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Legallee Insane
Skeptic Friend
Canada
126 Posts |
 Posted - 12/14/2002 : 23:28:01
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I was just chatting on MSN with someone I don't really know that well. My name for the past little while has included the quote: "Only the fool says in his heart: There is no god -- The wise says it to the world"
This person felt the need to start a conversation with me, and began preaching that she can't understand how people can go around and not see "Him."
quote:
Her:I honestly don't understand how people do it.
Me:How people do what?
Her:just sort of sit here and blatantly deny that there is a God
That offended me simply because it follows the distinct definition of athiesm as defined by the church
I stated my atheist beliefs and the reasons for my coming to them and proceeded to ask her what makes her believe there is a god. To this she only responded with a series of blanket statements.
quote:
Her:I know him because I've heard Him, because I've seen Him and because He Is.
Me:who is what?
Her:All Is, and all will Be. Because it Is as it Is. so is God
These were some of the responses when I asked her to explain her belief in god to me:
quote:
Her:I'm not formulating wild theories, it's what I've actually seen and heard
Her:I...lol...I can't even explain it.
Her:Stop trying to see things through my eyes. You must see them through your own.
This is the biggest reason I have problems not laughing at "devout" christians who run around and shout the wisdoms of "JEE-zus" and why we should all praise the lord. They make general statements about seeing Him everywhere they look because everying is He that Is and crap like that, but when we ask them to truly explain their beliefs they avoid the topic. They make blanket statements like the ones above.
I find it laughable because she honestly thought that by telling me to go out into the world and look around unbiased and I would magically see the light and become a believer. I do look around at the world unbiased, or as unbiased as any human can possibly get, and I see everything that can be explained by science and knowledge, not whimsical beliefs. I can say that I truly believe that there is no god.
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--"Only the fool says in his heart: There is no god -- The wise says it to the world"
--"I darn you to HECK!" - Catbert
--"Don't worry, we're not laughing at you, we're laughing near you." |
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Tim
SFN Regular
USA
775 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 05:39:41 [Permalink]
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quote:
I find it laughable because she honestly thought that by telling me to go out into the world and look around unbiased and I would magically see the light and become a believer. I do look around at the world unbiased, or as unbiased as any human can possibly get...
But, L.I., you've touched her life...
She's probably thinking exactly the same thing you are, and it's a good bet that she's got a whole lot more emotional baggage invested into her belief system than you. From the very small glimpse you've given us into your conversation, she seems to be a raw recruit into the ranks of the true believers. Experienced credulists tend to be a bit more specific in their wild assertions. I would think that she is a rookie in the spirit.
No doubt, time has been relatively short since her first sacred epiphany. She's reached the proselyte stage. She's got that warm, fuzzy feeling they call being in the spirit. It's a really cool sensation. It gives her a feeling of being needed and loved and of being a part of something bigger than the world she sees around her.
More than anything else, she wants to keep this warm, fuzzy feeling alive. It's a rush, and a high. It makes ecstasy seem tame. It's like smoking rock, but it's cheaper, and lasts longer. She doesn't want to lose this high. She builds an emotional wall around her credenda. She has no problems observing the world beyond her little wall, but that wall acts like a colored glass filter on black and white film. It brightens the shades of the colors of her desires, and lightens those shades which challenge her faith.
Unfortunately, that wall was built using smoke and mirrors. It's a high maintenance wall. She must constantly work on it to keep it intact. To do this, she is taught to appeal to authority, and to study the guide book to the warm and fuzzy as instructed. This works pretty good on a day to day basis, but that warm, fuzzy feeling still tends to fade with time. She must occasionally return to the altar, to the imaginary source of her supernatural, feel-good power, and rekindle the magical fire which feeds the warm and fuzzy.
The daily grind of our day to day lives take a toll. So eventually, and without desperate measures, the warm and fuzzy will diminish to a point where it is beyond recall. But, by this time, she should have been thoroughly indoctrinated into the word. She will attend the local center for submission to the supernatural on a regular basis. She will go through all of the well trained motions of sacrosanct ritual. But, she will no longer possess the desire to share the word. In fact, she will rarely even consider the word, though she will dispassionately claim belief in it. She will have become a traditional theist. Her faith will have become no more urgent than her weekly shopping list.
L.I., without your help, this poor and lonely child is bound to the road leading to June Cleaver on Prozac. She will be wasting her pitiful little life exalted by ignorance, and raising up a brood of consecrated zombies, almost alive and basking in the glare of superstition.
