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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
 Posted - 10/31/2004 : 01:00:59 [Permalink]
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quote:
I need some real help fast. My father-in-lawa has gotten into the Private Investor Profit System at Pureinvestor.com. He has invested about $2000 in this thing since July 29th and is "expecting" a payment on this PicPay thing of about $1200 on Nov 30th. He has been in financial troble for years and lost his rear in "eGold" scam. He has done a refinance loan on his house and is getting cash out to invest. He is planning on sinking $12,000 on December 4th into this. Can someone determine if this is in fact a scam?
You have to realize, we are not currently involved in this PIPS. I don't think any skeptic here would ever try something like this. If you ask, "Is this a scam?" you must realize that we have no evidence for it being one. We can't say, "Yes, this is a scam."
However, we are told is that they make 2% returns a day. This can be said to be just about impossible in today's world. Now this 2% is hearsay, and they won't back it up with reason. Because it is unreasonable in todays world and it is only hearsay, we can not consider this as evidence.
So now you have 2 possibilities, its a scam and its real. Both, as I have stated above, have 0 evidence. So what do you decide? Either they can somehow beat every single investor in the world by hundreds of percent yearly, or its a scam. I go with the same, it is more reasonable.
I hope this explains it clearly. To sum up: We can not say for sure that this is a scam. We don't have any evidence of it. However, that is what it most likely seems. |
Why continue? Because we must. Because we have the call. Because it is nobler to fight for rationality without winning than to give up in the face of continued defeats. Because whatever true progress humanity makes is through the rationality of the occasional individual and because any one individual we may win for the cause may do more for humanity than a hundred thousand who hug their superstitions to their breast.
- Isaac Asimov |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 04:44:20 [Permalink]
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| This tells you why this thing is still (evidently) paying out. People are putting a lot of money in this, while the early "investors" are taking it out. My friend has doubled her money since February, and is talking about quitting her job. If people are putting in tens of thousands of dollars, she may make a lot of money before it shuts down. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 05:13:14 [Permalink]
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Let me put it in writing again. Somebody check my math. $100,000 earning 2% a day for 1825 days - 5 years - is 467,210,882,711,122,000,000.00.
The estimated (at cia.gov) gross world product for 2003 was $51.48 trillion. That's 51,480,000,000,000.
That's approximately 9,075,580.472 times the estimated gross world product for 2003.
Now, according to the charts at the PIP websites, it appears that one actually pays more in fees than one invests, so if they figure 2% a day based on that, it's at least misleading to say that you earn 2% a day on your investment.
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I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 07:11:08 [Permalink]
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Planning to drop 12 grand, is he? That tells me that the bait has been taken -- small dollars paid out -- and it is coming up to the time to hook bigger fish.
This one is a classic! Tell your father-in-law to demand a prospectus before he gives them another, damned dime. If such is not forthcoming, get him out of it somehow because it won't be long before he'll be informed of a need to protect his investment by adding yet more cash to it. Or perhaps told of an oportunity the company has found that, if they only had more assets, they could make a killing for the investors.
Classic!
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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buckyball
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 17:36:39 [Permalink]
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quote:
I need some real help fast. My father-in-lawa has gotten into the Private Investor Profit System at Pureinvestor.com. He has invested about $2000 in this thing since July 29th and is "expecting" a payment on this PicPay thing of about $1200 on Nov 30th. He has been in financial troble for years and lost his rear in "eGold" scam. He has done a refinance loan on his house and is getting cash out to invest. He is planning on sinking $12,000 on December 4th into this. Can someone determine if this is in fact a scam?
Personally, the numbers just don't work. There's not enough money in the world to pay out 2% a day. As part of your due diligence, you can also check out http://wwsn-forums.com/, there's a very large topic on PIPS/PureInvestor going on for quite a while. Interesting reading.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 10/31/2004 : 20:26:44 [Permalink]
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Gorgo wrote:quote:
Let me put it in writing again. Somebody check my math. $100,000 earning 2% a day for 1825 days - 5 years - is 467,210,882,711,122,000,000.00.
Checking your math: A 2% increase is a multiplier of 1.02, so a 2% increase for 1,825 days is a multiplier of 1.021825, or - according to the Windows calculator - 4,958,079,264,200,877.85, rounded a bit. Shift the unrounded value left by five digits to represent the initial investment of 100 grand, and we get $495,807,926,420,087,785,122 and 80.2 cents. That's nearly 500 quintillion dollars in the U.S., about 270 million billion pounds, around 389 quintillion Euros or nearly 53 sextillion yen (exchange rates found here).quote:
The estimated (at cia.gov) gross world product for 2003 was $51.48 trillion. That's 51,480,000,000,000.
That's approximately 9,075,580.472 times the estimated gross world product for 2003.
And I get about 9,631,078.602 times the GWP.
No matter whose math is correct, it's still unreasonable. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 07:00:09 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by MP1989
I need some real help fast. My father-in-lawa has gotten into the Private Investor Profit System at Pureinvestor.com. He has invested about $2000 in this thing since July 29th and is "expecting" a payment on this PicPay thing of about $1200 on Nov 30th. He has been in financial troble for years and lost his rear in "eGold" scam. He has done a refinance loan on his house and is getting cash out to invest. He is planning on sinking $12,000 on December 4th into this. Can someone determine if this is in fact a scam?
