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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 06/04/2009 : 08:15:30
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I've brought this forth before but here's a much more comprehensive view of it. Hint: the worsest ain't Bush. Bush was astoundingly bad, an utter incompetent, but he couldn't hold a candle to Reagan. | There's been talk that George W. Bush was so inept that he should trademark the phrase "Worst President Ever," though some historians would bestow that title on pre-Civil War President James Buchanan. Still, a case could be made for putting Ronald Reagan in the competition. |
It is said that one should not speak ill of the dead. Me, I don't see why the hell not, especially since Bush, having none of his own, followed Reagan's policies and even recapped some of his minions, and thus, here we are today.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 09:47:53 [Permalink]
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| I pick Wilson, he single handedly set-back racial issues by 60 years. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 10:24:45 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
I've brought this forth before but here's a much more comprehensive view of it. Hint: the worsest ain't Bush. Bush was astoundingly bad, an utter incompetent, but he couldn't hold a candle to Reagan. | There's been talk that George W. Bush was so inept that he should trademark the phrase "Worst President Ever," though some historians would bestow that title on pre-Civil War President James Buchanan. Still, a case could be made for putting Ronald Reagan in the competition. |
It is said that one should not speak ill of the dead. Me, I don't see why the hell not, especially since Bush, having none of his own, followed Reagan's policies and even recapped some of his minions, and thus, here we are today.
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A great article. I can't think of a Reagen policy that I wasn't against. At the time, I considered him the worst president ever in my lifetime. Where I differ with the articles conclusion is that I do think Bush was worse. Reagan may have set the table, but it was Bush/Cheney who brought back what we already knew were failed policies, like supply side economics, and a fear based foreign policy that has weakened our standing worldwide. "Iran Contra" is still fresh in my memory as well. But the kind of deception that made that scandal possible was turned into an art form during the Bush administration which lead to the war in Iraq.
Reagan was very bad. But take his policies and put them into the hands of what were now full blown Neocons, and I think Bush/Cheney get the prize. Even if just for the fact that Bush went back to already failed policies and ran with them, having not learned a single thing from history.
I will never forgive Nixon for extending the war in Vietnam just to win an election.
I wonder what happened to Republican concern for environmental issues? It was they who were the first conservationists. That party has become the party of the selfish.
I also don't know why anyone who doesn't earn more than $250,000 votes republican. They are like aliens to me. Unless they are getting their asses kissed, like the religious right is in order for the republicans on top to even get elected, I don't understand their incentive. At their heart, the top of the party is nothing but a bunch of selfish bastards who have nothing to offer blue collar conservatives but slogans. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 14:50:01 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
Unless they are getting their asses kissed, like the religious right is in order for the republicans on top to even get elected, I don't understand their incentive. At their heart, the top of the party is nothing but a bunch of selfish bastards who have nothing to offer blue collar conservatives but slogans.
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Don't forget that half the population has below average intelligence. Enough of them aparently aren't bright enough to see through the slogans.
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 15:38:32 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Ricky
| Don't forget that half the population has below average intelligence. |
This statement would be vacuous if it were "...below median intelligence." It is entirely possible to have a country with 75% of the people below average intelligence. In fact, I would hazard a guess that more than half our population has below average intelligence.
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No true American has lower than average intelligence.
I pick Bush as the worst President in US history, simply because, in addition to all his other failed and/or class-based policies, he added a major invasion and war against an "enemy" which had not provoked it, on false and invented pretenses. Neither Buchanan, nor Wilson, nor Reagan, terrible as they were, had done quite as bad as that.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 06/04/2009 15:39:38 |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 20:56:15 [Permalink]
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Reagan is the guy responsible to the Taliban. He armed, trained, and supplied them when they were mjuahadin fighting the "evil empire" USSR in Afghanistan.
He gave weapons to anyone who was fighting against any government he didn't like. Or rather who his neocon masters didn't like. Reagan was nothing but a mouthpiece, but I think he was smart enough to know he was just the hired help, and more than willing to play the role for his 30 pieces of silver.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2009 : 21:32:39 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dude
Reagan is the guy responsible to the Taliban. He armed, trained, and supplied them when they were mjuahadin fighting the "evil empire" USSR in Afghanistan.
He gave weapons to anyone who was fighting against any government he didn't like. Or rather who his neocon masters didn't like. Reagan was nothing but a mouthpiece, but I think he was smart enough to know he was just the hired help, and more than willing to play the role for his 30 pieces of silver.
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American foreign policy is to arm any country that will fight those we perceive as enemy's. It's a really stupid policy, but Reagen didn't start it. There is a pretty long list of really bad people and governments that we supported.
What he did do, or at least his administration did was to sell arms to a known enemy, Iran, to raise money to arm the Contra rebels in their war against the Sandinista government in Nicaragua. And he did that after congress passed legislation forbidding funding the Contra's.
Basically, that was treason. But hey, he was the gipper... |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 03:51:12 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dude
Reagan is the guy responsible to the Taliban. He armed, trained, and supplied them when they were mjuahadin fighting the "evil empire" USSR in Afghanistan.
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That was Carter that started all that.
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I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 08:21:06 [Permalink]
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| It is said that one should not speak ill of the dead. Me, I don't see why the hell not, especially since Bush, having none of his own, followed Reagan's policies and even recapped some of his minions, and thus, here we are today. |
I tend to think it is fine to criticize the dead but that in the weeks following right after their death the criticism should at least be tasteful.
But Reagan has now been dead for years, so anything goes IMO.
I'll refrain from getting into a debate over who the worst President was since that's so subjective and I can't make up my mind. But I'm glad you brought up Reagan as a candidate since I agree whole-heartedly with the criticisms of his Presidency here. Reagan popularized the political idea that government is inherently corrupt and incompetent. Any politician who runs for office espousing such ideas obviously cannot be trusted since if they end up doing a bad job they can then turn around and say "See, government should be smaller!"
My brother had an interesting story from when Reagan died. My bro and his wife are both actors, and they were in NYC working day jobs as bartenders, my bro in a gay neighborhood, and his wife in a corporate/business district. Both of them were working the night Reagan's death was announced. My brother witnessed a venue full of people cheering and toasting to the death of someone they considered to be a monster, while his wife watched two young businessmen crumble into tears and comfort each other with winsome talk about how much they admired the ex-President. |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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Simon
SFN Regular
USA
1992 Posts |
Posted - 06/05/2009 : 08:57:48 [Permalink]
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Not only did Reagan's America put the Taliban into power and sell weapons to Iran, it also helped Bin Laden create the network that was to become Al Qaida.
They also sold weapon to Sadam, including chemical weapons and advised him into their use.
Bad and self-destructive as was the US' policy under Bush, it was just as bad under Reagan.
The main thing I can think of that would make Bush worse is that I don't know that Reagan actually sold his country. He did make a lot of terrible mistakes but they were mistakes. Bush and co deliberately sacrificed thousand of lives for their own interest and that of the moneys backing them... |
Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there – on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996 |
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Worsest president ever?
