|
|
|
|
dimossi
Skeptic Friend
USA
141 Posts |
 Posted - 04/12/2002 : 06:53:57
|
Bill Maher praises the increase of the non-religious in the United States, a fundamentalist Christian sits next to a lesbian and acts like the biggest intolerant jerk that has ever been on the show, and more. Quite a show! Here is the transcript
(sorry in advance that it is a bit long, but it is only kept on the PI site for a week so I didn't want to just link to it):
Transcript for Wednesday, April 10, 2002
Morgan Fairchild
John Lofton
Ted Rall
Suzanne Westenhoefer
Bill: Good evening.
Welcome to "Politically Incorrect." Let me tell you who is on here tonight.
Suzanne Westenhoefer, you are a very funny comedienne.
You'll be in Houston at The Last Shop tomorrow.
Suzanne: As a matter of fact.
Bill: Yes, you will.
Suzanne: Oh, well, I gotta go.
I gotta get in line.
[ Light laughter ]
Bill: John Lofton, we have had you on before, not for a few years.
You are, I guess, I would say an evangelist.
This is your newsletter, "The Lofton Letter." And you write for "The Washington Times."
John: Nope.
No more.
Bill: No more.
Like I said, you're fired.
Welcome back, sir.
[ Laughter ]
And we all know how that feels.
Ted Rall --
[ Audience ohs ]
[ Laughter ]
Ted Rall, you have 80-pound balls, I gotta tell you.
You are one of the most successful cartoonists in America, and you just draw it as you see it.
And this is your new book, "To Afghanistan and Back," with introduction by Bill Maher.
Ted: That's right.
Bill: And Morgan Fairchild, we've all been in love with you for many years.
Jon Lovitz used to lie about you.
You're also an author and activist, and your new movie, "Teddy Bear's Picnic," is in theaters now.
Give a hand to our panel if you would.
[ Applause ]
Okay.
Suzanne: I don't wanna sit next to him.
Bill: All right, well --
Suzanne: Who did I hurt that I have to sit next to him? I was on your show long ago.
John: Don't spit on me.
[ Laughter ]
Bill: What a way to start.
He hasn't said one word.
Suzanne: But it's gonna be fine.
We love you.
Bill: Well.
[ Laughter ]
Suzanne: This touchin' you from a lesbian.
Lesbian touchin' you, okay.
John: Don't spit on me, please.
[ Laughter ]
Sandra Bernard, remember that?
Bill: That's right.
Years ago, we sat John --
Suzanne: And she spit on you?
John: Well, the second-most news she'll ever make.
Bill: Right.
Sandra Bernhardt --
Suzanne: I didn't used to like Sandra that much.
Now --
Bill: I don't know why we always sit you next to a lesbian, John.
John: I don't know.
Must be some affirmative action or something.
Bill: All right.
Shut up, you two.
[ Laughter ]
And let's begin the show.
Morgan: Be masterful, Bill.
Go for it.
Bill: And the show's over, good night.
[ Light laughter ]
We --
I hate to keep talking about the Catholic church, but they keep making news.
Scandals keep rocking the church.
And if this church is rockin', don't come a-knockin', because you know --
[ Laughter ]
Now it has spread to Cleveland yesterday.
And so, the question I wanna ask today --
I have many questions about the Catholic church, because I was brought up in the Catholic church.
But, certainly, the priests who were around this --
the ones who weren't involved, knew about it.
I mean, come on.
It had to be like "Cops," right? Even if you're not taking the bribe, you know about the guys who are.
Even if you're not with the plunger in the bathroom, you knew that guy was a bad cop who did stuff like that.
Ted: It's the good ol' boys network, big-time.
There's no doubt about it.
It's just like in politics.
It's in the police department.
These guys knew, and that's the worst part about it.
I mean, there's bad apples in every organization.
The Catholic church has bad priests, and these guys knew about it, and they covered it up, and that's why they're in big trouble, and they ought to be in big trouble.
