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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
 Posted - 06/17/2007 : 10:35:43 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
These Chinese feathered dino fossils remind me of piltdown man. 42 years of evolutionary science built on a fake. |
There was little, if any, evolutionary science built on Piltdown man. You're displaying your ignorance for all to see, Jerome, and yet preaching as if you've got evidence.| I am willing to bet the feathered dino fossils fetch a pretty penny when sold. During my research I have found many Chinese bird fossils sold as real that are proved fake. |
But you're not going to present evidence of that here, are you?| When science builds on false assumptions false conclusions are created. |
And when Jerome builds upon false assumptions, he thinks it's the truth. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 11:15:16 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
These Chinese feathered dino fossils remind me of piltdown man. 42 years of evolutionary science built on a fake.
I am willing to bet the feathered dino fossils fetch a pretty penny when sold. During my research I have found many Chinese bird fossils sold as real that are proved fake.
When science builds on false assumptions false conclusions are created.
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So now Jerome is reading out of the creationist playbook...
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
 Posted - 06/17/2007 : 11:25:31 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
These Chinese feathered dino fossils remind me of piltdown man. 42 years of evolutionary science built on a fake.
I am willing to bet the feathered dino fossils fetch a pretty penny when sold. During my research I have found many Chinese bird fossils sold as real that are proved fake.
When science builds on false assumptions false conclusions are created.
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By the way Jerome, Piltdown man was debunked by scientists as a clear forgery.
But more to the point, filthy provided you with pictures that clearly show feathers on the fossils. The descriptions of those fossils have been substantiated by peer review.
When Piltdown man was finally subjected to the same kind of review that these feathered dinosaurs are being subjected to, the Piltdown hoax was revealed.
Piltdown is an example of how science works. Not an example of how science fails to work…
Only creationists try to turn that around. It's a red herring.
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 11:40:11 [Permalink]
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| Filthy, there are no feathers. I did notice that the shaving of rock outside the fossil presents an image of wings. The upper limbs certainly resemble bird limbs; but feathers are not there. |
I wonder why people think you are a troll, hmmmm.
You present conclusions with no evidence and when presented with evidence you say it is fake or it's not clear.
A good troll will acquiesce to a point when it is obvious, so that he doesn't lose all credibility, but of couse you are not a very good troll, as I have said before.
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If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 06/17/2007 : 12:12:35 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
These Chinese feathered dino fossils remind me of piltdown man. 42 years of evolutionary science built on a fake.
I am willing to bet the feathered dino fossils fetch a pretty penny when sold. During my research I have found many Chinese bird fossils sold as real that are proved fake.
When science builds on false assumptions false conclusions are created.
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That is so pathetic that I won't even call it a red herring. Only an idiot would go off on that tangent. Piltdown be damned, you should be considering my question:
| Here's the quiz: why are there so many artist's conceptions of these animals and so few photos of the actual fossils in popular publications? Think about it and I'll expect your carefully considered answer tomorrow. |
Another question: What gives you the idea that these Chinese specimens are faked? Is Dr. Xing Xu, who blew the cover of Archaeoraptor, in cahoots with their makers? Elaborate, and please provide reference.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 06/17/2007 12:15:46 |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 12:26:51 [Permalink]
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Filthy said "What gives you the idea that these Chinese specimens are faked? Is Dr. Xing Xu, who blew the cover of Archaeoraptor, in cahoots with their makers? Elaborate, and please provide reference."
Simple competition of resources. Only so much glory and money to go around.
Kil, I do not read creationist propaganda.
Piltdown man was the proof of man to ape theory for 42 years. Much science was built from this. This is about 30% of the existence of the theory time wise; very substantial. Much science was built on this proof.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 13:09:01 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Kil, I do not read creationist propaganda. |
You could have fooled me...
| Piltdown man was the proof of man to ape theory for 42 years. Much science was built from this. This is about 30% of the existence of the theory time wise; very substantial. Much science was built on this proof. |
Elaborate, please. With supporting references. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 13:34:48 [Permalink]
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The Origin of Species was written in 1859.
Piltdown man was collected in 1912.
Piltdown discovered fraud in 1953.
It is currently 2007.
Evolutionary theory is 148 years old.
Pitdown was proof of theory for 41 years.
At the beginning of public consence of the evolutionary theorys existence it was built on the false assumption that piltdown was proof of man transitioning to ape.
In fact piltdown was the evidence used to force evolution into public talk.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 14:19:30 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
The Origin of Species was written in 1859.
Piltdown man was collected in 1912.
Piltdown discovered fraud in 1953.
It is currently 2007.
Evolutionary theory is 148 years old.
Pitdown was proof of theory for 41 years.
At the beginning of public consence of the evolutionary theorys existence it was built on the false assumption that piltdown was proof of man transitioning to ape.
In fact piltdown was the evidence used to force evolution into public talk.
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I'm calling bullshit! The ToE was well established before Piltdown. Piltdown, a fraud that you obviously know little about, was viewed as a link in hominid ancestory. Unfortunatly, the London Museum had it locked away and it was observable only from casts. However, there were not a few scientists that had doubts about it because it flew in the face of other finds in Europe.
But back to the feathered Chinese Dinos; where do you get the idea that these fossils are frauds? Kindly provide some reference other than misdirection and hand-waving.
I will be asking for the answer to the quiz tomorrow, early. Will you have one?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 15:03:59 [Permalink]
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Ricky, could you provide the "boat loads" of evidence in regards to evolutionary theory in 1912?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 15:06:04 [Permalink]
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Filthy said "The ToE was well established before Piltdown."
In the public mind? With public funding?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2007 : 15:09:00 [Permalink]
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Filthy you provided evidence of fraud.
The point being if fraud can occur for 41 years, and fraud is currently happening; why would you take on faith the fossils not currently classified as fraud real?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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Xing Xu, Big Bird and the Six Day Shuffle
