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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 02/22/2008 : 07:36:25 [Permalink]
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I have yet to see any sort of convincing evidence that man killed off all of the megafauna by his lonesome. I'm sure that we had a hand in it -- Clovis was one hell of a big game hunter -- but I think that there were other factors involved, probably involving climate. Really, it wouldn't take all that much of a change to weaken a species perfectly adapted a status quo, especally if that change came suddenly (geologically speaking). It might be that they were already well on their trip to oblivion when we crossed the Bering land bridge. It is also concievable that we brought foreign microbes with us that the various fauna were susceptable to, compounding the situation. Also, how sure are we of the fauna's reproductive cycles? I would think that, like large mammals today, it was relativly slow; a single offspring at a time, or perhaps twins at most, requiring a great deal of parential care for an extended period.
Against all that lot, the small populations of hunter-gathers scattered about would only have had but a modest impact.
All speculation of course but there's not much else, is there?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 02/22/2008 08:32:02 |
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chaloobi
SFN Regular
1620 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2008 : 08:14:04 [Permalink]
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Just one comment on the microbe thing, weren't the mammoths either common to both Eurasia and the Americas or didn't the humans and mammoths cross the land bridge at the same time? I know there's lots of frozen mammoth corpses found in the Siberian permafrost, so they were definitely in Asia. And in that case, the microbe thing shouldn't have been an issue with a global die off.
And regarding the other critters - bison, big cats, sloths, and all manner of other mega-fauna went extinct. I can't believe this was all due to stone-age super-hunters. It had to be the change in climate - all those beasties were cold-weather adapted... |
-Chaloobi
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2008 : 08:30:11 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by chaloobi
Just one comment on the microbe thing, weren't the mammoths either common to both Eurasia and the Americas or didn't the humans and mammoths cross the land bridge at the same time? I know there's lots of frozen mammoth corpses found in the Siberian permafrost, so they were definitely in Asia. And in that case, the microbe thing shouldn't have been an issue with a global die off.
And regarding the other critters - bison, big cats, sloths, and all manner of other mega-fauna went extinct. I can't believe this was all due to stone-age super-hunters. It had to be the change in climate - all those beasties were cold-weather adapted...
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Agree entirely. As to the microbes, who says that they couldn't have at least weakened the Asian populations? Assuming, of course, that these bugs actually existed. Could be that that's where they orginated and were vectored to this continent by immigrating humans. Or, here's a more likely thought, by carrion feeding birds such as crows, ravens, vultures & gulls.
A whole lot of 'could be,' ain't there?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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chaloobi
SFN Regular
1620 Posts |
Posted - 02/22/2008 : 13:15:50 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
Originally posted by chaloobi
Just one comment on the microbe thing, weren't the mammoths either common to both Eurasia and the Americas or didn't the humans and mammoths cross the land bridge at the same time? I know there's lots of frozen mammoth corpses found in the Siberian permafrost, so they were definitely in Asia. And in that case, the microbe thing shouldn't have been an issue with a global die off.
And regarding the other critters - bison, big cats, sloths, and all manner of other mega-fauna went extinct. I can't believe this was all due to stone-age super-hunters. It had to be the change in climate - all those beasties were cold-weather adapted...
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Agree entirely. As to the microbes, who says that they couldn't have at least weakened the Asian populations? Assuming, of course, that these bugs actually existed. Could be that that's where they orginated and were vectored to this continent by immigrating humans. Or, here's a more likely thought, by carrion feeding birds such as crows, ravens, vultures & gulls.
A whole lot of 'could be,' ain't there?
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Yeah, lots. Like the warming climate could have increased the range of disease vectors. |
-Chaloobi
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Beelzebufo ampinga
