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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
 Posted - 07/11/2010 : 01:35:55 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
So, where's the "Send Kil to TAM Fundraise" link?
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I suppose it's the old link...
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The old link being http://www.skepticfriends.org/tam5.asp
(it's a bit hard to find, even with search-engines) |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2010 : 13:06:58 [Permalink]
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Okay, very quickly, the official TAM8 has just ended. The paper presentations were good, for the most part. I still have one duty to preform at the challenge event. I'll try to get some writing done today.
I'm hungry! I'm going to go get myself a burger... |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2010 : 16:18:27 [Permalink]
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I'm such a slacker. I just spent most of the afternoon at the Del Mar, just hanging and sipping beer. In years before, I would be home by now or hurrying to the airport. Nice to have this extra time to just chat with people and decompress, kinda. I got, I think, one last hug from Swoopy. I met some people that may be unknown in these parts, but they are people I have wanted to meet. (details later) Oh hell. I really didn't get many "fan" shots, because, well, no point in it really. But I did get one of me with Mr. Deity.
One cool thing was a guy who was going to be working the merchandise table too, after breakfast, which we ate at the table, told me about this great shot of Christopher Hitchens he saw on the JREF forum. He said he was standing in front of some doors that said "do not stand in front of doors." I told him that was a shot of me with Hitchens, and told him about how Hitchens helped set up the shot.
Less than an hour to go before the challenge event. Once again, I feel the need for a little R&R before I head up there again...
By the way. You would be amazed at how many people see this as more of a social event than anything else. Some of the regular TAM goers are fine with missing parts of TAM. I don't happen to be one of them, but there are people here who didn't even sign up for TAM, but are hanging out with all the regulars. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 07/11/2010 : 18:59:05 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
By the way. You would be amazed at how many people see this as more of a social event than anything else. Some of the regular TAM goers are fine with missing parts of TAM. I don't happen to be one of them, but there are people here who didn't even sign up for TAM, but are hanging out with all the regulars. |
This has been my experience at every convention. When I started going to scifi/fantasy conventions, I would attend a couple/few events or panels each con. But after three or four cons, I'd go, but I'd spend 100% of the time in the lobby, the restaurant, the bar, party rooms or in my own room. Oh, I'd go check out the stuff people had for sale, too, but I'd hardly ever buy anything.
And I knew plenty of people who'd go to those cons and not even bother to register. But they ran the risk of being thrown out of the hotel. And having the badge meant I could attend events, if I wanted to, and the money also helped ensure that there would be more cons to go to. Either way, if you're one of the 48- to 72-hour party people, you tend to get a lot more (sometimes better) stories about the famous folks who attend, 'cause you're up staggering around with them at three in the morning, while the "serious" folks are sleeping because they've gotta wake up for a 9 AM panel on "racial stereotypes in hard science fiction" or whatever.
So no, what you've learned is no surprise to me, at least. It's also one of the negative things that floats to mind when you talk about getting me to attend a TAM. I'm 20-something years older than I was when I went to cons on a regular basis (sometimes six a year). I think I'd be disappointed that I no longer have the sort of stamina I did back then. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 08:03:52 [Permalink]
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Okay, so I'm packing and getting ready to leave for home now. I had a nice conversation with a couple of woman, one of them in the Dawkins (foundation?). The group that has his name on it and gave the award to Bill Maher, which she opposed. (She knows Dave from posts on some atheist blogs.) That took up most of the evening. After that I was too tired to do much writing here. I'll go over my notes when I get home and write more, or at least I will check in.
This TAM was bigger and better than last year. That much is for sure. I'm glad I was here for it. 1300 people made it to this one. TAM4 and previous TAM's that I have attended seem almost quaint by comparison.
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 14:39:11 [Permalink]
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Okay. I'm home. I did some writing at the airport and on the plane. Mostly about the challenge event. I'll finish that and post it before the day is done. I'm busy transferring files from Michelle's computer to mine right now. I can't tell you how nice it is to be back on a computer with a big screen. Then again, if it weren't for Michelle's generosity, I would have had no computer at TAM and this thread wouldn't exist.