Bill: Yeah, but I'm not just talking about the bad apples, you know, the actual pedophiles.
And I'd hate to guess what percentage of the priesthood is that.
But, I mean, what about the rest of the guys there, the thin black line, who didn't say a word for all these years while this was going on under their collars?
Suzanne: But, you know, how hard would that be? I mean, do you wanna be the one? You're a priest and --
you gotta give them --
and how do they know it's for sure? If you don't walk in on them with a kid, are you gonna be the one to make that accusation?
Morgan: It's the complaint --
Suzanne: That would be --
now, if someone who's covering up --
I mean, if they're actually coming to you, and they have proof, and they're saying it, that's so different, but I mean, that happens in schools.
There are teachers and principals who turn their blind eye to teachers that they know molest kids.
Bill: Yeah, but schools don't hold themselves up as the moral leaders of society.
Schoolteachers don't say that they are better than everyone else morally.
Suzanne: Right.
Bill: And, please, I mean, priests live in a rectory.
[ Laughter ]
I think they do know when --
Suzanne: I think that the --
Bill: I mean, where --
Suzanne: Living as a priest or a nun is slightly --
at any point, it's a little dysfunctional anyway.
It just is.
You've made a choice to literally take yourself out of society and intimacy and sexuality, and kind of --
you're married to Jesus?
John: Well --
there's a problem that's even bigger than what's currently in the news.
And that is in the Roman Catholic church and the Protestant church, overwhelmingly, God's word is not taken seriously.
Sin and temptation are not taking --
are not taken seriously.
And when you don't take sin seriously --
[ Laughter ]
Bill: I'm not laughing at --
John: You are laughing.
Suzanne: I am.
[ Talking over each other ]
[ Laughter and applause ]
I'm the best example.
Bill: I am not laughing at you.
I'm laughing near you.
[ Laughter ]
Morgan: John, let me just tell you, I take sin very seriously, and I have made a fortune on it.
[ Laughter ]
[ Cheers and applause ]
John: That's a big joke.
Suzanne: Yes.
And you're the only one who doesn't get the joke.
John: But you see, when you don't --
sin, the violation of God's --
Suzanne: Sin, the violation --
Bill: Whoa, whoa.
Let him --
John: May I speak?
Bill: Let him finish.
John: And then you can defend sin, okay?
Suzanne: Okay.
[ Light laughter ]
I can.
John: Presumably, you don't think it's right for these men to have sex with these children, right?
Bill: I'm gonna go out on a limb there and agree with you, yes.
[ Laughter ]
[ Talking over each other ]
John: Why is it wrong, Bill? Why is it wrong?
Suzanne: 'Cause they're children.
John: I'm not talking to you.
I'm not talking to you.
Suzanne: I know.
You're afraid of me.
They're children.
Bill: Come on.
Let him --
John: Why is it wrong?
Suzanne: 'Cause they're children!
John: Why is it wrong?
Bill: You got me.
John: Seriously.
You mock the idea of sin.
You mock the idea of God's law.
And then when I say, "Why is it wrong, why should it be a crime," which, I assume you think it should be, why? Tell me why.
Bill: But you know what should be mocked is people who cannot tell the difference between the sin, a real sin, of having sex with children --
John: Right.
Bill: --
And then there are the other sins in the Bible like homosexuality, like --
John: So you think --
Bill: Homosexuality.
[ Laughter ]
John: So you believe that sex with children is a sin?
Bill: Yes, I do.
John: You believe sin is the violation of God's Law?
Bill: No, I don't think God has laws, because --
Suzanne: When did he become the host? But you're doing very well.
John: What is a sin?
Suzanne: There is no sin.
John: I'm asking him.
He said he believes that sex with children is a sin.
Suzanne: It is not a sin.
It is wrong.
Sin is something Christians and people like you --
John: Why is it wrong? Why is it wrong? What is the standard by which you judge something to be wrong?
