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astropin
SFN Regular
USA
970 Posts |
 Posted - 06/09/2009 : 07:57:48 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
I'm hoping that this isn't just a passing criticism that Oprah and staff think they can just wait out. I would like to see the skeptical community continue to monitor what she presents, and how it's presented, and keeps the pressure on. Just as Robert Lancaster created a page to watch Sylvia Browne, perhaps someone should step up and create the same kind of page that keeps an eye on Oprah.
We need to become a big thorn in her side.
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Agree 100%. I was wondering when anyone would tackle this moron and her minions. |
I would rather face a cold reality than delude myself with comforting fantasies.
You are free to believe what you want to believe and I am free to ridicule you for it.
Atheism:
The result of an unbiased and rational search for the truth.
Infinitus est numerus stultorum |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
 Posted - 06/09/2009 : 11:35:18 [Permalink]
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And now, riding to Oprah's defense in his column for the Huffington Post is, who else? Deepak Chopra.
Mainstream Medicine and the Oprah Factor
A recent cover story in a struggling news magazine, under the title "Crazy Talk:" accuses Oprah Winfrey of spreading "dubious advice" in a wide range of health issues from menopause and hormone replacement therapy to autism, cancer, aging, and weight loss. The tone of the article was the same tiresome blend of gotcha journalism and selective fact-reporting that fills tabloid coffers.
The story failed to gain traction for obvious reasons. Oprah has aired innumerable shows on health, of which the controversial ones are a tiny minority. Her intention to improve women's lives on all fronts is so obvious as to be almost above criticism. The credibility for women's well-being and welfare she has earned day after day over the past two decades will not be undone with a story that cherry-picks the guests who can be made easy targets of ridicule by the medical establishment. And the fact that she has celebrity guests who have causes and crusades in the area of health, such as Jenny McCarthy or Suzanne Somers, is not the same as Oprah herself endorsing what they say.
The criticism the medical establishment is directing at Oprah through this article only exposes their own frustration in having squandered their credibility with the public. They hope that if they can successfully attack the Oprah's immense credibility, then they can magically get some of that credibility back for themselves. However, if people still trusted the health care industry to act in their best interest the way they did decades ago, then it would be unnecessary to brand Oprah for "crazy talk" simply because she occasionally provides a forum for ideas outside of mainstream medicine… |
His column goes on to accuse the the medical industry of what every new age practitioner accuses the medical industry of.
| ...As long as official medicine, backed by huge pharmaceutical companies, denies the existence of the problem, much less alternative solutions, the movement will remain patient-centered and the attitude toward alternative medicine will be one of unfounded disdain, suspicion, and ignorance on the part of physicians... |
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 12:12:56 [Permalink]
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My response to the Deepak Chopra article...
Oh, it's in pending land.
Here is what I wrote, more or less. I made some changes before posting it on the site:
So, it's Deepak Chopra to Oprah's rescue. Notice that he doesn't defend the hormone claims of Suzanne Summers. That's because he can't. He is looking at the larger picture. He is going after the attack on alternative medicine itself. You know, the industry that has made Chopra a very rich man. Make no mistake about it. Alternative medicine is a multi-billion dollar business. And Chopra is one of the people that made it so.
What this is about is efficacy. “Wellness” is a sweet word but it does not address the kind of quackery that Summers, for example, has offered up with Oprah's blessings. Not unless anything goes in the alternative medicine business. Make no mistake. What Summers is suggesting are very real drugs. Call it natural, but unless efficacy and a risk to benefit ratio can be established, whatever it is will remain alternative. And some of the advice coming from that corner is downright dangerous. Anecdotal evidence is no substitute for controlled studies. But anecdotal evidence for efficacy is the gold standard in the alternative medicine trade. Call it natural, put it on the shelf, and let the buyer beware.
How many babies will die of preventable illnesses because of Jenny McCarthy's crusade against childhood vaccinations, endorsed by Oprah to the point of Oprah's production company giving McCarthy her own show?
Deepak Chopra is only looking out for number one. |
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 06/09/2009 : 12:19:24 [Permalink]
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Havin' a bit back trouble today. Guess I'll have to put the axe head under my bed again, until it clears up. 
Deepak Chopra indeed!