To Dave. Sorry if I was a bit snippy back there. We run on tired, beer and coffee at TAM. I'm just reporting. I just didn't want to get into a debate about "Tone" or what's wrong with Phil Plait, and so on. It's hard enough focusing on the days events without entering into a debate about who has what right. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 16:07:53 [Permalink]
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The Challenge Event
Okay. Sunday evening was the challenge event. I arrived early, but there were already 4 volunteers by the time I got there so I wasn’t really needed for that duty. The bad news is that after getting to 99% sure that the “official preliminary” test was on, it fell through. Plan B was a test that really didn’t count, even though the applicant claimed that she could tell, without touching or with the use of any device other than her mind, if any person was missing either a kidney or a uterus. An odd claim, but an extraordinary claim just the same. The festivities opened with DJ Grothe introducing mentalist, Banachek, who hosted and who talked about the million-dollar challenge, which was the real focus of the evening. His plan to interview Randi first temporarily failed because after being announced, it was learned that Randi wasn’t there yet. So he called out Alison Smith, who coordinates the challenge and did the negotiation that ultimately failed due to some paper work (as I heard it.) She has been working challenge duty for the last three years, and she probably will be doing it for some years to come.
Banachek interviewed her about the process, which is complicated. Not the least of the problems is to determine suitable applicants. (Those with claims that can be tested under controlled circumstances.) And then there are logistics, because many of the claims come from other countries. They also talked about the difficulty of vetting, protocols, and everything else that goes into setting up a challenge. To this date, not a single person has made it past a preliminary test. In general they don’t do those. Usually groups like the IIG and other skeptical organizations do the preliminary testing. But the protocols must be approved by the JREF for fairness and consistency. It’s not just a matter of taking someone on. Each test must include proper safeguards to avoid skewing the results in either direction.
They also talked about the future of the challenge. It’s not going away, folks. Some changes might be made, and Banachek will be the person checking protocols and such. I’m sure Alison will still be doing what she does. You know. The hard part…
Randi arrived and took questions from Banachek about how the challenge came into being, original challenges like Houdini’s, Scientific American’s, and others. Randi’s challenge history is an interesting one. The best story he told was how the benefactor of the full million wrote the check on a very large piece of Styrofoam. When he took the check to the bank, they tried to turn him away. But everything was there. Routing number, the amount, and signature, all there, which makes it a valid check. Around the outside of the check, written several times were the words "One Million Dollars Only."
For the challenge five pre-selected people were brought up on to the stage and sat, facing the audience in chairs that were turned around and numbered. They had to straddle the chairs. Among the five were Hal Bidlack and Derek. The plan was for the challenger to sit facing each one of the test subjects backs for six minutes and then move on, after a brief interview with her on various subjects, like how she could sense that a person was missing a kidney, after each six-minute mark. That meant several short interviews while the test was going on, which she agreed to. Then back she went looking (or feeling?) for her single kidneyed target.
Photo is by DJ Grothe
A mobil uplink posted on facebook.
This went on for a long time. And we had to be as silent as we could be while each of her six minutes counted down. I started to fade. Eventually there was no hope and I slipped out to the washroom for the usual and to splash some water on my face.
It occurs to me that this account of the challenge might be as boring as the challenge itself, especially since the challenge wasn’t official. I will try to cut to the chase. After studying all of the test people, she was asked to identify the target person (one kidney) by writing down the number on the chair the target was sitting in and placing the number in a jar. (Hokey?) Banachek took a show of hands to see if how many people in the audience thought they knew whom the target subject was. Interestingly, the largest number of hands went up for seat number three. Derek. I didn’t vote because I didn’t see the point in doing that. It was pretty clear that she spent more time looking at Derek’s back then anyone else’s.
Anyhow, Derek has both his kidneys. Hal Bidlack, on the other hand, doesn’t. The psychic had chosen Derek. Oh well. She had a one in five chance, which is a lousy protocol, but on the other hand, the test wasn’t official. It seems that Bidlack didn’t know he had only one kidney until it was discovered in an ultrasound, back in the late nineties. It’s a somewhat rare genetic birth defect and so far, he hasn’t missed not having both of his kidneys. The one he has is a bit enlarged, doing the work of two kidneys, but that’s about it. He has suffered no ill effects from the defect.
The show ended with an admission that this test wouldn’t have counted even if she had gotten it right, because the protocols were so poorly done. Remember, she wasn’t the original test subject, and they put this show together on the fly, no doubt. It’s also worth noting that in a real test done by the IIG, she had already failed to choose the correct target.
And that is where TAM8 ended. All of the workshops were over and that was that for this year.
I am going to have to backtrack now if I’m going to get to much of what I left out of the conference itself.
I need to go over my notes. (Those that I didn’t accidentally delete.)
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 16:18:27 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Kil
I had a nice conversation with a couple of woman, one of them in the Dawkins (foundation?). The group that has his name on it and gave the award to Bill Maher, which she opposed. (She knows Dave from posts on some atheist blogs.) |
Okay, now that's just teasing. What was her name? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 16:36:17 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by Kil
I had a nice conversation with a couple of woman, one of them in the Dawkins (foundation?). The group that has his name on it and gave the award to Bill Maher, which she opposed. (She knows Dave from posts on some atheist blogs.) |
Okay, now that's just teasing. What was her name?
