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Doomar
SFN Regular
USA
714 Posts |
 Posted - 02/28/2004 : 23:21:55 [Permalink]
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[quote]Originally posted by Kil
A note to Doomar:
Your sometimes use of very large font size in bold is generally considered to be shouting in forums.
Since you claim that this thread about education and not another attempt to show the superiority of creationist claims over evolution (my ass) why shout?
I just dont' know how to use the fonts well yet...sorry
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Mark 10:27 (NKJV) 27But Jesus looked at them and said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.”
www.pastorsb.com.htm |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2004 : 17:50:15 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
quote:
Originally posted by Doomar
Well, Darwin's works are pretty much just what you described with only observations and not an in-depth scientific study. Simply observing several species over a short period of time and coming up with a theory on why they are as they are is not what I'd call deep science. Part of their science (original evolutionists) thought that life started from some gooey mush plasma with a very simplistic uncomplicated framework.
The same goes for Copernicus who first suggested the Heliocentric world model, and Johannes Kepler, who calculated that planetary orbits were elliptic, and designed formulae to describe it.
Today, we know that there are planetary orbits in our solar system that actually aren't elliptic. The explanation for this is much more in depth, and involves Einstein's theory of relativity.
Obviously, my post flew right over the heads.
My point was that Darwin's work was the first of it's kind. Revolutionary ideas in the biological community, just like Copernicus idea of a Heliocentric model ran contrary against main-stream religious astronomical dogma.
Later scientists has improved on Darwin's ideas, and developed it to what it is today.
Just like Johannes Kepler developed the basic mathematical formulae that describes planets elliptical orbits.
For decades, astronomers noticed that Mercury deviates somewhat from the predictions made by Kepler's (and Isaac Newton's) orbital mechanics. It wasn't until someone suggested that the explanation might relate to the curved space that Einstein's theory of relativity describes. After incorporating the theory of relativity into Kepler's and Isaac Newton's orbital mechanics, no discrepancies were found.
So, from a revolutionary idea, and "a very simplistic uncomplicated framework" as Doomar says, through the process of science we have developed a very informed view of our solar system. The same applies to Darwin's ideas, and our understanding of our biological history. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2004 : 17:55:30 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Doomar
I just dont' know how to use the fonts well yet...sorry
The secret is to pay close attention to all [xxx] -tags, and [/xxx] -tags. And make sure the tags and brackets go together without stray characters in the middle of them.
Edit: And if you later find out that there is something wrong with the formatting, it's easy to go back and correct it, by editing the post. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 03/28/2004 14:29:51 |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/27/2004 : 20:49:13 [Permalink]
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I rarely mess around with fonts, colors, and so forth. I think that my writings are more ledgable (if not more coherent) by simply using italics or bolding for emphasis. To my antique eyes, a lot of different colors and text sizes take away from the content of the message.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Paladin
Skeptic Friend
USA
100 Posts |
Posted - 03/30/2004 : 18:07:45 [Permalink]
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And some of us won't see the colors, anyway, for we have our browsers set to our own specifications. For example, I have mine set to a black background with white or dark blue letters. I find it's much easier on the eyes that way.  |
Paladin |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 04/25/2004 : 23:51:37 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
Biological evolution is the issue. It is the theory. If you want to talk about other kinds of evolution, I suggest you state as much.
Or perhaps that is your basic confusion? A sort of Dr. Dino "Darwinism reflects how the universe or life was created" mistake?
That you see the link as being full of "errors, misconceptions, and misunderstandings" says quite a lot, since most "evolutionists" would agree with everything written there.
And why does Darwin really matter, anyway? His ideas are nearing 150 years old. While they were a basis for current thinking, science progresses as time goes by.
How do you explain that every human coming into existance would be different even if the number went into infinity!!!! How do you explain that every tree and flower is different.
And if evolution happens on a daily basis, where is your proof? Where are the hands and feet sticking out of fish or what ever. I mean you have trillions of things to look at, living no less, and you can't offer me an example to prove your point? In the fossil record you can't even find me a missing link? Yet you expect me to believe that these fossils are millions of years old? If life is so easy to create, why are your precious scientists baffled as to how the musturd seed lives? |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 04:12:52 [Permalink]
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Oy veh!
Does anyone remember which thread it was that I and others answered every word of verlch's latest splutter, plus some? If so, please direct him to it and tell him we're still waiting on his counter evidences and citations.