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 06/09/2009 12:23:21 |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 13:01:03 [Permalink]
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Okay, they didn't post it. I have tried to clean it up a bit and take out what they might consider offensive language. You know, like calling Summers a quack. This is actually my third attempt. I deleted my second attempt...
So, it's Deepak Chopra to Oprah's rescue. Notice that he doesn't defend the hormone claims of Suzanne Summers. That's because he can't. He is looking at the larger picture. His defense of Oprah is really a defense against an attack on the alternative medicine industry itself. Make no mistake about it. Alternative medicine is a multi-billion dollar business. And Chopra is one of the people that helped make it so.
That the Newsweek article is about Oprah is tangential to the real issue here, and that is what actually counts as medically sound advice? “Wellness” is a sweet word but it does not address the kind of “medical advice” that Summers is advocating for. Her alternative includes taking some very real drugs, alternative or not. And all with Oprah's blessing. Call it natural, but unless efficacy and a risk to benefit ratio is established, whatever it is will remain alternative. Some of the advice coming from Oprah's corner is downright dangerous. Anecdotal evidence is no substitute for controlled studies. But anecdotal evidence for efficacy is the gold standard in the alternative medicine trade. Call it natural, put it on the shelf, and let the buyer beware.
While defending Oprah's endorsement of anti vaccine advocate, Jenny McCarthy, he also says that studies matter. Well, the studies say there is no vaccination/autism link. Chopra wants to have it both ways.
Deepak Chopra must defend Oprah because the Newsweek article was also a slam against what Chopra advocates for.
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Edited. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 15:35:55 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Geez, Kil, you really need an editor. It's "Somers."
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Do you think that's why they won't post my comment? I mean, I give up... |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 17:11:58 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
Do you think that's why they won't post my comment? I mean, I give up... |
No, they probably just don't like your woous interruptus. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2009 : 19:14:10 [Permalink]
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They don't post your comments because they aren't interested in any kind of critical thought.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2009 : 14:31:59 [Permalink]
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Massimo Pigliucci weighs in on his blog, Rationally Speaking.
Deepak Chopra defends Oprah while committing endless logical fallacies
I regularly read the Huffington Post, for the good reason that it often sports intelligent articles written from a progressive standpoint, and because I believe in open access and open contribution to the socio-political discourse (otherwise, I wouldn't bother writing this blog). Then again, one of the drawbacks of openness is that you get crap together with the good stuff. This isn't altogether bad, since reading crap is a necessary component of developing one's own sense of critical thinking, sharpening the baloney detector, so to speak. But crap needs to be responded to, especially when it comes from influential sources. Hence this column on good old Deepak Chopra (he of quantum mysticism fame) defending Oprah Winfrey from the attacks of a “struggling news magazine” (Newsweek) which recently dared criticizing Oprah for endorsing and promoting pseudomedicine — most famously by lending ample tv time to Jenny McCarthy, the former Playboy model who maintains against all evidence that vaccines cause autism.
Ok, Deepak, here we go. Chopra complains that Newsweek adopts “the same tiresome blend of gotcha journalism and selective fact-reporting that fills tabloid coffers,” which is a stunning case of the pot calling the kettle black if you go on and read the remainder of Chopra's own piece in the Post. Be that as it may, we then find out that “[Oprah's] intention to improve women's lives on all fronts is so obvious as to be almost above criticism.” Really? I have no reason to doubt Ms. Winfrey's intentions, but surely Deepak has heard that the road to hell is often paved with good intentions, no? But you see, “the fact that she has celebrity guests who have causes and crusades in the area of health, such as Jenny McCarthy or Suzanne Somers, is not the same as Oprah herself endorsing what they say.” Well, if you actually watch Oprah (which I sometimes do while working out at the gym) she is strongly endorsing McCarthy and Somers, as it is made clear by the continuous nodding and words of encouragement that Winfrey utters every time these quacks are on her show, or by her sometimes vehement dismissal of their critics… |
Read on.
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2009 : 14:14:33 [Permalink]
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Ouch. Orac regulates Chopra pretty thoroughly there. Nice read.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2009 : 18:49:33 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dude
Ouch. Orac regulates Chopra pretty thoroughly there. Nice read.
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"Regulates." I like that, with fond thoughts of how some Old West types who called themselves "The Regulators" might have accomplished the task. Almost as brutally and effectively as did Orac, is my guess.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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The world according to Oprah
