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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
 Posted - 02/22/2007 : 07:24:08
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I just learned about "The Secret" on Oprah. http://www.thesecret.tv
I don't recall anyone here writing about this genre, except for maybe those that get into "quantum" metaphysics and "alternative" medicine.
Just wondered if anyone had any thoughts to share. I'll probably watch the DVD at some point.
I assume that http://www.secretsofthesecret.com/ is not affiliated with the producers of "The Secret" but show where the ideas came from.
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I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular
Canada
510 Posts |
 Posted - 02/22/2007 : 07:42:38 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Gorgo
I just learned about "The Secret" on Oprah. http://www.thesecret.tv
I don't recall anyone here writing about this genre, except for maybe those that get into "quantum" metaphysics and "alternative" medicine.
Just wondered if anyone had any thoughts to share. I'll probably watch the DVD at some point.
I assume that http://www.secretsofthesecret.com/ is not affiliated with the producers of "The Secret" but show where the ideas came from.
It has at least one quantum physics goof in common with What the Bleep do we Know USANA shill Dennis Waitely is in it.
The gist of it is that thinking about something alters the universe on a "quantum" level and makes the thing happen.
For example, worrying about a traffic jam makes one happen, anti-war protests cause more war etc. It is basically The Power of Wishful Thinking. Lots of testimonials - the usual.
There is something on the JREF about it. You can watch it online if you want to waste 5 bucks. |
"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King
History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms
"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler
"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell
"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2007 : 08:05:07 [Permalink]
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| Magical thinking in it's essence. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2007 : 09:30:12 [Permalink]
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| What is it about these people that make them look like con artists? They make George Bush seem sincere. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2007 : 09:35:59 [Permalink]
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| I found the comments on JREF, and I see Randi said that he would watch it and comment as well. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2007 : 15:19:10 [Permalink]
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Ironic, my physical therapist mentioned this movie today... and I wondered what SFNers would say... and lo and behold, here it is! IT WORKS!
Ok, jokes aside - she told me pretty much all about it, and I'd be a wee bit frightened to be treated by her if she weren't so good at it. |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
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Neurosis
SFN Regular
USA
675 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2007 : 15:57:40 [Permalink]
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| I have had this movie mentioned to me a lot by the curious. I have seen it and it is utter bunk, so I usually start a fight between the curious and the true believer that made them curious after they return with my critical analysis. Personally, I didn't even see any reason for a believer to get into a tissy. The whole movie was 'believe you will be successful in order to be successful, and here is some bunk science to prove it.' The movie has the same fail safe as prayer because one could believe but not strong enough or have (as one guy said to me) unconcious thoughts of failure. In other words if your successful it works. If your not, then you must have had unconscious thoughts or not thought hard enough on success and thus it worked, but in a bad way. |
Facts! Pssh, you can prove anything even remotely true with facts.
- Homer Simpson
[God] is an infinite nothing from nowhere with less power over our universe than the secretary of agriculture.
- Prof. Frink
Lisa: Yes, but wouldn't you rather know the truth than to delude yourself for happiness?
Marge: Well... um.... [goes outside to jump on tampoline with Homer.] |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
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astropin
SFN Regular
USA
970 Posts |
Posted - 03/06/2007 : 22:15:52 [Permalink]
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| You can watch the whole thing on you tube for free....but I have better things to do with my time. |
I would rather face a cold reality than delude myself with comforting fantasies.
You are free to believe what you want to believe and I am free to ridicule you for it.
Atheism:
The result of an unbiased and rational search for the truth.
Infinitus est numerus stultorum |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 03/06/2007 : 23:24:58 [Permalink]
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Zukav: quote:
Each personality draws to itself personalities with consciousness of like frequency or like weakness. The frequency of anger attracts the frequency of anger, the frequency of greed attracts greed, and so on. This is the law of attraction. Negativity attracts negativity, just as love attracts love. Therefore, the world of an angry person is filled with angry people, the world of a greedy person is filled with greedy people, and a loving person lives in a world of loving people.*
[My emphasis.] I'd be impressed, if the guy would only specify the frequencies in Hertz. Hey, I'm a geek.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 03/07/2007 : 00:47:14 [Permalink]
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Here's Randi's article on Oprah: quote:
AN OPRAH FIASCO
This will be a rather long item, but it deals with an important subject – how Oprah Winfrey manages to promote woo-woo ideas on her program by careful management of the content. Before we begin, you must understand how TV programs are recorded and put together for later broadcast. First and most important is the image of the host; this must be supported, and audience expectations must be met in that regard. Second, the sponsors must be satisfied that nothing unpopular or politically incorrect is used; that won't sell the product. Third, secondary guests are expendable, and are there only to be used, in any way that serves the intent of the producers.
Back in April of 1995, I'd been contacted by the Oprah show and made an offer to do a second appearance with them. I simply told them, “No thanks”; I'd already been sandbagged by that show. In that appearance, I'd been told, just before I left my hotel for the studio, that the previously-scheduled “psychics” – for whom I was well prepared – would not be showing up. I went all the way out to the location and then found out, moments before the show went on the air – live – that those major "psychics" actually were appearing on the show. Though I'd prepared video and newspaper material to contradict the pompous and false claims of those two scheduled “psychics,” I'd left the data behind at the hotel when told I'd be without opposition, and I had nothing in hand. It was a blatant, calculated lie designed to trap me, and I fell for it. But I'd not do it again. I'm sure Oprah doesn't need me, and I have no need of such unethical behavior. There are rules, even though Oprah doesn't seem to know them.
