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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
 Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:04:02 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Dave, 75 year and 100 year leases are de facto sales. |
If the person who "bought" some property can't turn around and sell it themselves, then there was no sale, no matter how long the term was. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:12:39 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Dave, 75 year and 100 year leases are de facto sales. |
If the person who "bought" some property can't turn around and sell it themselves, then there was no sale, no matter how long the term was.
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Cuba did not sell anything to America either. Yet America sits there in violation (purported) of international law.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:19:29 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Is this only one more step towards ending national sovereignty and creating corporate government.
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I don't get the way you go on about the USA being a de facto communist state and then in this topic you state we're becoming a corporate government. I'm not an expert on this but the two strike me as being mutually exclusive. A communist style government would supposedly lean towards government ownership of everything and a corporate model would lean private ownership of everything. Perhaps neither has to be absolute in what they strive for but I think it's clear that it's one or the other. We can't be both at the same time.
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Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law!
Sportsbettingacumen.com: The science of sports betting |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:26:27 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Cuba did not sell anything to America either. Yet America sits there in violation (purported) of international law. |
It seems that might be due to Cuba not pushing for eviction all that hard, so your response is completely irrelevant to the question at hand. Unless you think the private toll road companies are going to somehow prevent themselves from being hauled into court after they violate the terms of a 99-year lease. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:31:10 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by @tomic
Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Is this only one more step towards ending national sovereignty and creating corporate government.
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I don't get the way you go on about the USA being a de facto communist state and then in this topic you state we're becoming a corporate government. I'm not an expert on this but the two strike me as being mutually exclusive. A communist style government would supposedly lean towards government ownership of everything and a corporate model would lean private ownership of everything. Perhaps neither has to be absolute in what they strive for but I think it's clear that it's one or the other. We can't be both at the same time.
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Ahh, we come to the quick. Corporate ownership of a communistic state would in theory satisfy many needs. Both for the owners and the peoples. Do not think theses ideas of corporatism, republic, democracy, and communism are static. They are being blended to produce a more efficient society.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:34:10 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Cuba did not sell anything to America either. Yet America sits there in violation (purported) of international law. |
It seems that might be due to Cuba not pushing for eviction all that hard, so your response is completely irrelevant to the question at hand. Unless you think the private toll road companies are going to somehow prevent themselves from being hauled into court after they violate the terms of a 99-year lease.
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What will be in 99 years is anyones guess. Would any one have guessed in 1908 that America would have an empire covering the world? What would you suppose will be in 99 years from today?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 22:42:19 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
What will be in 99 years is anyones guess. Would any one have guessed in 1908 that America would have an empire covering the world? What would you suppose will be in 99 years from today? |
Still avoiding a productive discussion by steering off into further irrelevancies, I see. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/09/2007 : 23:46:39 [Permalink]
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Dave, do you have a reply to this quote?
"Corporate ownership of a communistic state would in theory satisfy many needs. Both for the owners and the peoples. Do not think theses ideas of corporatism, republic, democracy, and communism are static. They are being blended to produce a more efficient society."
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2007 : 04:48:46 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Dave, do you have a reply to this quote?
"Corporate ownership of a communistic state would in theory satisfy many needs. Both for the owners and the peoples. Do not think theses ideas of corporatism, republic, democracy, and communism are static. They are being blended to produce a more efficient society." |
I don't know about Dave, but I find the statement to be nothing but an attempt by you to give yourself a giant Get Out of Jail Free card. You've effectively said that terms like "communism" no longer have the meaning we think they do. Thus, when you make utterly absurd statements like "the US is a de facto communist state" and are unable to back up your argument when called on it, you can simply say "by communism, I mean something completely different than what you have in mind, so I'm still right." And then, when @tomic makes the very keen observation that the arguments you make here are the opposite of the ones you are making in other threads, you can throw out comments like this to try and argue that you don't mean what we think you mean. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2007 : 07:57:56 [Permalink]
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Cune, do you think I was unaware of the two topics I posted at the same time? Why not discuss the topic as opposed to your perceptions of my motivations?
Corporate ownership of a communistic state is not a mutually exclusive proposition.
Communism means what it always has meant, in fact you were given the tenets and the text to read. Do you know what communism is outside of "cold war" propaganda? Have you read the text?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2007 : 08:51:43 [Permalink]
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| Cune, do you think I was unaware of the two topics I posted at the same time? Why not discuss the topic as opposed to your perceptions of my motivations? |
Now I know you're just messing with us. I'm done.
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Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law!
Sportsbettingacumen.com: The science of sports betting |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2007 : 09:02:30 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by @tomic
| Cune, do you think I was unaware of the two topics I posted at the same time? Why not discuss the topic as opposed to your perceptions of my motivations? |
Now I know you're just messing with us. I'm done.
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Absolutely not: "messing with us".
These are two ideas that converge on a larger idea.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2007 : 13:27:20 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Valiant Dancer, great to hear the people are standing up. But, has not Chicago leased long term a toll road to a foreign private corporation?
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Nope. The Skyway deal fell through. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 06/10/2007 : 18:15:33 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Cune, do you think I was unaware of the two topics I posted at the same time? Why not discuss the topic as opposed to your perceptions of my motivations? |
That would be far easier if you didn't obfuscate all the time.
| Corporate ownership of a communistic state is not a mutually exclusive proposition. |
No, it's just an untenable proposition.
| Communism means what it always has meant, in fact you were given the tenets and the text to read. Do you know what communism is outside of "cold war" propaganda? Have you read the text? |
Then you're delusional, since the state doesn't own the means of production in the US. |
| Edited by - Cuneiformist on 06/10/2007 18:15:58 |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/11/2007 : 21:36:23 [Permalink]
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obfuscate: to confuse.
To the contrary, I am specific in my meaning. It is not a fault of mine that ones predetermined world views obfuscate obvious conclusions to facts presented.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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