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trogdor
Skeptic Friend
198 Posts |
 Posted - 04/20/2006 : 20:29:17
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and now there is further proof that the british are cooler than us.
thermite
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all eyes were on Ford Prefect. some of them were on stalks.
-Douglas Adams |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2006 : 21:19:56 [Permalink]
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Impressive commercial, trogdor. Now I want some Thermite! But they forgot to include a list of retail dealers.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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JohnOAS
SFN Regular
Australia
800 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2006 : 21:37:25 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by trogdor
and now there is further proof that the british are cooler than us.
thermite
[rant]
I'm all for the blowing things up, but "Brainiac" annoys me.
Their science is always bad. They try to "spice it up" with scantily clad women on occasion (no guessing the target audience) but don't even do that well in my opinion.
As science, it sucks.
As porn, it sucks.
As entertainment, it only just beats the commercials.
[/rant]
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John's just this guy, you know. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2006 : 21:56:46 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by HalfMooner
Impressive commercial, trogdor. Now I want some Thermite! But they forgot to include a list of retail dealers.
It's easy to make yourself.
However... telling you how, here on SFN, is probably a violation of some law or another.
As is linking to a place where you can find such information.
(hint: start by searching Wikipedia)  |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
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Collateralmurder. |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2006 : 22:15:30 [Permalink]
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Dr. Mabuse offered: quote:
It's easy to make yourself.
However... telling you how, here on SFN, is probably a violation of some law or another.
As is linking to a place where you can find such information.
(hint: start by searching Wikipedia)
You sly Swedes, from the safety of your undisclosed neutral location, can joke about such things. Thank you, but I want to hastily state for the record that I don't really want any of the stuff. I was joking. I will never search Wikipedia or the Internet for any knowledge again, and will nevermore even think about cool-looking pyrotechics.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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woolytoad
Skeptic Friend
313 Posts |
Posted - 04/20/2006 : 23:21:25 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by JohnOAS
[rant]
I'm all for the blowing things up, but "Brainiac" annoys me.
Their science is always bad. They try to "spice it up" with scantily clad women on occasion (no guessing the target audience) but don't even do that well in my opinion.
As science, it sucks.
As porn, it sucks.
As entertainment, it only just beats the commercials.
[/rant]
I concur! The Myth Busters chicks are way cooler! |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2006 : 03:39:59 [Permalink]
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Of course, there's always that timeless favorite of the aspiring madman: The Anarchist's Cookbook.
If you must blow yourself up fucking around with some of this shit, try and do it well away from population centers....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2006 : 05:34:32 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
Of course, there's always that timeless favorite of the aspiring madman: The Anarchist's Cookbook.
If you must blow yourself up fucking around with some of this shit, try and do it well away from population centers....
As long as you realize that an important safety or main ingredient is left out of each reciepe. If you follow the directions exactly from the AC, you'll get hurt....... badly. And it'd serve you right, too. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2006 : 12:39:45 [Permalink]
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Valiant Dancer stated: quote:
As long as you realize that an important safety or main ingredient is left out of each reciepe. If you follow the directions exactly from the AC, you'll get hurt....... badly. And it'd serve you right, too.
Which is why it's called The Anarchist's Cookbook. It's named sort of like the classic, To Serve Mankind.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2006 : 14:28:55 [Permalink]
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The thermite reaction (according to wikipedia) releases ~820kJ/mol.
Just for the fun of it, I picked up my chemistry formula book, and did some calculating.
If I didn't screw up on the way, 215 grams of thermite release enough energy to heat 2 liters of ice-water to boiling-point (if all the energy could go into the water).
Edited to add:
McGyver used home-made thermite to cut through the lock of an armoured car i one episode. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 04/21/2006 14:32:00 |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2006 : 19:41:21 [Permalink]
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| Which Wiki are you looking at, Mab? The English one says 851.5 kJ/mol. Now, how do you calculate the mass of one mole of a mixture of differing molecules? I think you added the molar masses together, Mab, which gives you two moles of atoms, total (and an inefficient mixture in this case). I think it's a matter of multiplying the molar masses by the percentages of the substances in the mixture, and if so in this case one mole is only 126.11 grams, delivering a 100°C rise to 2,034.7 grams of water. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2006 : 03:00:52 [Permalink]
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First, I had the numbers in my memory and was a but fussy by the time I got home from work before I posted it. It was a bit off.
