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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
 Posted - 06/26/2004 : 13:04:22 [Permalink]
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| God controlled the devil and kicked him out of heaven, I think he could do just fine at controlling man!!! |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2004 : 17:50:48 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
God controlled the devil and kicked him out of heaven, I think he could do just fine at controlling man!!!
The only thing I've seen of God is his total absence.
Pray all you want, but God will never be able change my mind.
I dare Him to do so.
Everything you have done thus far Verlch is affirm the image I have about Christians being self-deluded dimwits. Anything you will ever do here is reinforce my conviction that God, Jesus, and Christianity is the worst thing that can ever happen to me. Time and time again your actions confirm that my choice to leave the pentecostal church was the right one. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2004 : 18:50:04 [Permalink]
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quote:
Pray all you want, but God will never be able change my mind.
I dare Him to do so.
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them
strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
I suppose that could be Gods answer to you. You have to
make a choice pal...Looks like you mind is already made up!!!
quote:
9: Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan
with all power and signs and lying wonders,
10: And with all deceivableness of unrighteousness in
them that perish; because they received not the love of
the truth, that they might be saved.
11: And for this cause God shall send them strong
delusion, that they should believe a lie:
12: That they all might be damned who believed
not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.
13: But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for
you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath
from the beginning chosen you to salvation
through sanctification of the Spirit and
belief of the truth:
http://wyllie.lib.virginia.edu:8086/perl/toccer-new?id=Kjv2The.sgm&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=2&division=div1
quote:
Anything you will ever do here is reinforce my conviction
that God, Jesus, and Christianity is the worst thing that
can ever happen to me. Time and time again your actions
confirm that my choice to leave the pentecostal church
was the right one.
Good for you, I'm glad you left someplace you
couldn't find happiness. God doesn't want you
in heaven if you wouldn't be happy there!!!
But believe me he wants every soul there
with Him!!!! Praise God!!!
(Please don't lie about being in a church!!!
You wouldn't dare lie about something like
that would you!!! Just to prove a point
with one of these '!'....?)
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What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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| Edited by - verlch on 06/26/2004 18:53:31 |
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byhisgrace88
Formerly "creation88"
USA
166 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2004 : 20:27:10 [Permalink]
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DUDE-- "quote:And what some other's believe, does not have an effect on me either. The bible says it clearly.
....and therin lies the problem with religious fundamentalism. A completely closed mind. Quite sad really."--
You have got to be kidding me right? It's not like I don't know what those groups stand for, and decided to dis-agree just for the sake of argument. I would find it funny if it wasn't so offensive the hypocricy in that statement.
If you read the constitution, and it says something very clearly, but some group start's saying "this is what they really meant". Once you did some studieing to make sure that they are not right, that you would care what they think when the constituion made it ver clear what they were trieing to say? NO....you would'nt do that. You would say, "I don't give a second thought to what they think! It's very clear!"
So don't give me that hypocricy, you're just as "close minded" as we are. It's called studieing, finding out to the best of you're knowlege what there trieing to say, and not letting people change that becaus there not happy with the way it is.
TG--"God is basically saying "if We let them take this next step, it's out of Our control"--
First of all I would like a refference on where it says anything like these word's. |
Indeed, if we consider the unblushing promises of reward and the staggering nature of the rewards promised in the Gospels, it would seem that Our Lord finds our desire, not too strong, but too weak. We are half-hearted creatures, fooling about with drink and sex and ambition when infinite joy is offered us, like an ignorant child who wants to go on making mud pies in a slum because he cannot imagine what is meant by the offer of a holiday at the sea. We are far too easily pleased.-- C.S. Lewis |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2004 : 21:16:10 [Permalink]
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creation88 wrote:quote:
It's called studieing, finding out to the best of you're knowlege what there trieing to say, and not letting people change that becaus there not happy with the way it is.
Actually, your Constitution ideas are badly put, as it was never the Founders' intent to make law that would last for eternity. If the population is unhappy with the law, the law can (and has been) changed.
The Bible, of course, isn't like that at all. Your interpretation of the Bible differs from the Witnesses', but are you capable of judging which one of you is correct? Isn't it true that the only way you will know who is correct is by dying, meeting God (or Satan), and asking?quote:
First of all I would like a refference on where it says anything like these word's.
TG offered up the references in the first post of this thread, C88. Is his abbreviated summary correct, or not? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 06/26/2004 : 21:30:49 [Permalink]
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Bush uses Hitler shots in his ad campaign...
http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/story.jsp?idq=/ff/story/0001%2F20040626%2F1617342753.htm&sc=1131&photoid=20040626XDJC107
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What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2004 : 11:56:13 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
quote:
Pray all you want, but God will never be able change my mind.
I dare Him to do so.
