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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
 Posted - 02/04/2006 : 11:24:06 [Permalink]
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quote:
Let me try to clear this up since you are having so much truoble following along
Oh, please don't be patronizing. If we are having trouble "following along", it is because you think and write the most illogical non sequiters.
Your reply to Jason indicated that you completely did not understand what he posted. |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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| Edited by - pleco on 02/04/2006 11:24:40 |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 12:18:52 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Jason Barker
quote:
At the heart of your lack of an argument is nothing more than your lynch mob hardon, which fills your little heady weady with confused, blurry ideas that if a group is evil enough in your eyes, then they should be treateded with a different legal standard on the basis of your own passionate indignation.
So, if a group of muslim men start a website that advocates the leagalism of terroist activiteis you don't think the gov. should look at who these fellows are?
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"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 12:20:42 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by pleco
quote:
Let me try to clear this up since you are having so much truoble following along
Oh, please don't be patronizing. If we are having trouble "following along", it is because you think and write the most illogical non sequiters.
Your reply to Jason indicated that you completely did not understand what he posted.
I just cut through his smoke and informed him that pot smokers support legalizing weather he knows them or not is irrelavent. Please pay attention. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Jason Barker
Skeptic Friend
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 12:41:23 [Permalink]
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quote:
So, if a group of muslim men start a website that advocates the leagalism of terroist activiteis you don't think the gov. should look at who these fellows are?
but,obviously, its not happening. You're just trying to win people over by emotional appeal, and if anyone says yes, you get to accuse them of being gay or liberals or soft on commu...terrorism.
come on bill. Internet muscles are no substitute for real ones. You're not going to win the internet. |
Homer: He thinks he's so big, with all his money and wealth. But there's one thing he can't buy with his money.
Marge:What's that?
Homer:........a dinosaur. |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 13:20:49 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Jason Barker
quote:
So, if a group of muslim men start a website that advocates the leagalism of terroist activiteis you don't think the gov. should look at who these fellows are?
quote:
but,obviously, its not happening.
Well there was a time we did not have to worry about groups that wanted man/boy sex legal. It is very conceivable that a muslim group could start such a site.
quote:
You're just trying to win people over by emotional appeal, and if anyone says yes, you get to accuse them of being gay or liberals or soft on commu...terrorism.
So you don't think the gov. should be allowed to investigate a group of muslims who want to legalize terror? Yes or no.
[quote]come on bill. Internet muscles are no substitute for real ones. You're not going to win the internet.
I don't seek to "win the internet"
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"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Jason Barker
Skeptic Friend
USA
55 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 13:28:39 [Permalink]
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| Good, because you aren't doing a good job of it. |
Homer: He thinks he's so big, with all his money and wealth. But there's one thing he can't buy with his money.
Marge:What's that?
Homer:........a dinosaur. |
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard
USA
3834 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 13:37:29 [Permalink]
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| My wonderful, logical hard to argue against posts always get ignored. I should take that as a compliment the points I made are easier to ignore than debate. |
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moakley
SFN Regular
USA
1888 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 15:57:51 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by beskeptigal
My wonderful, logical hard to argue against posts always get ignored. I should take that as a compliment the points I made are easier to ignore than debate.
Blame it on MTV. Hard to remain focused on one image/post for more than two or thress seconds. I suppose that's why sound bites are so effective. |
Life is good
Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 16:13:28 [Permalink]
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quote:
My wonderful, logical hard to argue against posts always get ignored. I should take that as a compliment the points I made are easier to ignore than debate.
Bill always (in his posting history on these forums) ignores anything that contradicts him. He repeats the same nonsense over and over. He is pretty much immune to reality.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 16:23:45 [Permalink]
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Wow... I'm sorry I've missed this conversation until now. Most of what I would have said has already been well articulated by other skeptic friends members. But what the hell, I'll jump in anyway.
These are all responses to Bill:
Bill repeatedly called NAMBLA a website which promotes illegal and deviant behavior.
It is my understanding from everything I've ever read about NAMBLA that they are very careful to NOT promote illegal behavior. They officially advocate getting rid of legal age of consent laws. Advocating the changing of a current law is a perfectly legal act. As for promoting “deviant” behavior, my dictionary says that deviant is anything going against conventional standards. Thus, not ALL deviant behavior should be illegal. The government should not be able to violate the normal rights of a group that promotes deviant behavior, while not breaking the law.
Bill wrote: So, if a group of muslim men start a website that advocates the leagalism of terroist activiteis you don't think the gov. should look at who these fellows are?
If the group legitimately only advocates legalizing terrorism (while not encouraging currently illegal acts), then yes, they should be free to do so anonymously. How would they be different from any other organization trying to change current laws? This is part of the freedom-and-democracy package.
