|
|
|
trogdor
Skeptic Friend
198 Posts |
 Posted - 05/04/2006 : 19:02:38 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
quote:
(bill) Well lucky for me that my eternal destiny is not based on your thinking or lack there of. (insert gay and childish symbol here)
Destiny.....?
"Pederpes finneyae is an early tetrapod described by Ms. Clack in Nature 418, 72-77 (4 July 2002). It dates to the Early Carboniferous (348-344 Myr) from near Dumbarton, Scotland. The map of the holotype (drawing below) shows the preserved elements. Elements appearing on the reverse side are shown in grey."
Tetrapod transitionals
I don't put this stuff up just for you, Bill. I realized long, long ago that I'd never remove the blinkers from the eyes of any dedicated creationist; not even with a Holy Writ. So it matters little, really, if you read it all or not. I post it mostly for the other members who might be interested and for the covey of lurkers scuttling about in the SFN underbrush. As it is seldom commented upon, I don't know what reception it's getting. But there you have it none the less. This latest one's an interesting site though, yes?
Your goals are certainly working. I read each new post eagerly. You have provided me with many pieces of random info and a good many desktop backgrounds |
all eyes were on Ford Prefect. some of them were on stalks.
-Douglas Adams |
 |
|
|
trogdor
Skeptic Friend
198 Posts |
Posted - 05/04/2006 : 19:18:53 [Permalink]
|
In a truely Filthy-like manner I will get this page's trafic to double, nay triple!!!
The evolution of penises and vulvas!!
The penis
This article shows how penises have evolved multiple times independantly, but in each case they use the same basic methods.
most worrisome, many times, penises have been lost!
there are also pictures but I will not show them here for fear of being banned!
How to evolve a vulva
Good info here Bill. Will you dare to read them? |
all eyes were on Ford Prefect. some of them were on stalks.
-Douglas Adams |
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 06:43:43 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by trogdor
Your goals are certainly working. I read each new post eagerly. You have provided me with many pieces of random info and a good many desktop backgrounds
quote:
You have provided me with many pieces of random info and a good many desktop backgrounds
Yeah, you can just throw them in with the unicorns and gargoyles. BTW, what's up on that abiogenesis report you promised us awhile back that you would be submitting? I look forward to reading it, hopefully soon...
|
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 08:01:56 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
Homo habilis
Looks like a low budget version of Planet of the Apes or Land of the Lost to me. Using a tier 2 or 3 actor on top of it. I can get a costume at Wal-Mart that looks better then that ridicules picture. And what's up with the gotee and Elvis side burns? |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
|
|
|
Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 08:34:20 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Bill Scott:
And what's up with the gotee and Elvis side burns?
Before Elvis, Homo Habilis has to be considered one of the early rock artists. Perhaps Elvis was paying homage to those first rock stars…
|
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 08:47:13 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Kil
quote:
Bill Scott:
And what's up with the gotee and Elvis side burns?
Before Elvis, Homo Habilis has to be considered one of the early rock artists. Perhaps Elvis was paying homage to those first rock stars…
quote:
Some chimpanzee communities are known to use stone and wood as hammers to crack nuts and as crude ineffective weapons in hunting small animals, including monkeys.
http://anthro.palomar.edu/homo/homo_3.htm
(bill) So what? Otters will do the same thing to bust open a clam. Doesn't mean that they are pre-human. Now when these chimps build a Bridgeport from scratch and then start doing some high precision machining to build themselves a high tech nutcracker then I will be impressed.
|
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
|
|
|
Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 09:05:53 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Bill Scott:
So what? Otters will do the same thing to bust open a clam. Doesn't mean that they are pre-human. Now when these chimps build a Bridgeport from scratch and then start doing some high precision machining to build themselves a high tech nutcracker then I will be impressed.