Verlih old son, this drive-by business ain't hittin' on shit. When you make a statment here, you need to be prepared to defend it. Otherwise you look like an idiot, especally when you run away.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 10:22:09 [Permalink]
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Ok, found it.
http://www.skepticfriends.org/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=2672
Especally study Ricky's rather long post on page three. Lots of good info in it, and after you've asorbed that info, and considered your refutations, do post and we'll have a rockin' good discussion.
Uh, verlch..... are you there?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 11:44:27 [Permalink]
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verlch wrote:quote:
How do you explain that every human coming into existance would be different even if the number went into infinity!!!! How do you explain that every tree and flower is different.
Because living things take their shapes due not only to genetics, but due to their environment. Besides which, with an infinite number of humans, there would be many superficial duplicates, since there aren't an infinite number of possible human looks. We don't grow to 20 feet tall, nor is our skin purple. Of course, each person experiences things differently, so there will never be two true duplicate people, but that's not something evolutionary theory argues against.quote:
And if evolution happens on a daily basis, where is your proof? Where are the hands and feet sticking out of fish or what ever.
Considering your example is based upon a lie about what evolutionary theory tells us, any answer I give to you will likely be rejected. But, there is a species of mosquito which lives in the subway in London, which evolved from the mosquitoes which live above ground. Obviously, this occured sometime since the subway was built. In other words, in modern times.
There exist many other examples of speciation which have been observed. Do you reject them all, or are you simply ignorant of them?quote:
If life is so easy to create, why are your precious scientists baffled as to how the musturd seed lives?
I didn't know that any scientists were baffled by mustard seeds. Why don't you show me that they are, and then maybe I'll be able to answer your question. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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tomk80
SFN Regular
Netherlands
1278 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 13:42:16 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
why are your precious scientists baffled as to how the musturd seed lives?
Verlch, would you please explain to me how being baffled by something leads to a certain conclusion (such as evolution being bogus). I'd like to know, since I'm doing some research on the relationship between temperature, air pollution and blood markers, and I'm certaintly 'baffled' by some of the results I've got. It just means that I'm surprised by them, but that's the reason I am doing research. Personally, I don't see the point in researching something I already know.
But then again, if being baffled is a valid argument for a conclusion, I'd be happy to use it and get my article published  . So please, enlighten me. |
Tom
`Contrariwise,' continued Tweedledee, `if it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic.'
-Through the Looking Glass by Lewis Caroll- |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 16:26:16 [Permalink]
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Okey dokey, here's a little evolution happening right before our very eyes. When is a mouse not a mouse, and what then might it be?
quote:
FEROCIOUS MICE
The northern grasshopper mouse ambushes its prey rather than chasing it down. It tracks prey by smell. Coming upon a likely meal, it rushes suddenly upon the victim, seizing it with sharp claws and killing it with a bite to the neck. Then it devours the kill, head and neck first, and the rest until nothing is left but bone and scraps of fur.
Mary Taylor Gray
http://wildlife.state.co.us/Education/mammalsguide/grasshopper_mouse.asp
I've posted about this animal before, and I was sorta thinking of writing it up in the odd-balls thread. But it'll do here.
I recommend opening the link posted (it's short), then doing a Google for the particulars.
This is a rodent well on the road to unrodent-like speciation.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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tomk80
SFN Regular
Netherlands
1278 Posts |
Posted - 04/26/2004 : 16:35:48 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Ricky
We also have fossils which show the transition between wolf and whale, which span over a 50 million year time period. We also have fossils which show primeape to humans, I think 8 major species right now (or is it 9).
Not a wolf Ricky, a Sinonyx, order of the mesonychid, which indeed is about the size of a wolf and looks a bit like it.
quote:
You can find pictures of any of these on the internet. Creationists (or anyone who goes against evolution) is like a smoker who doesn't think that cigars are bad for them. Just because they can't see it happening in one instant, they think its not happening at all.
Well, that was a bad comparision, because evolution is happening at this instant.
I think it's quite a good comparison. Smokers also feel the small health effects (I've had a number of smokers admit to me that they didn't get as much are when they smoked), and everyone else sees (or rather) hears them. Only the bigger picture is ignored.
With evolution, we see the small effects nowadays. And creationists often don't dispute those (eventually). It's the big effect which they try to ignore. |
Tom
`Contrariwise,' continued Tweedledee, `if it was so, it might be; and if it were so, it would be; but as it isn't, it ain't. That's logic.'
-Through the Looking Glass by Lewis Caroll- |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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Topic Locked