Suzanne: Violation of a --
if a child doesn't want to.
They're not wanting to.
John: So if they wanted to, it would be okay.
Suzanne: No.
And guess why not? Do you know why not? Do you have any idea?
John: See how lost you are? When you don't believe in --
[ Laughter ]
Seriously.
When you don't believe in God's Law and God's word --
Morgan: No, John.
Some of us believe in God, but we don't think some of these laws that you set down as hard-core sins necessarily qualifies as sin.
John: Like sex with children.
You believe sex with children is a sin?
Morgan: I don't think it's a sin.
I think it's morally wrong.
John: It's morally wrong.
Morgan: It's wrong.
Between judging people --
Bill: I think what we're saying is that we don't need religion or we don't need God to know that it's wrong to do it with a kid.
John: Oh, you can do good without God, huh?
[ Applause ]
John: You're not doing too good on that.
And by the way, you should know that for a thousand years, the basis --
the basis of Western law is the Bible.
Bill: Yeah.
Suzanne: So?
John: For a thousand years, Western law --
Suzanne: So what?
John: I thought you said we don't need religion.
Bill: First of all --
first of all, the basis of Western law is not the Bible.
It's the Magna Carta, okay?
John: No.
Bill: Second of all, whether someone is religious is a poor predictor of their morality.
John: I'm not talking about religion.
I'm talking about God and Christianity.
I don't care anything about religion.
Ted: John, are you saying an atheist can't be a good person?
John: I'm saying that God says that, apart from God --
Bill: That was a yes or no question.
[ Light laughter ]
Suzanne: He doesn't have those.
John: The word "Good" comes from the old English word for God.
Ted: Who is this guy, William Sapphire?
John: Listen to me.
Listen to me.
[ Laughter ]
There is no good apart from God.
The word "Good" comes from the word "God."
Suzanne: What is the word "Dog"?
Bill: Wow.
John: No.
No, that's backwards which is the way you think.
[ Light laughter ]
You have moral dyslexia.
That's your problem.
Bill: I know.
But if you were saying that good comes from God, then dog must be satan, because that's God spelled backwards.
[ Laughter ]
John: Santa Is satan.
Suzanne: My cocker spaniel is satan as far as you're concerned.
[ Light laughter ]
John: I really wish --
you know, Bill --
Bill, I wish --
Suzanne: You don't have to have him on.
And then we have to sit here and listen to this stuff that's like 12th century --
John: It's what most of the country believes.
Suzanne: No, they don't.
John: Sure they do.
Suzanne: You think these people are laughing with you?
John: More than 90% of the people in this country say they're Christian.
[ Laughter and applause ]
They say they're Christian.
Suzanne: Listen to them.
Are these not the people that --
this is not the country?
Bill: As long as I did invite him on, this is my living room.
These are my guests.
Please treat him as one of my guests, as you are.
John: Thank you.
Bill: Thank you.
We'll take a break.
We'll be right back.
[ Applause ]
Bill: Well, the full-page ad that N.O.R.M.A.L., the marijuana reform group, ran in newspapers yesterday caused quite an uproar.
It showed New York Mayor Bloomberg responding to a question of whether he'd ever smoked pot by saying, "You bet, and I enjoyed it."
[ Laughter ]
Even more opportunistic, today they have one of President Bush saying, "Let's roll."
[ Laughter ]
[ Applause ]
Okay, we're talking about religion.
You said something I'm surprised that you said.
You said you don't care about religion.
Now, you are with a lot of company here in America.
I read this recently in "USA Today." 14% of Americans, 30 million adults in this country say "No religion for us." That is twice as many as a decade ago.
I think this is fantastic news that so many Americans are saying, "You know what, we don't really need fairy tales to deal with these troubling epistemological questions because --
" what?
John: Epistemological questions, huh?
Bill: Anyway --
[ Laughter ]
John: Where does knowledge come from?