She is a mere entertainer, and as such, she carefully manages any controversey to her advantage on her show. As do they all.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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R.Wreck
SFN Regular
USA
1191 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2007 : 19:48:13 [Permalink]
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More on Oprah & The Secret
quote:
Worse than "The Secret's" blame-the-victim idiocy is its baldfaced bullshitting. The titular "secret" of the book is something the authors call the Law of Attraction. They maintain that the universe is governed by the principle that "like attracts like" and that our thoughts are like magnets: Positive thoughts attract positive events and negative thoughts attract negative events. Of course, magnets do exactly the opposite -- positively charged magnets attract negatively charged particles -- and the rest of "The Secret" has a similar relationship to the truth. Here it is on biblical history: "Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, Joseph, Moses, and Jesus were not only prosperity teachers, but also millionaires themselves, with more affluent lifestyles than many present-day millionaires could conceive of." And worse than the idiocy and the bullshitting is its anti-intellectualism, because that's at the root of the other two. Here's "The Secret" on reading and, um, electricity: "When I discovered 'The Secret' I made a decision that I would not watch the news or read newspapers anymore, because it did not make me feel good," and, "How does it work? Nobody knows. Just like nobody knows how electricity works. I don't, do you?" And worst of all is the craven consumerist worldview at the heart of "The Secret," because it's why the book exists: "[The Secret] is like having the Universe as your catalogue. You flip through it and say, 'I'd like to have this experience and I'd like to have that product and I'd like to have a person like that.' It is you placing your order with the Universe. It's really that easy." That's from Dr. Joe Vitale, former Amway executive and contributor to "The Secret," on Oprah.com.
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The foundation of morality is to . . . give up pretending to believe that for which there is no evidence, and repeating unintelligible propositions about things beyond the possibliities of knowledge.
T. H. Huxley
The Cattle Prod of Enlightened Compassion
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2007 : 19:50:29 [Permalink]
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quote:
That's from Dr. Joe Vitale, former Amway executive and contributor to "The Secret," on Oprah.com.
Well, that pretty much says it all right there, doesn't it?
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
| Edited by - H. Humbert on 03/08/2007 19:50:39 |
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Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular
Canada
510 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2007 : 01:21:22 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by H. Humbert
quote:
That's from Dr. Joe Vitale, former Amway executive and contributor to "The Secret," on Oprah.com.
Well, that pretty much says it all right there, doesn't it?
I think Vitale was the Chiropractor con-artist I heard interviewed on the local CBC AM radio station this afternoon regarding a talk followed by a showing of "The Secret" ($25 Cdn a head) - a former Amway executive - this gets scuzzier by the minute. At least the interviewer used the phrase "True Believers" and was somwewhat skeptical, but all in all I was glad I heard it on an empty stomach. |
"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King
History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms
"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler
"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell
"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson |
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marfknox
SFN Die Hard
USA
3739 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2007 : 04:39:15 [Permalink]
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My Humanist group unfortunately invited someone who spouted such a message at one of our program meetings. Susie Beiler, Holistic Health Counselor: http://www.integrativenutrition.com/graduates/sbeiler.aspx?pageid=7 To my relief, we buried her claims with skepticism. Our criticisms didn't faze her attitude, which frankly, is a shame. She claimed that while a healthy diet and lifestyle helped her problem with a fantigue syndrome, the cure was found within her own mind and positive thinking. She went on to express her belief that this was possible with any disease.
Two months before I officiated my first funeral for one of the most loving and loved, and positive person I've ever met. She was a relatively young and otherwise fit woman who died of cancer (young enough to have two sons only in their 20's). So when this holistic health counselor said all this crap about healing yourself of anything through the power of positive thinking, I got pretty steamed. I wasn't the only one. It was an audience of mostly older Humanists, so a lot of them are sick themselves, and some got pretty miffed and accused her of a philosophy which ultimately "blames the victim".
After she left we all pretty much rolled our eyes with relief and began chatting about all the ways in which her ideas are idiotic, the least of which is not that her personal story was about a fatigue syndrome. For fuck's sake - a fatigue syndrome! She compared that (something that really could have been psychosomatic) and compares it with cancer and heart disease! I think that for way too many people, what you want to believe far and away takes precedence over what is true. |
"Too much certainty and clarity could lead to cruel intolerance" -Karen Armstrong
Check out my art store: http://www.marfknox.etsy.com
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| Edited by - marfknox on 03/09/2007 04:40:34 |
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Ghost_Skeptic
SFN Regular
Canada
510 Posts |
Posted - 03/09/2007 : 06:50:03 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by marfknox
After she left we all pretty much rolled our eyes with relief and began chatting about all the ways in which her ideas are idiotic, the least of which is not that her personal story was about a fatigue syndrome. For fuck's sake - a fatigue syndrome! She compared that (something that really could have been psychosomatic) and compares it with cancer and heart disease! I think that for way too many people, what you want to believe far and away takes precedence over what is true.
Or a fatigue syndrome can be succesfully ignored even it is not psychosomatic. It is also something that often goes away by itself - my personal experience. |
"You can lead a horse to water but you can't make him drink. / You can send a kid to college but you can't make him think." - B.B. King
History is made by stupid people - The Arrogant Worms
"The greater the ignorance the greater the dogmatism." - William Osler
"Religion is the natural home of the psychopath" - Pat Condell
"The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter" - Thomas Jefferson |
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The Secret