Otters do not make tools. They choose a suitable stone for the purpose of cracking open clams. Many animals use tools. But tool manufacture is something different. Altering a stone, or a twig for a specific purpose is tool making. And yes, chimps alter twigs by pulling off side branches and other obstacles that would impede the twigs use as a tool…
|
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
|
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 09:33:20 [Permalink]
|
| I forget the guy's name, but his research was studying tool use in chimps, and he wanted to see if he could teach chimps how to fashion tools. He stuck food in a box, tied the box shut with a rope, taught chimps to chip a stone blade out of a piece of obsidian, and then taught them to use the blade to cut the rope and get the food. He actually got one of them (at least) to do it, while closely supervised. Because unsupervised, the chimps quickly figured out that smashing the obsidian on the concrete floor of their cages would result in shards usable as cutting blades, without all the effort of chipping and shaping using another rock. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 10:34:40 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Kil
quote:
Bill Scott:
So what? Otters will do the same thing to bust open a clam. Doesn't mean that they are pre-human. Now when these chimps build a Bridgeport from scratch and then start doing some high precision machining to build themselves a high tech nutcracker then I will be impressed.
Otters do not make tools. They choose a suitable stone for the purpose of cracking open clams. Many animals use tools. But tool manufacture is something different. Altering a stone, or a twig for a specific purpose is tool making. And yes, chimps alter twigs by pulling off side branches and other obstacles that would impede the twigs use as a tool…
quote:
Some chimpanzee communities are known to use stone and wood as hammers to crack nuts and as crude ineffective weapons in hunting small animals, including monkeys.
http://anthro.palomar.edu/homo/homo_3.htm
(bill) So what? Otters do the same thing to open up clams.
quote:
Otters do not make tools. They choose a suitable stone for the purpose of cracking open clams. Many animals use tools. But tool manufacture is something different. Altering a stone, or a twig for a specific purpose is tool making. And yes, chimps alter twigs by pulling off side branches and other obstacles that would impede the twigs use as a tool…
(bill) Well your cite says that this rarely happens:
quote:
However, they rarely shape their tools in a systematic way to increase efficiency. The most sophisticated chimpanzee tools are small, slender tree branches from which they strip off the leaves.
http://anthro.palomar.edu/homo/homo_3.htm
(bill) It would take little, if any, extra knowledge for this feat then to correctly pick out a rock tool that is suitable for it's purpose as the otter does. I mean if your going to call a monkey a toolmaker because he strips some leaves off of a twig then a bird, who modifies twigs and straw etc... to build a nest, must be called a general contractor, not to mention the master builder known as the beaver...
quote:
The first unquestionable stone tools were evidently made and used by early transitional humans in East Africa about 2.5 million years ago.
http://anthro.palomar.edu/homo/homo_3.htm
(Bill) See, even this dude says they are questionable tools.
|
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
| Edited by - Bill scott on 05/05/2006 11:00:53 |
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 10:36:42 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
I forget the guy's name, but his research was studying tool use in chimps, and he wanted to see if he could teach chimps how to fashion tools. He stuck food in a box, tied the box shut with a rope, taught chimps to chip a stone blade out of a piece of obsidian, and then taught them to use the blade to cut the rope and get the food. He actually got one of them (at least) to do it, while closely supervised. Because unsupervised, the chimps quickly figured out that smashing the obsidian on the concrete floor of their cages would result in shards usable as cutting blades, without all the effort of chipping and shaping using another rock.
(bill) Well first of all I am going to need a date and source for this. Second of all if this date is more the two weeks old I am going to need validating evidence that you fact checked the source to make sure their research and/or conclusion has not changed.
Besides, I would say that this an example of de-evolution as many public educated students of today would clearly be out excelled by the chimps. The chimps would be eating while the public educated students went hungry... |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
| Edited by - Bill scott on 05/05/2006 10:50:13 |
|
|
|
filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 11:18:01 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Looks like a low budget version of Planet of the Apes or Land of the Lost to me. Using a tier 2 or 3 actor on top of it. I can get a costume at Wal-Mart that looks better then that ridicules picture. And what's up with the gotee and Elvis side burns?