She will live in a little brick house in the 'burbs with a blond haired, blue-eyed Jesus portrait hanging on the wall above the make believe fireplace. She will thank the Jesus portrait everyday, because she has a telephone, and doesn't have to walk to Ellen's place to gossip about who's bangin' the music director over in the other Baptist church, and secretly wishing it was her!
Yes, L.I., this poor, lost soul has reached out to you. All that remains is that you extend your hand. She is calling out your name. Yes, L.I., can't cha hear her? Just reach out, Brother, and
take her hand. Guide her up from the cave, away from th |
"We got an issue in America. Too many good docs are gettin' out of business. Too many OB/GYNs aren't able to practice their -- their love with women all across this country." Dubya in Poplar Bluff, Missouri, 9/6/2004
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| Edited by - Tim on 12/15/2002 06:09:50 |
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Badger
Skeptic Friend
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 10:11:13 [Permalink]
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| Beautiful, Tim! Simply beautiful! |
If you think it's work, you're doing it wrong. |
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Kilted_Warrior
Skeptic Friend
Canada
118 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 12:41:10 [Permalink]
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Good metaphor Tim, I haven't seen it explained better anywhere else!
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Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 13:17:04 [Permalink]
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| I wonder if H.L. Mencken didn't have it right when he wrote about dealing with Xians like "her", "One horse-laugh is worth a thousand syllogisms." |
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I learned something ... I learned that Jehovah's Witnesses do not celebrate Halloween. I guess they don't like strangers going up to their door and annoying them.
-Bruce Clark
There's No Toilet Paper...on the Road Less Traveled |
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Legallee Insane
Skeptic Friend
Canada
126 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 16:33:51 [Permalink]
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| There is one thing I neglected to point out in my first post. She did claim to understand how I feel, telling me that she was once an athiest herself. I find it very difficult to believe that she could possibly understand my feelings because as an athiest she as obviously still in a state of distress with her emotions. Whereas I am completely comfortable accepting my belief that god does not exist, pursuing knowledge and science to explain things instead. |
--"Only the fool says in his heart: There is no god -- The wise says it to the world"
--"I darn you to HECK!" - Catbert
--"Don't worry, we're not laughing at you, we're laughing near you." |
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Kilted_Warrior
Skeptic Friend
Canada
118 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 18:57:21 [Permalink]
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Some people are athiests not because they have near proof that there is no god(or reasonable doubt), but because their parents are religious and the people just want to rebel. They may claim that they are or were athiests, but they were just doing it to be different.
Many people, when they are goint through difficulties in life, may also may break away from religion, but be "born again", when they are persuaded to join the club again. |
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Espritch
Skeptic Friend
USA
284 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 20:24:38 [Permalink]
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quote:
Many people, when they are goint through difficulties in life, may also may break away from religion, but be "born again", when they are persuaded to join the club again.
It's been my experience that it is usually people in emotional distress that are most likely to "join the club". They feel bad and Christians offer them a claimed panacea. "Just accept Jesus and everything will be all hunky dory!" Most religions feed on the emotionally vulnerable. That's why Bush'es "Faith Based Initiative" is so insidious. It gives public funds to faith based organizations that deal with exactly the people most vulnerable to their pitch. |
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Legallee Insane
Skeptic Friend
Canada
126 Posts |
Posted - 12/15/2002 : 22:41:32 [Permalink]
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That is exactly what I don't want to become. Then I'd be the one running around spouting ridiculous things like, "I know him because I've heard Him, because I've seen Him and because He Is."
I still don't know what the hell she meant by that.
I think your right KW, I do believe that if she ever did consider herself to be an atheist that it was most likely to rebel against her parents because she hated the world or something like that. But that's just it, I don't hate the world, I love it and couldn't be much happier with my life right now.
quote:
Espritch:
It's been my experience that it is usually people in emotional distress that are most likely to "join the club". They feel bad and Christians offer them a claimed panacea. "Just accept Jesus and everything will be all hunky dory!" Most religions feed on the emotionally vulnerable.
I'm glad I'm not in any emotional distress, it might make me want to "join the club" too. |
--"Only the fool says in his heart: There is no god -- The wise says it to the world"
--"I darn you to HECK!" - Catbert
--"Don't worry, we're not laughing at you, we're laughing near you." |
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Infamous
Skeptic Friend
85 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2002 : 08:21:29 [Permalink]
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quote:
"I know him because I've heard Him, because I've seen Him and because He Is."
Sounds like the poor girl's hallucinating...either that or using really vague metaphors. |
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