Bill, you yourself said that NAMBLA's goals will never be achieved. I totally agree with you. The people who support NAMBLA are not like gay rights advocates, nor are they like people who advocate the legalization of marijuana. The latter two have a good chance of changing the laws, while the former has not a snowball's chance in hell.
And this is why: Neither the desire to be in a romantic/ sexual relationship with the same sex or the desire to use recreational drugs is symptomatic of a psychological disorder. Pedophiles, however, are legitimately ill people, and that is why only pedophiles are the ones supporting NAMBLA. Last I checked, mental illness was not grounds for one to lose their rights. You have to break the law first. At least that's how it works under the American Constitution. If you don't like it, then join some group that advocates an Amendment to the Constitution that says members of NAMBLA don't get the same rights as everyone else.
A huge percentage of legalized drug supporters and gay rights supporters are not drug users or gays. The fact that you've repeatedly compared pedophilia to marijuana use and homosexuality shows a great deal of ignorance on your part. And please provide evidence for your claim that the “majority” of legalized marijuana advocates are users. Like Jason, I support legalized marijuana, as do most of my friends, and we are not users. One of my friends cannot use pot because of a heart condition, and he is a hugely active legalization-of-drugs advocate. As for homosexuality –the majority of those who think gay sex should be legal and the majority that think gay marriage should be legal are straight people.
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"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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| Edited by - marfknox on 02/05/2006 00:13:57 |
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 16:38:01 [Permalink]
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Oh! And I forgot to respond to the insane contention that homosexuality is unnatural in, according to Bill, "any worldview". What an uneducated and simplistic contention that is! Bill, you've obviously not been reading up on your biology. Homosexual behavior exists in many social species of animals and it very much has a useful purpose for survival as well as a means for perpetuating itself.
For example, to use the closest relative to humans, bonobos (chimp-like apes) engage in homosexual sex (both male and female) as frequently as heterosexual sex. Researchers have found that the purpose of this behavior is to smooth over relationships between new and old group members, to form social alliances, and to make up after fights. Because of this rampant homosexuality, bonobos are far less violent than chimps. In other words, it is an asset to the group's survival.
There are also two simple ways for "gay genes" to propagate themselves: 1.) Through bisexual activities that produce children who might carry such genes. 2.) Exclusively homosexual carriers can aid their ciblings and other relatives with child care, thus increasing the number of neices and nephews who are more likely to carry to gay gene.
And finally, the fact that homosexual inclinations manifested in some form in ALL human societies throughout history means that either it can be a adaptive advantage or at least is not a disadvantage. (Otherwise homosexuality would have been breed out of human populations eons ago.)
From any worldview that sees the material world as abiding by consistent, natural laws, homosexuality is perfectly natural.
Human relationships are more deep and complex than that of love birds. We're a lot more than baby-making machines. Ask any nun or priest. |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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| Edited by - marfknox on 02/05/2006 00:10:56 |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 16:38:02 [Permalink]
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marfknox rooted: quote:
If the group legitimately only advocates legalizing terrorism (while not encouraging currently illegal acts), then yes, they should be free to do so anonymously.
I can just imagine this hypothetical terrorism-legalization group ("Supra-National Organization for Rational Terrorism Law"?) hiring a K Street lobbying firm to represent them. Given the way many Congress members have behaved recently, it might work, given enough money to hand out.
But I digress.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 02/04/2006 16:38:23 |
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2006 : 16:42:00 [Permalink]
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| On the whole hypothetical of a group advocating the legalization of terrorism, what about anarchists? I've met lots of anarchists. Most of them don't break laws because - like anyone - they don't want to suffer the consequences of getting caught. But they still advocate anarchy. Should law-abiding anarachist's rights be violated? |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard
USA
3834 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2006 : 14:25:24 [Permalink]
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| I think there are websites that promote terrorism aren't there? I don't want to Google a search for them and draw even more spying on me by the creeps in power but I'm pretty certain they're out there. |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2006 : 08:29:16 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Bill scott
quote:
Originally posted by Jason Barker
quote:
At the heart of your lack of an argument is nothing more than your lynch mob hardon, which fills your little heady weady with confused, blurry ideas that if a group is evil enough in your eyes, then they should be treateded with a different legal standard on the basis of your own passionate indignation.
So, if a group of muslim men start a website that advocates the leagalism of terroist activiteis you don't think the gov. should look at who these fellows are?
The KKK does so for cross "illuminations". Why should this be any different than muslims?
As long as they are only advocating changing legislation, they should be free to associate without being bothered by the government.
Likewise for Democrats. This administration keeps trying to make the case for them to be investigated for aiding terrorism. (ala Darth Cheney.) |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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