Ever hear of 'artistic license,' dolt? And of course, you either failed to open the link or you could find no way to refute it, so you attacked the easiest and least important target. Incidently, I chose that image over several better ones because it looked kind'a neat; not because it was in any way accurate. The link provides the facts and the theory they support.
You are not going to have any straw left for anywhere else else, at the rate you're tossing it around in here.
Creation Science 
Thanks Trog. Kind words are always appreciated.
|
"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
|
|
|
|
Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 11:49:37 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Bill scott
Besides, I would say that this an example of de-evolution...
Your incorrect assumption that evolution has a direction is noted. As is your mistaken impression that my side comment was presented as an example of evolution at all. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 12:20:15 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
quote:
Originally posted by Bill scott
Besides, I would say that this an example of de-evolution...
Your incorrect assumption that evolution has a direction is noted. As is your mistaken impression that my side comment was presented as an example of evolution at all.
Your assumption that I was serious about this comment and not speaking in jest is fully noted. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
|
|
|
Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 12:29:28 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
quote:
Looks like a low budget version of Planet of the Apes or Land of the Lost to me. Using a tier 2 or 3 actor on top of it. I can get a costume at Wal-Mart that looks better then that ridicules picture. And what's up with the gotee and Elvis side burns?
Ever hear of 'artistic license,' dolt? And of course, you either failed to open the link or you could find no way to refute it, so you attacked the easiest and least important target. Incidently, I chose that image over several better ones because it looked kind'a neat; not because it was in any way accurate. The link provides the facts and the theory they support.
You are not going to have any straw left for anywhere else else, at the rate you're tossing it around in here.
Creation Science
Thanks Trog. Kind words are always appreciated.
Evolution, the Challenge of the Fossil Record (San Diego, Calif.: Creation-Life Publishers, 1985), Evolution, the Fossils Say No! (San Diego, Calif.: Creation-Life Publishers, 1978), and Evolution, the Fossils Still Say No! (Spring Arbor Distributors, 1985)
http://skepdic.com/creation.html
(bill) Geese Filthy, these are some pretty old dates that they used to source Mr. Gish. I am assuming you fact checked all these resources to make sure they are still current and nothing has changed, didn't you? I was chided for not doing such a thing on this very thread...
quote:
Despite the fact that 99.99% of the scientific community considers evolution of species from other species to be a fact, the creation scientists proclaim that evolution is not a fact but just a theory, and that it is false. The vast majority of scientists who disagree about evolution disagree as to how species evolved, not as to whether they evolved.
http://skepdic.com/creation.html
(bill) Typical naturalist propaganda. They wasted no time at all here and went staight into into their strawman attack:
Despite the fact that 99.99% of the scientific community considers evolution of species from other species to be a fact,
(bill) They can come up with 99.99% because I know of no scientist, creationist or naturalist, that reject the notion that critters evolve from within their speices. This is known as microevolution.
the creation scientists proclaim that evolution is not a fact but just a theory, and that it is false.
(bill) More straman attacks I see. Most creation scientists fully accept microevolution. It is macroevolution which most creation scientists reject.
The vast majority of scientists who disagree about evolution disagree as to how species evolved,
(bill) Micro or macro? I thought NS though random mutations was pretty much agreed upon by the naturalists for macro?
not as to whether they evolved.
(bill) Micro or macro?
quote:
Thanks Trog. Kind words are always appreciated.
(bill) Little does he know that anyone can go to any search engine and have an infinite supply of links on whatever they wanted.
|
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
|
|
|
|
Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular
Canada
510 Posts |
Posted - 05/05/2006 : 12:41:13 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
A fish story.
Bill - if you had taken the trouble to wade through Filthy's fish story you would have discovered that lungs evovled from swim bladders. Many fish can obtain oxygen from their swim bladders. This information was buried in the link, so I am witholding the fishslap for now.
Thanks for the informative link Filthy - I had no idea what lungs could have evolved from before, although it seems glaringly obvious now. |
"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King
History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms
"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler
"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell
"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson |
|
|
 |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