Morgan: I'm proud of you.
Bill: Thank you very much.
John: Where does knowledge come from?
Bill: Knowledge comes from this show.
But --
[ Laughter ]
John: But epistemology is.
Bill: And that's probably low, because you know, people lie.
People say they're more religious than they are.
In France, 90% of the people say they're Catholic.
10% go to church.
Isn't this good news that people don't need these silly stories --
?
Suzanne: They're probably rejecting, not God, or not spirituality, but they're really rejecting what we've all --
most of us have had such trouble with is, someone saying to you, "I can tell you what the man upstairs is saying, and I can tell you how to live, and if you do it, do what I am saying is my interpretation of what's in these words," and people don't wanna hear that, because they are starting to understand truly that's wrong, that's about control.
Bill: We're growing up as a country.
Suzanne: And to reject religion does not reject God.
And I don't think it --
I've been a Buddhist a long time.
It doesn't reject your heart.
It doesn't reject your responsibility in the world, but it does reject anyone saying --
[ Laughter ]
Bill: Yes, a Buddhist lesbian.
Deal with it, man.
[ Laughter ]
[ Applause ]
John: Only in America.
[ Talking over each other ]
You know what I think of when I think of Buddhists? I think of one of my favorite magazine covers, which is "People" magazine.
It had "Tina Turner --
devout Buddhist and $5,000 a day shopper." And I thought, "Yes, whatever happened to being that one with nothingness?" That's your religion.
Why are you here?
Suzanne: No.
That has nothing to do with Buddhism.
John: Excuse me.
Sure it does.
[ Talking over each other ]
Morgan: Niemann Marcus is full of good Christians.
Bill: What's that?
Morgan: Niemann Marcus is full of good Christians.
[ Laughter ]
Suzanne: What she's saying, basically, is Christians shop as well.
Ted: You people don't believe in God anyway.
Because if you believed in God, you wouldn't be up here attacking her and acting like a big jerk in front of all these people because you know you'd be called on the carpet court in the future.
[ Cheers and applause ]
John: Hey, a devastating attack by Ted! Well, you know what, Ted? You're a big poop face, you know? I'm not a big jerk.
You're a big poop face.
[ Light laughter ]
[ Talking over each other ]
Ted: You really believe that you are gonna be called down for all of your activities for the rest of your life after you die and spend eternity burning in hell for every time you screw up?
Bill: John, I just want it on the record that the guy who doesn't believe in religion said epistemological and you said poop face.
[ Laughter ]
Now, recently, Christopher Hitchins, who I love --
he said the real axis of evil is not Iran, Iraq and North Korea.
It's Christianity, Islam and Judaism.
Ted: Right.
Suzanne: I agree.
Bill: You agree with that?
Suzanne: I do.
Bill: Now, that's a little unfair to the Jews, because --
Suzanne: No, I love Jews.
I wish I were Jewish, but I'm not Jewish.
But I'd --
Bill: The Christians and the Muslims have a lot more in common about being hard-core and killing and inquisitions than the Jews.
I never heard of a Jewish inquisition.
I mean, they complain about the air-conditioning a lot.
[ Laughter ]
John: Maybe in the Gaza Strip.
If you lived in the Gaza Strip, you would be hearing about a Jewish inquisition if you were a Palestinian.
Maybe?
Bill: You know what? We're gonna get into that topic later in the week.
I don't wanna --
John: We're gonna be here a week?
Suzanne: We are, yeah.
[ Laughter ]
Ted: Well, it seems like a week, John.
Suzanne: What they mean is, if people don't --
if people weren't fighting over "My God's better than your God," and "My interpretation of the Bible or the Koran is better than yours --
" if people did not fight about that --
John: There's only one God.
Suzanne: There would be nothing to fight about.
And so I think that's why they say that.
John: Look, look.
It is the fact that Christians felt there was something worth fighting about that we have an America! Our country was founded by Christians --
Bill: No.
