophilia of men preying upon young girls is caused by heterosexuality. (And why does it seem that the latter form of pedophilia is not equally abhorent to you? Because molesting little girls doesn't involve your hated "fags"?)
|
“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 02/03/2006 12:44:29 |
|
|
|
GeeMack
SFN Regular
USA
1093 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2006 : 13:19:38 [Permalink]
|
Continued from the other thread, which was so rudely interupted by Bill Scott...quote:
Originally posted by Bill Scott...
Well, it was the main topic of the conversation for most of this post. The ACLU and nambla so of coarse it would be in my posts. I suppose you would prefer I post on man/animal sex even though that is not the topic?
The main topic of the post where you made your comments was entirely unrelated to your incessant discussion about sexual orientation. You're the one who hijacked that thread by plagiarizing some copyrighted material about an organization working to protect the rights of the American citizens. You're the one who, after hijacking the thread, coudn't get your mind off the issue of your own sense of sexual morality, even when your original complaint was against the preservation of freedom for United States citizens. Even when you finally acknowledged that the ACLU is indeed providing a beneficial service, you still apparently feel a compelling need to bring the subject back around to your own sexual concerns.quote:
Sure you do, and why would you not? If their is a group of adults who sponsor a website, in secret, that is in favor of decriminalizing sex between adults/children then I have no problem making a judgement to condemn this. If you do then that is your problem.
If it were my problem then I'd be the one running around the Internet interrupting other people's conversations to complain about it. I'm not. If I recall correctly that would be you. And while we're at it, how about you be a decent human being for once and apologize to beskeptigal and Snake for so inconsiderately intruding on their original discussion.quote:
Why should I read it? It obviously did not help you.
Because it's the Christian bible, Bill, that's why. Somehow with all your preachin' and judging and closed-mindedness I thought it might be the authoritative text you rely on to support your doctrine. Apparently I was wrong, although it might do you some good to check it out anyway. Here was my comment...quote:
Originally posted by me...
And instead of spending all that time imagining man/boy sex and judging people, you could be reading some material to help you rise above that kind of thing. As a starting point I might suggest Psalms 50:20, Luke 6:37-42, Romans 2:1-6, Leviticus 19:16, and certainly James 4:11-12. Oh, and definitely Matthew 7:1-5. Now go do your homework.
Now if you don't have any more to say on the matter, other than to continue complaining about something you can't change, I think I'll go get involved in some more interesting conversations.
|
|
|
|
Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2006 : 14:22:13 [Permalink]
|
To prevent further hijacking of the "O'Reily lies" thread. I have moved my response to Ronnywhite here.
quote:
Originally posted by ronnywhite
Yet regarding priests, there are aspects of clergy jobs that have probably always made them appealing to some of "unconventional" sexual orientations- most commonly meaning homosexuals- and it seems to me perverts and malicious nuts might be over-represented among homosexuals who take up the clergy as opposed to heterosexuals who do, since their sexual orientation (as opposed to their Faith, whether it's delusional or not) will more often be their primary motivation for taking that path. And, to do so for that reason suggests to me they're probably less well-adjusted than homosexuals who pursue traditional jobs of their choosing. I think that's why we seem to (and probably do) have so many perverts among priests.
Actually the majority of clergy statutory rape/sexual abuse is heterosexual in nature.
quote:
I'm sure there are ethical homosexuals who are priests, and they probably hate the scumbags in their ranks who molest kids even more than the public at large does, because the kind of moral corruption, sinister criminality, and ethical bankruptcy displayed by those cruds hurts them worse as a group than it does anyone else except the victims. As such, I think the Vatican making an official effort now to flush out and jettison the homosexuals might be a good idea- even though it's unfair to some-
Not cool. As the majority of child molestation happen in heterosexual pairings, the Vatican's focus on homosexuality not only is misplaced, but also focuses on a very few cases. I'll chalk it up to you assuming that since the homosexual aspect is played up by the media, that they are the major problem. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
|
|
 |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