Isn't molar mass defined as a certain ammount of atoms (or molecules)? (something like 1x10^24 atoms)
The molar mass of thermite should then be the sum of the atoms of the molecules it consists of: two Fe, three O, and 2 Al.
Edited to add (since I was in a hurry to write the above):
the reaction is defined as Fe2O3 + 2Al --> Al2O3 + 2Fe with the deltaH = -850kJ/mol
That's how I figured that the 850kJ/mol must apply to all the ingredients: it's a balanced formula. I'll have a look how Wikipedia define mol in chemical reactions. I'm pretty confident that all ingredients have to be weighted separately and added together to become the final mol.
Edit 2:
I realized that a balanced formula doesn't have anything to do with it. It's the difference between the two molecules Fe2O3 and Al2O3 of which there is only one in the formula above. But all atoms have to be weighted in, in order to get the reaction.
One mol of rust is 2x56+3x16 grams + two mol of aluminium at 27 grams ~214g. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
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| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 04/22/2006 06:43:59 |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2006 : 09:40:35 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
I realized that a balanced formula doesn't have anything to do with it. It's the difference between the two molecules Fe2O3 and Al2O3 of which there is only one in the formula above. But all atoms have to be weighted in, in order to get the reaction.
One mol of rust is 2x56+3x16 grams + two mol of aluminium at 27 grams ~214g.
Yeah, but that's three moles of molecules, total.
The most-efficient reaction occurs with a mix of rust and aluminum which is... Oh, wait. Using precise molar weights for rust and aluminum, I just realized that the percentages given for the most-efficient reaction are those of one mole of iron to two of aluminum. So yeah, you got it. Nevermind.
Oh, and one mole of a substance has precisely Avagadro's number of atoms or molecules in it, 6.0221415×1023. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2006 : 16:38:34 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
Oh, and one mole of a substance has precisely Avagadro's number of atoms or molecules in it, 6.0221415×1023.
I said to someone else (for a moment I thought it was here, but when I double-checked and found myself wrong) that a mol is about 1024.
Not so far off then. Not bad since it was 20 years ago I studied it in school, and not having had the need to look it up until now. 
I loved chemistry, and we had a great teacher. I was just so close to nailing an A, but the competition was fierce, and I screwed up on a test and that was it. The same happened in Physics. My class was way above national average. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
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| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 04/22/2006 16:42:47 |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2006 : 18:50:44 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
I said to someone else (for a moment I thought it was here, but when I double-checked and found myself wrong) that a mol is about 1024.
No, you said that just two posts up:Isn't molar mass defined as a certain ammount of atoms (or molecules)? (something like 1x10^24 atoms) So you were right.quote:
Not so far off then. Not bad since it was 20 years ago I studied it in school, and not having had the need to look it up until now.
Well, you didn't actually have a need to look it up now, 'cause the number itself wasn't needed for any of these calculations.
Continuing on, if 213.654 g of thermite can raise 2,034.7 g of water from ice-cold to boiling, then it's got a "boil factor" (BF, my new term) of 9.52 and change. How does this compare to other energy-releasing reactions?
We must, of course, do matter/antimatter. A half-gram of each (for a full gram of reactants) would release 8.9876×1013 Joules, which is enough to give it a BF of 214,757,467,144.6, or to put it another way, a one-gram matter/antimatter reaction generates enough energy to boil nearly 86 (85.9) Olympic swimming pools filled with ice water.
Now, oddly, I just did the same calculation for gasoline, and came up with a BF of 107.5, which means I've either done something wrong, or thermite ain't all that hot after all.
Double-checking... Nope, thermite only releases 3,985 J/g, while gasoline burned in an engine releases about 45,000 J/g, more than 11 times as much energy. I guess it's no wonder we don't have thermite-powered cars.
I suppose the fascination with thermite is not its power, then, but instead the fact that such a simple thing results in molten iron. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/23/2006 : 14:09:53 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
Double-checking... Nope, thermite only releases 3,985 J/g, while gasoline burned in an engine releases about 45,000 J/g, more than 11 times as much energy. I guess it's no wonder we don't have thermite-powered cars.
I suppose the fascination with thermite is not its power, then, but instead the fact that such a simple thing results in molten iron.
The fascination is the high temperature of the fire, burning through almost anything. You don't get gas to burn at 2500°C.
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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