Our country was founded by people getting away from religious intolerance.
John: No.
Bill: It certainly was.
Suzanne: But they came here and killed everybody.
[ Applause ]
John: Were the people who founded our country Christian? What was the religion of the Puritans, Bill? Tell us what the religion --
Suzanne: The ones that killed all the Native Americans?
[ Talking over each other ]
John: Oh, really? 1620, they didn't come here?
Bill: No, they came here in 1492 originally.
John: The Puritans?
[ Laughter ]
Bill: Not the Puritans.
John: I'm asking you about the Puritans.
Bill: The first --
the first foundation was in Jamestown in 1607.
John: It didn't go very good.
Bill: No.
John: The Puritans --
it wasn't the Puritans.
Bill: Oh, right, God wiped them out.
That's right.
They thought it was the cold winter and no food, but it was actually God who wiped them out.
John: Well, they were wiped out, weren't they?
Bill: Well, I guess you have your answer.
There you go.
[ Talking over each other ]
John: You deny the Christian founding of our country?
Bill: Yes, the founding fathers were not Christians.
John: Of course they were.
Bill: And they made a special --
John: Bill, Bill.
53 --
53 of the 55 founders who signed The Declaration were members of the organized Christian communion.
They were Presbyterians, Methodists.
They were church members.
Three --
Franklin, Jefferson, and one more --
who was the third one?
Bill: George Washington.
John: No, Washington was a member of a Christian communion.
[ Talking over each other ]
Ted: --
Keep religion out of the foundation of the government.
That's why they came up with --
[ Talking over each other ]
We do not live in the Taliban regime.
John: Our three-part government --
our separation of power of government is founded on scriptural ideas.
Suzanne: If you really believe this, why didn't they say --
why didn't they come right out and say --
John: Who?
Suzanne: --
That you can't --
the founders of our country that you say are so Christian --
John: Well, they were Christian.
Suzanne: --
Make such an effort to say, "It doesn't matter what you are, you get to be American"?
John: They didn't say that.
If you read the --
Suzanne: They don't say you have to believe in God to be an American.
[ Talking over each other ]
John: May I respond?
Bill: It's the separtaion of church and state.
John: That's not the Constitution.
Bill: That's not?
John: That was in a letter --
that was in a letter written --
Bill: That was in a letter to "Penthouse." I don't know how that got --
[ Laughter ]
I have to take a break.
We'll be right back.
[ Applause ]
Bill: Okay, now, I want to get off religion.
John: Yes, please.
[ Talking over each other ]
Bill: --
been in Afghanistan, and I want to --
Ted, like I said, you have 80-pound balls, 'cause you take on everybody, and this is one cartoon of yours.
You did another one that got you in a lot of trouble where you had one of the widows of 9/11, saying, "Fortunately, the $3.2 million I got from the Red Cross keeps me warm at night."
[ Light laughter ]
There's another one where New York City firefighters, who have collected so much of this money, and you say, "They're so rich now that they're being driven to the fires," and here's a firefighter in the back of the limousine.
"Are you sure this is the right address, Jeffrey? I don't see any smoke."
[ Light laughter ]
Just tell us why --
and you're not alone.
People think that this is something where there's a lot of grieving, and then, there's a lot of greed.
Ted: There is --
I think a lot of people are innately uncomfortable with the idea that when someone dies who's close to you, you're gonna get a big check, and that check's gonna be based on maybe how much you make or where you work or how they died.
I mean, let's face it.
If you just look at the war on terror alone, a lot of people died in Oklahoma City back in '95, in World Trade Center in 1993.
They didn't get jack, and suddenly, there's a $2 million-plus payout to the 9/11 victims.
Now, obviously, a lot of those people need help, and this cartoon is not about them.
Bill: Right.
Ted: I mean, I think if you lose your spouse in a car wreck, some drunk crosses the line, you should get --
you need help, you should get help.
