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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
 Posted - 10/28/2004 : 09:18:26 [Permalink]
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Happy, we are glad you made money, but that is no indicator that this is ligitimate in any way. If all we have is people who say it works and 0 information about how then we will remain doubtful no matter what you or anyone says.
neive=NAIVE = uninformed, lacking knowledge on the subject. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2004 : 09:45:07 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Happy
Valiant Dancer,
Sorry, as English is not my mother tongue, I didn't understand all in your posting: "Your confidence that a shutdown of the scheme won't cost anyone money is nieve"
What does "nieve" mean?
Blissfully trusting/inexperienced with the workings of the world.
quote:
To clarify my comment; my personal theory is that if PI would choose to shut down the 2% program, it would be in this manner: Stop the current possibility to reinvest ROI, therefore you cannot buy more units (1 unit=25 USD). The units expire automatically after 180 days, so after this period of time without reinvesting, everyone would have been paid back their original investment + some profit.
If the whole system crashes, then of course people would loose money. But that was not what I was talking about. I was referring to a controlled close-down, AND it was (and is) my personal theory).
Ponzi schemes do not act in this manner.
quote:
Your statement that a "ponzi" could go on for 20 years makes me happy. If PIPS is a Ponzi, and lasts for 20 years, I will be VERY rich!
Virtual money? Unless I am high on drugs, the actual bills that I have so far taken out from my DC certainly feels real in my hand ;-)
Best regards
Happy
As I have said, a majority of investors keep their "virtual profits" in the program. PIPS cannot be sustained for that length of time due to the extreme ROI. 20 years means a great deal of people are taken for a lot of money. It is a gifting enterprise (where gainers never complain and losers are left holding the bag) which violates US law USC Title 18.
Show me a prospectus (which is required under US law for a company of this type) and I'll take your claims seriously. As it is, you are one of the early investors and may see some profit. Few others will. Many will lose all when it collapses. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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buckyball
New Member
USA
3 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2004 : 12:40:17 [Permalink]
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quote:
What we would like to see is a prospectus (is that the correct word?) of the company running the show. What exactly are they doing with their investor's money?
You may be in luck! I did a search for "prospectus" in the PIPS forurm (http://forum.pipsinc.com) and came across the following post from 20OctO4:
quote:
Bryan said in Vegas "a prospectus is available" and I have heard that an audit is being scheduled.
Whoopee! Of course, good luck finding it since it appears it hasn't been posted yet. Then again, I'm skeptical they will ever post one, or if they do, it won't look anything like the typical prospectus one would expect to see from a public company or a mutual fund, for example.
The talk of a prospectus is quite a departure from what was being said on 11May04, where it's lamely stated:
quote:
Prospectus Information Available?
Just a short clarification on the issue of a prospectus.
As a private fund PI are not governed by the SEC's and do not under the law have to provide a prospectus. There is enough information on the site regarding investments made by PI, including the presentation that I posted in the forum for members to view.
A public offering, as made by Arthur Anderson, Enron for instance had a prospectus.
Hands up those that made money in Enron.
A prospectus does not provide security on an investment or evidence on real investor returns (except historical info on the company), PI members can provide proof of real returns made to them personally.
I don't think they understand exactly what a prospectus is. Testimonials do not a prospectus make, nor do they "provide security". Can't wait to see PIPS explain how they actually "earn" 2% a day! 
I think I'll keep my money away from these guys, thank you very much. |
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2004 : 12:48:55 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
H. Humbert, unsupported accusations of sock-puppetry aren't becoming of a skeptic.
Yes, that was an unfounded allegation and I retract it. I simply found it hard to believe that more than one individual would rise to defend such an obvious scam. It seems I've underestimated my fellow men.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 10/28/2004 : 13:02:14 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by H. Humbert
It seems I've underestimated my fellow men.
I hate to be a party to your disillusionment, guy.  |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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Happy
New Member
5 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 00:34:29 [Permalink]
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Dear all,
I understand your interest in seeing more information on how Pips invest. Since I don't work for the company, I cannot provide you with that. It might have been interesting for me too, at a point in time (before investing). Instead for me, it was enough that close friends had confidence in the program (confidence built up by actually making profit). That, and my gut feeling that I was on to something good. Foolish? Yeah, maybe, but my gut instinct turned out to be right, so I don't feel foolish at all.
Now, when I myself am in profit, my need of evidence is zero. And I have a strong feeling that if I was to post info from a prospectus, there would be endless questions about the credibility of that, and so on and so forth. So thanks, but no thanks, I don't have time for endless posting.
As for how long a company will last; well, who knows? I don't, but with all the interesting new financial plans that PI offers, my personal belief is many, many years to come.
However, I wish you all the best and do stay away from any investment opportunities that doesn't make you feel comfortable! I sure do.
Best regards
Happy
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 03:02:19 [Permalink]
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| People are pulling their money out, so it will last as long as there are more people putting money in. If you knew for sure that this was a pyramid scheme, Lapcus and Happy, would you do it knowing that if you make money, you're only making it at the expense of others who think they're going to make money? |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 03:02:55 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Happy
Now, when I myself am in profit, my need of evidence is zero. And I have a strong feeling that if I was to post info from a prospectus, there would be endless questions about the credibility of that, and so on and so forth. So thanks, but no thanks, I don't have time for endless posting.
Many people investing in Ponzi schemes do make money, especially the early investers. This point has been brought up repeatedly, yet you've still failed to acknowledge it.
Ok, I have a question. If at some point in the future it becomes known that PIPS was a scam and your "profits" turn out to be other people's stolen money, what do you plan to do about it? Give it back? Or since they took a chance based on a "gut feeling," (or perhaps even on the direct assurance from you that this setup is legitimate), do you keep their money on the basis that there was always a risk?
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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dominickolas
New Member
4 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 08:51:58 [Permalink]
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| I read on the forum that it is not a ponzi scheme or a pryamid. So there you have it! What more proof could you possibly need? Happy, just like I told Lapcus, you can't convice anyone of anything here. It's not gonna happen! Why are you trying? |
Maybe I'm skeptical of you too! |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 09:16:44 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by dominickolas
I read on the forum that it is not a ponzi scheme or a pryamid. So there you have it! What more proof could you possibly need? Happy, just like I told Lapcus, you can't convice anyone of anything here. It's not gonna happen! Why are you trying?
Oh, yeah. Scheme operators wouldn't lie, would they? Must be proof. (roll eyes)
Claims of validity minus proof equals unsubstantiated claim.
Show me the prospectus.
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Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 09:23:19 [Permalink]
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I think it would be more honest to just go knock over a liquor store than to scam money out of the uninformed. Typically, the people that need the money the most are the ones that get scamed.
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If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2004 : 10:24:58 [Permalink]
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Voting for Kerry vs Bush=lesser of two evils.
Knock over liquour store vs join pyramid scheme= lesser of two evils
Gives me something else to do on election day. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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MP1989
New Member
USA
4 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2004 : 21:11:56 [Permalink]
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| I need some real help fast. My father-in-lawa has gotten into the Private Investor Profit System at Pureinvestor.com. He has invested about $2000 in this thing since July 29th and is "expecting" a payment on this PicPay thing of about $1200 on Nov 30th. He has been in financial troble for years and lost his rear in "eGold" scam. He has done a refinance loan on his house and is getting cash out to invest. He is planning on sinking $12,000 on December 4th into this. Can someone determine if this is in fact a scam? |
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