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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 06/01/2007 : 07:07:56 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by pleco
Originally posted by filthy
I disagree, bro.
In many ways, Billy Graham is/was downright scary. He has a tremendous force of personality and a voice that, from the pulpit, can shake you up (you have to have heard it from his own mouth to appreciate it). In that he himself, firmly believes his message adds a great force to his performance.
Billy did not involve himself very deeply in partisan politics. While I'm sure he voted conservative Republican, he supported and advised every president since Eisenhower. And, unlike other, well-known evangelists, he actually gave money away by means of his charities, such as Samaritan's Purse, rather than steal it all for himself. As I recall, he paid himself a modest but comfortable stipend and the rest went into and through his ministry.
Can you imagine a room containing Dobson, Falwell, Robertson, Hinn, Wildemon, Perkins, Swaggert, LeHay(s), Hovind (hah!), Ham, Bakker (hah again!) and the rest of the purveyors of dubious piety -- can you imagine the silence, that would fall over it if Billy walked through the door? And then the sounds of the frantic pandering and sucking-up that would follow because they know that they are not fit to clean dogshit from his shoes?
I don't buy his message, but no one has ever delivered it better. He is the only one of the well-known pulpit-pounders that I have any respect for at all.
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To me, he is/was definitely the most dangerous of them all. He promoted the Lie with a smile and compassion.
The others are easy to spot and to argue against because of the hatred they spew. It is much harder to point out the foibles in a man that seemingly is so nice.
I did some research on his views on evolution and homosexuality. Surprisingly to me, he does not hold homosexuality as any greater sin than that of pride, or coveting, etc. though he still views it as a sin. On evolution, he is a theistic evolutionist. He states the Bible is not a Book of Science, and if God created man and used evolution to do it, it still means God created Man Source
So I guess he is the least dishonest of them all. I'll grant that he seems to be a man of great compassion, and that if all Christians were like him, we wouldn't have near as many problems as we do today.
But, he still promotes magic thinking, and we know where that road will lead a person.
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Exactly right! Billy is, or at least was, the most dangerous of them all due to his rather easy yet powerful and sincere presence. Hell, he even got a hard atheist such as I to like and respect him, regardless of his message of superstition. I would love to sit down and share a pitcher and swap a few sea-stories with him.
I wonder, is Franklin Graham up to filling his shoes? At this point, I don't think so, but we'll see.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2007 : 07:20:30 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
I saw a clip of Billy speaking at the event. At one point he said, "I feel like I'm at my own funeral."
Easy to get from there to "Billy has died," ain't it?
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Yeh. As I said earlier, I wasn't paying the attention I could have been, but then, in my defense, most network news isn't worth much attention -- thank Mercury for the blogs.
I think he's tired and hurting, and ready to go; indeed, looking forward to it.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 06/01/2007 : 21:08:54 [Permalink]
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I'll agree with filthy on one point about Graham, he is a powerfull speaker.
Graham convinced the gayest person I have ever met (think Big Gay Al from SouthPark, seriously, this guy looks AND talks just like that character) that he should go straight.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 06/02/2007 : 20:35:44 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by BigPapaSmurf
Are you trying to get Valiant Dancer and Halfmooner all excited? They both had BG in the Dead Pool.
Just a reminder, killing your dead pool listees gets you removed from the contest! So does faking their deaths!
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Takes more than an old fart kicking off to get me up.
Will take a cute chick in a red teddy, though. ;)
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Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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TOR Hershman
Not Funny
51 Posts |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 06/03/2007 : 02:42:06 [Permalink]
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I suppose my attitude toward Billy Graham is to damn him with faint praise.
Though a Southern Baptist, Graham is not the kind of fundamentalist who has promoted bigotry by claiming Biblical authority for it. In fact, he refused to preach in South Africa until the former apartheid regime allowed his audiences to sit together integrated, and even then he openly condemned apartheid. During Martin Luther King's anti-segregation campaigns, Graham often footed King's bail.
I recall that back in the late 1950's, my teen-aged sister attended a Billy Graham crusade in San Diego. She was so overcome with his preaching that she joined the throngs of people who went down to the stage to receive the Lord (or whatever hey called it). I remember, as a preteen, being quite critical of my sister for this act, which I considered a part of a deliberate mass hysteria.
Unlike the Falwells, the Robertsons, the Dobsons, et al, Graham has not used his remarkable speaking skills to actively promote bigotry and evil. But he has spent a lifetime in an effective campaign to promote the magical thinking of Christianity. He has doubtless drawn many people away from becoming critical thinkers. About the only good thing I can think of about his effective preaching is that he may also have drawn some people away from the more virulent, theocratic, evangelists.