But getting $2 million when you already have $2 million as a stockbroker, I just think it's a little extreme.
Bill: Right.
I don't think people realize that, but the money is not paid out evenly to everyone who died.
The busboy in the World Trade Center doesn't get the same.
It's based on what your last salary was, right?
Ted: Which just seems so counter --
Bill: No, it's not?
John: What you would have earned had you been alive.
[ Talking over each other ]
Ted: It's a formula, and some people are gonna walk away with as much as $4.5 million.
Now, I don't think anybody needs $4.5 million to make --
Morgan: I do.
[ Laughter ]
Ted: I stand corrected.
[ Talking over each other ]
Bill: But your larger point is that --
Morgan: Are you bidding, John?
John: No.
Bill: We seem to be putting forth the idea that money can compensate us for what --
[ Talking over each other ]
Ted: A lot of the widows and widowers have even said that they don't even want the money.
They don't know what to do with it.
Some of them are actually --
I read in "The New York Times" last week that one of the widows went on a shopping spree and blew $20,000 and came back and wondered what she had done.
I mean, it's nothing --
[ Talking over each other ]
John: It's another good cartoon, Ted.
It's another good cartoon to mock those widows.
[ Talking over each other ]
And you call me a jerk, drawing a cartoon like that? Sure, he's mocking widows.
Did you see the cartoon?
Ted: You didn't read it, yet.
Suzanne: I certainly did.
John: I read it.
I read it.
It's a ridiculous cartoon.
Ted: Hey, listen, if you're reading my cartoons the way you read the Bible, I don't think we can take you too seriously on this subject.
[ Laughter ]
[ Applause ]
John: I'll tell you the problem I have.
The problem I have is the idea that the government ought to be paying anybody anything.
Suzanne: Can I tell you the problem you have?
John: Not the government.
There's no Constitutional warrant for paying money to people.
Not the federal government.
Bill: Go ahead.
What is your --
?
Suzanne: Well, I think the fact is the fact that they're doing by how much someone makes is, as Morgan pointed out quietly to herself because I think she's over this a little, no, is that how the insurance companies do it, and I think that's the only thing they had to go on.
The problem is, you can't, just because this terrorist thing happened, say, now, these people get money unless they didn't have insurance like everyone else, even if something bad has happened.
It's not --
you're paying them because we feel bad that the World Trade Center got attacked.
Ted: It's the emotional response.
It's not a rational response.
Suzanne: Not that that's a horrible thing.
There are so many other places and ways that it could be done.
John: The idea of paying them was that they would agree not to sue.
Wasn't that the plan?
Bill: Okay.
I got to take a break.
We'll be right back.
[ Applause ]
Bill: Okay, keep it for next time, John.
John: Oh, okay.
Bill: This is Ted's book, "To Afghanistan and Back." The Catholic church is now offering confession with relief.
John: My newsletter --
[ Applause ]
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." [Philip K. Dick, science-fiction author]
|
|
|
Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
 Posted - 04/12/2002 : 12:31:59 [Permalink]
|
Hmm, I'm reading four intolerant jerks...
------------
Truth above pride and ego; truth above all |
 |
|
|
Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 04/12/2002 : 20:02:27 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Bill Maher praises the increase of the non-religious in the United States
It's nice that the subject is being talked about if even by a jerk like Maher. And for those who like him and follow what he says that's great to get more people thinking about the myth of religion.
I wouldn't want Maher as a spokesman for anything I believe or (don't belive) in, he is not credible IMO and he talks out of his ass. About 3/4 of the people on his show are not very intelligent either but that's a different subject.
Good to hear someone is trying to talk about something other than god blessing everything though.
* * * * *
**"I'm not going to have some reporters pawing through our papers. We are the president."
(-- Hillary Clinton commenting on the release of subpoenaed documents.)
What a witch, with a 'B'. |
|
|
|
 |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
