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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 05/23/2008 :  09:55:13  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
A tip o' the hat to PZ for posting about The Hovind Scale, the latest of several metrics skeptics can use to quantify woo. There is even a simple-to-use online calculator for the Hovind Scale.

Ensuring that we have reliable measures for woo is the only way we can scientifically address the problem of woo, specifically allowing us to focus our efforts and efficiently eliminate the most woo for the least cost (in time, labor and sanity). The Hovind Scale thus joins our growing armament of measures, including...

...The Crackpot Index, useful for determining the whackitude of physics claims (Baez' original seems to be down right now).

...The Quackery Index, based on the Crackpot Index but geared towards medical nonsense (by yours truly).

...and The Dembski, a unit of error measurement (for example, "people who think the Earth is only 6,000 years old are off by 0.09 Dembskis"). There's an Online Calculator for Demskis, too, including more explanation near the bottom of the page.

Are there more? I think I'm forgetting one or two...

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.

Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend

Sweden
9688 Posts

Posted - 05/23/2008 :  13:50:19   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Dr. Mabuse an ICQ Message Send Dr. Mabuse a Private Message  Reply with Quote
I tried to plug in Michael Mozina in the Howind online calculator and got a Howind Factor of 6. But selections are subject to interpretation, what do you get, Dave? You debated him more than me.

Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3

"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse

Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 05/23/2008 :  14:38:37   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Use the Crackpot Index for Mozina. The Hovind Scale is for creationists.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard

USA
4907 Posts

Posted - 05/23/2008 :  18:07:14   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Send Ricky an AOL message Send Ricky a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Perhaps I'm looking too deeply into this, but I find it ironic there are parallels between what index to use for crackpots and what method to use for radioactive dating.

Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist

USA
4955 Posts

Posted - 05/23/2008 :  20:52:35   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send Cuneiformist a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Use the Crackpot Index for Mozina. The Hovind Scale is for creationists.
The problem is how, in a discussion that was something like 1500+ posts, to fairly figure "5 points for every statement that is clearly vacuous, logically inconsistent, or widely agreed on to be false." I got to over 100 points for Mozina without even referring to the myriad threads. I'm afraid that if I critically went through them, I'd hit 1,000 or more in no time.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 05/23/2008 :  21:28:29   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Well, a lot of those statements are repeats. I wouldn't count the same wrong "fact" twice.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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