In the predictions for this year that were posted late in 2006, I included the death of Graham. I did not do so because I hate him, but merely because he's so old and frail. Were Graham to die, I would not rejoice, as I have about Jerry "Good Riddance" Falwell. But if Billy's going to kick the bucket soon anyway, I'd prefer he schedule it during this calendar year.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 06/03/2007 02:47:50 |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2007 : 03:17:32 [Permalink]
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TOR, long urls fuck up the format and make the page irritating to read.
Please use this: Welcome to TinyURL!™
Are you sick of posting URLs in emails only to have it break when sent causing the recipient to have to cut and paste it back together? Then you've come to the right place. By entering in a URL in the text field below, we will create a tiny URL that will not break in email postings and never expires.
Enter a long URL to make tiny:
An example
Turn this URL:
http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?ovi=1&mqma
p.x=300&mqmap.y=75&mapdata=%252bKZmeiIh6N%252bI
gpXRP3bylMaN0O4z8OOUkZWYe7NRH6ldDN96YFTIUmSH3Q6
OzE5XVqcuc5zb%252fY5wy1MZwTnT2pu%252bNMjOjsHjvN
lygTRMzqazPStrN%252f1YzA0oWEWLwkHdhVHeG9sG6cMrf
XNJKHY6fML4o6Nb0SeQm75ET9jAjKelrmqBCNta%252bsKC
9n8jslz%252fo188N4g3BvAJYuzx8J8r%252f1fPFWkPYg%
252bT9Su5KoQ9YpNSj%252bmo0h0aEK%252bofj3f6vCP
into this tinyURL:
http://tinyurl.com/6 |
Thanks.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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TOR Hershman
Not Funny
51 Posts |
Posted - 06/04/2007 : 18:13:13 [Permalink]
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Thank you most kindly, Filthy.
Moi tillist now knew not of TinyURL; it's a gassss and I shall use it oft times, as in.....right now, on another post.
Stay on Groovin' Safari,
Tor (I've gone from the "TOR" spellin') Hershman |
http://torhershman.blogspot.com/ |
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skeptic griggsy
Skeptic Friend
USA
77 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2007 : 08:00:12 [Permalink]
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Well, I am glad the fellow is now a theistic evolutionist and has been a racial progressive,but his theology is still there .As Paul Kurtz notes in his"The Transcendental Temptation," the supernatural and the paranormal are both anti-rational .Like Sylvia Browne,he preys on people's fears and hopes. Yes, there is no God in foxholes! One should get that into the media. |
Fr. Griggs rests in his Socratic ignorance and humble naturalism. Logic is the bane of theists.Religion is mythinformation. Reason saves, not a dead Galilean fanatic. |
| Edited by - skeptic griggsy on 06/06/2007 08:02:35 |
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Jarrid
Skeptic Friend
101 Posts |
Posted - 06/22/2007 : 16:53:54 [Permalink]
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Actually, I'm pretty sure it was his wife that passed...saw it on the news a while back.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19266612/ |
I don't have to go swimming through an outhouse to know I wouldn't like it." |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 06/22/2007 : 17:55:17 [Permalink]
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Yes, but that sad event happened days after Filthy's hallucination/revelation/bad TV reception/confusion of the word "dedicated" with "dead."
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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skeptic griggsy
Skeptic Friend
USA
77 Posts |
Posted - 07/15/2007 : 11:40:04 [Permalink]
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| Just how much has this luny contributed to irrationality in the world?[He says he is a Democrat.]Just how happy is he! Does he really fathom the notion of Hell? We can thank Franklin and one of his sisters to give us enjoyment after he passes on!They love telling how sinful and worthy of Hell people are, but people can be born again to be in a loving relationship with Sky Pappy.Ah, the excuses they have for Pappy not to stop carnage! How they can rationalize stupidity!What a world-wide funeral he will have! Maybe Christopher Hitchings will say something to show contemp for his irrationality as he did for Fallwell's meanness! |
Fr. Griggs rests in his Socratic ignorance and humble naturalism. Logic is the bane of theists.Religion is mythinformation. Reason saves, not a dead Galilean fanatic. |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 07/15/2007 : 14:33:36 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by skeptic griggsy
Just how much has this luny contributed to irrationality in the world?[He says he is a Democrat.]Just how happy is he! Does he really fathom the notion of Hell? We can thank Franklin and one of his sisters to give us enjoyment after he passes on!They love telling how sinful and worthy of Hell people are, but people can be born again to be in a loving relationship with Sky Pappy.Ah, the excuses they have for Pappy not to stop carnage! How they can rationalize stupidity!What a world-wide funeral he will have! Maybe Christopher Hitchings will say something to show contemp for his irrationality as he did for Fallwell's meanness!
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It's like discovering a tribe of cannibals, and then noting that some of them are relatively "nice" cannibals because they don't eat their own children, while others are "nasty" cannibals because they do. Despite Graham being a "nice" theist, he's still using irrationality to dine upon his flock.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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Rev. Billy Graham has died.