While I cannot 100% say that it is, it has all the hallmarks of a Ponzi scheme. One that should be collapsing in a few years. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 08:36:18 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
quote:
Originally posted by MP1989
I need some real help fast. My father-in-lawa has gotten into the Private Investor Profit System at Pureinvestor.com. He has invested about $2000 in this thing since July 29th and is "expecting" a payment on this PicPay thing of about $1200 on Nov 30th. He has been in financial troble for years and lost his rear in "eGold" scam. He has done a refinance loan on his house and is getting cash out to invest. He is planning on sinking $12,000 on December 4th into this. Can someone determine if this is in fact a scam?
While I cannot 100% say that it is, it has all the hallmarks of a Ponzi scheme. One that should be collapsing in a few years.
I dunno, Val. This originates in a country that probably has less stringent laws governing this sort of thing, and there are a lot of people it can reach world-wide via the 'net. I have a nasty feeling that it could continue for as long as there is someone out there looking for easy money. It certainly seems to be well and carefully run. But then, the best grifts always are.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 08:48:35 [Permalink]
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| I don't know if there is a way to research it, but this Bryan Marsden is supposedly an engineer and was the CEO of an engineering company. If so, I wonder how long he worked on the details of this scheme. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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dominickolas
New Member
4 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 09:10:46 [Permalink]
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| Why would he pull out $1,200 and put in 12,000? Why not just put in 10,800? The 1200 is not even the 2000 he first put in, so I don't really know what that would prove to him? 12k is a lot of money. I wish him well. |
Maybe I'm skeptical of you too! |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 11:11:21 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
quote:
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
quote:
Originally posted by MP1989
I need some real help fast. My father-in-lawa has gotten into the Private Investor Profit System at Pureinvestor.com. He has invested about $2000 in this thing since July 29th and is "expecting" a payment on this PicPay thing of about $1200 on Nov 30th. He has been in financial troble for years and lost his rear in "eGold" scam. He has done a refinance loan on his house and is getting cash out to invest. He is planning on sinking $12,000 on December 4th into this. Can someone determine if this is in fact a scam?
While I cannot 100% say that it is, it has all the hallmarks of a Ponzi scheme. One that should be collapsing in a few years.
I dunno, Val. This originates in a country that probably has less stringent laws governing this sort of thing, and there are a lot of people it can reach world-wide via the 'net. I have a nasty feeling that it could continue for as long as there is someone out there looking for easy money. It certainly seems to be well and carefully run. But then, the best grifts always are.
Per Dave's ROI model, five years might be the limit. Some people might say they have enough and want to pull out their "earnings".
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Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 11:15:30 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by dominickolas
Why would he pull out $1,200 and put in 12,000? Why not just put in 10,800? The 1200 is not even the 2000 he first put in, so I don't really know what that would prove to him? 12k is a lot of money. I wish him well.
Sounds like he wants a disbursement of $1,200, not pulling out $1,200. He's been involved in it since July. Since he left in $2,000 for three months, according to the daily ROI claimed he should have plenty enough to pull out and leave the original $2,000 (alledgedly) untouched. He's talking about sinking an additional $12,000 into it.
He would send in $14,000 total and get back $1,200 to date.
I fear for his financial solvency. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 13:26:02 [Permalink]
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quote:
Per Dave's ROI model, five years might be the limit. Some people might say they have enough and want to pull out their "earnings".
By the way, by my calculations, a $100 thousand initial investment becomes larger than the estimated GWP after just 1,013 days, or two years and nine months or so. And it would pass the 2005 budgeted Federal spending for the U.S. after just 857 days, or two years and about four months.
No matter what the initial investment, at 2% per day it would double every 36 days. Well, slightly more than double, as 1.0236 is real close to 2.04. So, if a person were to initially invest just a thousand bucks, the above calculations on $100,000 would become true after less than seven 36-day periods go by (in other words, at 2%, $1,000 becomes $100,921.55 in 233 days).
Damn. I want in!  |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 13:43:23 [Permalink]
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| Thanks for the numbers. Either way you go, it's more money than I make in a whole WEEK! |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 11/01/2004 : 14:23:39 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
quote:
Per Dave's ROI model, five years might be the limit. Some people might say they have enough and want to pull out their "earnings".
By the way, by my calculations, a $100 thousand initial investment becomes larger than the estimated GWP after just 1,013 days, or two years and nine months or so. And it would pass the 2005 budgeted Federal spending for the U.S. after just 857 days, or two years and about four months.
No matter what the initial investment, at 2% per day it would double every 36 days. Well, slightly more than double, as 1.0236 is real close to 2.04. So, if a person were to initially invest just a thousand bucks, the above calculations on $100,000 would become true after less than seven 36-day periods go by (in other words, at 2%, $1,000 becomes $100,921.55 in 233 days).
Damn. I want in!
I'm also accounting for marks that don't pull anything out so as to maximize their returns. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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