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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2009 : 13:04:17 [Permalink]
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Robb wrote: | Why do we need to lay blame to a particular philosophy when this happens. The guy was just friggin nuts! He was a Jew hater, white supremesist and holocaust denier who hated this country. I don't thinks these idea's fit into liberal or conservative ideals. |
Did you read the article link posted by Dave? I think it gives lots of reasons why it is important to see these crimes and the motivations of those who commit them fully and clearly, and that includes not denying the political and religious underpinnings.
As a liberal I don't shy away from admitting there have been violent, liberal nutjobs (example: terrorist acts by extreme animal rights activists.) So why can't conservative pundits accept some ownership for the nutjobs on their side instead of trying to associate them with liberalism? |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2009 : 13:11:17 [Permalink]
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Robb wrote: | I think the Gov should be watching you for your idea's as well. |
Who here is arguing that the government should censor people for their ideas? I've heard both liberals and conservatives support various types of media regulation (such as the liberal support for the Fairness Act and conservative support for laws against obscenities and nudity in television and radio.) But who is calling for restrictions on the ideas and speech of private groups and pundits? Nobody. So put that straw man away.
| By the way, I do agree with most of your post about Christians in America. I just think your bigotry is misplaced with this story. |
Bizarre comment. First of all, "bigotry" is wanting one group to be treated differently, so if anyone here was expressing bigotry against Christians, that would mean that they want Christians to be treated differently than non-Christians. Please show me where anyone here has advocates such bigotry.
Second of all, if you agree with most of Mooner's post, and you also think he's a bigot against Christians, are you saying that you hold some bigotry against some of your fellow Christians? I don't think you are making yourself clear.
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"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/14/2009 : 14:40:47 [Permalink]
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I was just thinking, which, of course, hurts my head.
Do you think there is disagreement on the left that Theodore Kaczynski, also known as the Unabomber, was a left wing nut job? Did did anyone on the left deny it? I don't recall the liberal pundits denying the fact and suggesting that he is actually a conservative.
And that's why I prefer my liars to their liars. My liars are more honest...
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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the_ignored
SFN Addict
2562 Posts |
 Posted - 06/15/2009 : 04:03:43 [Permalink]
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| You can imagine what the Disco 'tute has to say. |
>From: enuffenuff@fastmail.fm
(excerpt follows):
> I'm looking to teach these two bastards a lesson they'll never forget.
> Personal visit by mates of mine. No violence, just a wee little chat.
>
> **** has also committed more crimes than you can count with his
> incitement of hatred against a religion. That law came in about 2007
> much to ****'s ignorance. That is fact and his writing will become well
> know as well as him becoming a publicly known icon of hatred.
>
> Good luck with that fuckwit. And Reynold, fucking run, and don't stop.
> Disappear would be best as it was you who dared to attack me on my
> illness knowing nothing of the cause. You disgust me and you are top of
> the list boy. Again, no violence. Just regular reminders of who's there
> and visits to see you are behaving. Nothing scary in reality. But I'd
> still disappear if I was you.
What brought that on? this. Original posting here.
Another example of this guy's lunacy here. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2009 : 04:45:23 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by the_ignored
You can imagine what the Disco 'tute has to say.
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Oh frail reed, dried in the sun and tattered by the winds, thou I must grasp lest I drown, though yet I stand on dry land.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 06/15/2009 05:05:43 |
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Simon
SFN Regular
USA
1992 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2009 : 09:29:22 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
I was just thinking, which, of course, hurts my head.
Do you think there is disagreement on the left that Theodore Kaczynski, also known as the Unabomber, was a left wing nut job? Did did anyone on the left deny it? I don't recall the liberal pundits denying the fact and suggesting that he is actually a conservative.
And that's why I prefer my liars to their liars. My liars are more honest...
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Was he? I am not familiar enough with the man's philosophy beyond his ludite world view but that's definitively possible. |
Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there – on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996 |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2009 : 10:03:02 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Simon
Originally posted by Kil
I was just thinking, which, of course, hurts my head.
Do you think there is disagreement on the left that Theodore Kaczynski, also known as the Unabomber, was a left wing nut job? Did did anyone on the left deny it? I don't recall the liberal pundits denying the fact and suggesting that he is actually a conservative.
And that's why I prefer my liars to their liars. My liars are more honest...
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Was he? I am not familiar enough with the man's philosophy beyond his ludite world view but that's definitively possible.
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Theodore Kaczynski
Okay, I think I was wrong about him. That was how I remembered it. Seems that he really was another Rightist whack job.
Bad example on my part. I probably should have used the the SLA to make my point. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2009 : 11:03:42 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
Bad example on my part. I probably should have used the the SLA to make my point. |
Is it just me, or does the word "Liberation" in a group's name usually signify Leftist extremism that sometimes turns violent (SLA, Animal Liberation Front, Earth Liberation Front, etc.)? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2009 : 12:01:55 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by Kil
Bad example on my part. I probably should have used the the SLA to make my point. |
Is it just me, or does the word "Liberation" in a group's name usually signify Leftist extremism that sometimes turns violent (SLA, Animal Liberation Front, Earth Liberation Front, etc.)?
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Yeah, huh. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 06/15/2009 : 17:31:56 [Permalink]
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I've always seen Kaczynski as someone strange enough to have floated entirely out of the right-left spectrum. He seems to be all about technology itself, rather than who owns it.
But, as a liberal/progressive, I have no qualms about describing the SLA and the contemporary moonbats as lefties. Embarrassment, but not qualms. It would take a very twisty argument to call them rightists or conservatives. As twisty as the arguments the Right is using now to try to call their latest two infamous colleagues leftists. And both of those assassins have much more in common with the "mainstream" wingnut Right than I ever had with the SLA or the moonbats.
[Edit: Spelling.]
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 06/16/2009 12:51:55 |
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Simon
SFN Regular
USA
1992 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2009 : 07:16:55 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by HalfMooner
I've always seem Kaczynski as someone strange enough to have floated entirely out of the right-left spectrum. He seems to be all about technology itself, rather than who owns it.
But, as a liberal/progressive, I have no qualms about describing the SLA and the contemporary moonbats as lefties. Embarrassment, but not qualms. It would take a very twisty argument to call them rightists or conservatives. As twisty as the arguments the Right is using now to try to call their latest two infamous colleagues leftists. And both of those assassins have much more in common with the "mainstream" wingnut Right than I ever had with the SLA or the moonbats.
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I agree; Kaczynski is not concerned with traditional politics.
As for 'Liberation' movements often being a code for left wings operation, I'll tend to agree.
I could only find this one right-wing group,
through what I readily admit was a very cursory glance. |
Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there – on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996 |
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Nazi murders guard at Holocaust Museum