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them
strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
...and there goes the pretense of free will out the window!
The Christian God was never intended to give humans free will.
quote:
(Please don't lie about being in a church!!!
You wouldn't dare lie about something like
that would you!!! Just to prove a point
with one of these '!'....?)
I have never lied to prove a point, and I am not about to start now.
I really was a member of the Pentecostal Church in the town I grew up in. For some 10 years depending on how you count them. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2004 : 12:51:22 [Permalink]
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quote:
...and there goes the pretense of free will out the window!
The Christian God was never intended to give humans free will.
How do you miss the point that you are an example of free will?
You are following after Darwin and Co. Much to the dismay of the heavenly host!!! How is God forcing you to follow after Him, the fact of the matter is He isn't.
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What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2004 : 13:24:32 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
quote:
...and there goes the pretense of free will out the window!
The Christian God was never intended to give humans free will.
How do you miss the point that you are an example of free will?
You are following after Darwin and Co. Much to the dismay of the heavenly host!!! How is God forcing you to follow after Him, the fact of the matter is He isn't.
I didn't miss the point, you rather did.
My point is that there is no God. The Bible is a collection of myths, and there is no way for you to prove that there exists a God.
Thus any prayer that you do will go unanswered. The Bible is filled with internal contradictions, and things that you have been preaching about, like "free will" does not conform to verses found in the Bible.
However, I try to be a Skeptic, and as such, I have to maintain an open mind and accept the possibility (however remote) that there may pop up evidense that truly confirms a God out there.
As a Skeptic, it is my duty to examine any evidense you put forth. None of the stuff presented by you have met the standard. If your prayer will make a hypothetical God appear and reveal "The Truth" to me, then it won't be hypothetical, and I would become worshipper of God. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2004 : 16:46:51 [Permalink]
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quote:
My point is that there is no God. The Bible is a collection of myths, and there is no way for you to prove that there exists a God.
Thus any prayer that you do will go unanswered. The Bible is filled with internal contradictions, and things that you have been preaching about, like "free will" does not conform to verses found in the Bible.
You preach contradictions because you as a 'radical evolutionist' discount the whole book. So don't give me these contradictive statments. This is part of your plan, as we attack all the different versions of your fiction based book. (Example one, no plants to produce oxygen in the early earth? Invent a germ that gives off oxygen while the plants evolve!!! Magically disappears leaving no trace, and no today with all this life, is extinct!!! And I believe in fairy tales????) |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2004 : 19:16:22 [Permalink]
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verlch wrote:quote:
And I believe in fairy tales????
Yes, you do. Both about God and about evolution. You are deluded on both subjects. And based upon what you've been writing, it may be a pathological delusion. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
Posted - 06/27/2004 : 19:17:19 [Permalink]
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"You preach contradictions because you as a 'radical evolutionist' discount the whole book."
Only shows more of your ignorance. Evolution does not have anything to do with god. The only thing that it has to do is with Genisis and the creation, but you can still believe in god and not take the Bible litterally. Furthermore, you say he is preaching (although you normally need an audience to do this) contradictions, but you don't deny that these exist?
"I've done everything thing that is in the Bible, God. Even the stuff that contradicts the other stuff." - Ned Flanders
"Example one, no plants to produce oxygen in the early earth? Invent a germ that gives off oxygen while the plants evolve!!! Magically disappears leaving no trace, and no today with all this life, is extinct!!! And I believe in fairy tales????"
Cyanobacteria is this "germ" that changed the atmosphere of the Earth from one rich with CO2 to one rich with O2. Forms of cyanobacteria exist today, often referred to as blue-green algae. We did not invent it, nor did it magically appear. I'm just curious, where did you get this information from (that Cyanobacteria went extinct)? Or did you just make it up? |
Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2004 : 02:44:43 [Permalink]
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quote:
Or did you just make it up?
yep... |
Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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TG
Skeptic Friend
USA
121 Posts |
Posted - 06/28/2004 : 07:16:53 [Permalink]
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Meanwhile, back at the original topic:
TG--"God is basically saying "if We let them take this next step, it's out of Our control"--
quote:
C88: First of all I would like a refference on where it says anything like these word's.
It seems straightforward to me. Today, virtually every major city in the world has skyscrapers, several over a quarter mile high. And yet, for some reason, a few hundred years after the Deluge, a handful of Noah's descendents start building the Tower of Babel, and God says
quote:
God:
and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do. Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
What possible reason would God have for being concerned over a few people building a tower in middle of a desert? Concerned enough to take action to prevent it's construction? The same God who, a few hundred years earlier, killed all but eight people through a world-wide flood? What possible threat could humanity be to Him?
quote:
God: Behold, the man is become as one of us
That's the threat ... let these humans go unchecked and they'll become one of "Us".
Tom
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