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She posts as Sastra. I have had at least one dinner with her at every TAM since TAM5. In fact, she's the one who pulled me over to the PZ Myers dinner at 6, I think it was. We have become TAM friends. |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/12/2010 : 21:34:27 [Permalink]
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As you can see by now, my telling of TAM8 is going to be coming in dribs and drabs. Forget chronological order. If I were writing a Kil Report I would work harder on structure. But as this is just a thread, I’m doing it the way I’m doing it. Sue me.
Did I mention that I overslept on Saturday? I put in for a wake up call for 6:30 AM and when it came, I decided to take another five minutes or so. Two hours later I jumped out of bed and, well, I did get some yogurt and a coffee before they carted off the breakfast table goodies. But I missed the SGU podcast, a bagel and a chance to hobnob a bit.
Jump to much later in the day.
The featured event! Richard Dawkins keynote address was nothing of the sort. Instead, it was a question and answer session with DJ Grothe as host. Now, before I make this all sound too dismal, the talks were great for the most part. And I will get to those, I hope. All is not lost. And in truth, as the keynote guy, Dawkins was all over TAM and made himself very accessible. He was there for the whole event. Still, after seeing some of those great talks he gave, many of which are on youtube and elsewhere, I was disappointed.
Anyhow, what I’m going to do here is present my notes of the Q and A. Aside from an exact word or few, most of my account of the Q and A session is paraphrased. And there are probably questions and answers that I completely missed because I was busy backspacing or doing something on the laptop, which has a keyboard that is not to my liking. (At times, because I had my camera on the table next to the computer, I would grab it and try to use it as a mouse! Sigh…) Anyhow, here is my version of the session. Here are my exact notes.
DJ Grothe Introduces Richard Dawkins.
Q. What do you consider yourself first? A skeptic or an atheist?
A. A skeptic.
No area is beyond questioning including those questions that science has not answered.
Q. Are there some areas of skepticism that, well, is there a hierarchy of what we should pursue?
A. Religion tops the list, I think. If we were to discover Bigfoot in the Himalayas, it would not change my worldview. Homeopathy is one of the more unbelievable beliefs, but if it were discovered to be true, we would have to go back and look at the physics to see where we went wrong. That is, however, vanishingly implausible.
Q.#8194;Life in the universe?
A. Probably, and maybe intelligent life. Any other suggestion would imply that the origin of life is stupefyingly unlikely.
The chance of being visited is very unlikely due to many reasons, not the least of which are the great distances. If we did meet them, they would probably be vastly superior to us, but they too evolved. They would not be gods even if we would be tempted to see them that way because of their superiority.
Q. Science fiction?
A. If science is used, It can be of great value. Forget magic. There must be a technology that gives us something to think about.
Q. Magic and Fantasy?
A. Fantasy can prep a kid to accept religion. Children shouldn’t be deprived of fantasy. Still, it would be an interesting subject of study. Thinking imaginatively is a good thing. But there needs to be a balance. Fantasy along with the teaching of skepticism might mitigate the prep for religion.
Q. Rationalist curmudgeons? No fantasy?
A. No. I like fiction. Suspending disbelief. I love science fiction. Imaginative fiction can be a wonderful thing.
Q. The Magic of Reality (tentative title) is a new children’s book I’m writing. It’s closer to the Sagan kind of magic. Hopefully the reality in the book will be more enjoyable and inspiring than the magical myths that I am addressing.
Open’s to audience Q and A.
Sorry, but that’s where my notes end. I’m sure there were many delightful questions and answers from the audience. But I was probably busy looking for my lost notes from Friday’s session.
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 07/13/2010 : 14:14:27 [Permalink]
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Some Photo's. And look. I didn't get a bunch of fanboy shots this year. I didn't get many pictures at all. You know, the usual suspects... Accept for a couple of the photo's, these are people I wanted to meet, know from facebook or TAM, and at least one person that I was happily introduced to by way of Badger.
This photo was taken at the "Skeptically Drinking" party. Richard just had to have a photo with me. Against my better judgment, I let him stand next to me for this photo. Richard! Get a life!!!
What I like is a deity that you can actually see! And if my eyes had been open, I might have seen him. This was probably taken on Friday morning. You can see the night before all over my face.
This is the very cool Desiree Schell. She hosts the Skeptically Speaking podcast. We were introduced, long distance, by Badger.
This is Barbara Drescher. She writes the ICBS Everywhere Knowledge, science, reason, education, philosophy, behavior, politics, religion, and B.S. blog. She is also a friend of mine on facebook.
Yes. I have more photo's...
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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TAM8
