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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
 Posted - 09/15/2005 : 06:07:45 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
"The frying pan gets hot and with nothing between the handle and the plastic, my hand doesn't even get too warm".
What a pity that plastic at 250°C begins to dissolve or to char and then it burns.
It is a damn shame that you are too ingrained in the "all plastics have the same characteristics" which would have kept your ancestors from making bronze and steel.
DaVinci is laughing at your stupidity. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 11:00:00 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
"It is a damn shame that you are too ingrained in the "all plastics have the same characteristics" which would have kept your ancestors from making bronze and steel".
Please go here
http://info.lu.farmingdale.edu/depts/met/met205/thermoplastics.html
Phenolics:
Bakelite, Durez, Resinox
Excellent thermal stability to over 300 F (165 °C); may be compound with a large number of resins, fillers, etc.; inexpensive
Motor housings, telephones, auto distributors, electrical fixtures
No comment
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 11:24:15 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
"It is a damn shame that you are too ingrained in the "all plastics have the same characteristics" which would have kept your ancestors from making bronze and steel".
Please go here
http://info.lu.farmingdale.edu/depts/met/met205/thermoplastics.html
Phenolics:
Bakelite, Durez, Resinox
Excellent thermal stability to over 300 F (165 °C); may be compound with a large number of resins, fillers, etc.; inexpensive
Motor housings, telephones, auto distributors, electrical fixtures
No comment
Went there. It's not the same stuff used.
Try here. Detailed analysis of the heat shield material inside.
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19790077086_1979077086.pdf
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Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 13:26:44 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
"Went there. It's not the same stuff used.
Try here. Detailed analysis of the heat shield material inside.
http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/casi.ntrs.nasa.gov/19790077086_1979077086.pdf"
NASA's buffoons write pages, write pages and write pages about any argument and make calculations, graphs, schedules, calculations, graphs, schedules, and ...
... and write pages, write pages and write pages about any argument and make calculations, graphs, schedules, calculations, graphs, schedules and, like alchemists, find a magic plastic phenolic coating 7 cm thick that can resist at 5000 °F (2800 °C).
In blast furnaces temperature can get to 1800 °C to produce cast iron.
Imagine, gullible people, to bathe your plastic-metal capsule into that liquid cast iron.
What would it happen?
We would see three human skeletons floating.
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 13:56:01 [Permalink]
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Oh, you are so full of shit!
Ok, O Font of Wisdom, rather than make silly, unfounded claims, how about you demonstrate exactly where the paper that Val has gone to the trouble to find is in error. Please detail how the protective material would fail and provide documentation -- real documentation, not conspiricy site dreck.
I'm betting that you can't do it and neither can your moon-landing-hoax, woo-woo associates either. Put up or shut up....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
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Dry_vby
Skeptic Friend
Australia
249 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 16:07:06 [Permalink]
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.....and you can go here: http://www.hell2u.com/
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"I'll go along with the charade
Until I can think my way out.
I know it was all a big joke
Whatever it was about."
Bob Dylan
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 16:10:56 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Go here please
http://www.nasm.si.edu/exhibitions/cchoice/columbia/cm.htm
Is that a glass window?
Yes 
Then go here
http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2002/SaiLee.shtml
No comment.
Hmm, someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall reading that the windows were quartz, not glass. But no matter, you still avoid the question like a rat jumping away from a viper: quote:
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 13:56:01
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Oh, you are so full of shit!
Ok, O Font of Wisdom, rather than make silly, unfounded claims, how about you demonstrate exactly where the paper that Val has gone to the trouble to find is in error. Please detail how the protective material would fail and provide documentation -- real documentation, not conspiricy site dreck.
I'm betting that you can't do it and neither can your moon-landing-hoax, woo-woo associates either. Put up or shut up....
Further, you have yet to come up even a guess as to where the alledged embezzeled money went. You are long on rhetoric but short on substance; thus you have yet to even start to make a case for your claims.
But take your time; I'm willing to wait for as long as it takes for you to get your mishappened act together.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 16:51:33 [Permalink]
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quote:
Filthy:
But take your time; I'm willing to wait for as long as it takes for you to get your mishappened act together.
Since the act of actually drawing conclusions that fit the evidence seems not to be a part of Bigbrain's arsenal, I hope you brought a cushion for your seat, Filthy…
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2005 : 18:15:57 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Kil
quote:
Filthy:
But take your time; I'm willing to wait for as long as it takes for you to get your mishappened act together.
Since the act of actually drawing conclusions that fit the evidence seems not to be a part of Bigbrain's arsenal, I hope you brought a cushion for your seat, Filthy…
I'm just starting a hand-rubbed finish on a gunstock at the moment, and when that's done, I must assemble the piece (a muzzleloader). I have time, lots of time, and something to keep me occupied between bouts of inanity.... 
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 07:55:13 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
... Hmm, someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall reading that the windows were quartz, not glass. But no matter, you still avoid the question like a rat jumping away from a viper ...
Hey, at http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2002/SaiLee.shtml
you can read:
Bibliographic Entry
Brown, Theodore, Eugene Lemay Jr. and Bruce Bursten Chemistry: The Central Science. Upper Saddle River, NJ. Prentice Hall 2000: Page 884.
Result (w/surrounding text)
"Quartz melts at approximately 1600 °C forming a tacky liquid. In the course of melting, many silicon-oxygen bonds are broken."
Standardized Result
1600 °C
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 08:21:30 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Originally posted by filthy
... Hmm, someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall reading that the windows were quartz, not glass. But no matter, you still avoid the question like a rat jumping away from a viper ...
Hey, at http://hypertextbook.com/facts/2002/SaiLee.shtml
you can read:
Bibliographic Entry
Brown, Theodore, Eugene Lemay Jr. and Bruce Bursten Chemistry: The Central Science. Upper Saddle River, NJ. Prentice Hall 2000: Page 884.
Result (w/surrounding text)
"Quartz melts at approximately 1600 °C forming a tacky liquid. In the course of melting, many silicon-oxygen bonds are broken."
Standardized Result
1600 °C
Very good -- I didn't know the exact temperatures. However, as that is the case, one would logically conclude that the heat shielding did it's job and neither the windows nor the capsule itself ever reached such temperatures during re-entry.
Reminder: you have yet to confute the document Val posted. It is, after all, a part of the long-ago mentioned paper trail and important to this discussion.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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sts60
Skeptic Friend
141 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 10:05:20 [Permalink]
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filthy, the inner heat shield (stainless-steel honeycomb structure) peaked out at about 600 deg. F (315 deg. C). The temperature gradient from shock wave to stagantion zone to front of ablator where the action is to the back of the ablator, only a few inches, is quite steep during a couple of minutes. The temperatures at the trailing surfaces could get as high as 3,000 F (1650 deg. C), but the heat loading was less and the fused-silica windows and other thermal shielding penetrations were recessed to protect them. Postflight analysis, in fact, showed that they could have done with much less ablative material on the sides and saved some mass.
Of course, again, three different countries (U.S., USSR/Russia, and China) have built and flown manned spacecraft using just this kind of technology, from heat shielding to spacecraft windows. |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 10:24:14 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
Very good -- I didn't know the exact temperatures. However, as that is the case, one would logically conclude that the heat shielding did it's job and neither the windows nor the capsule itself ever reached such temperatures during re-entry.
No, no, no
You can't say too many craps:
The windows were not protected with the "Magic Plastic Made By NASA's Buffoons" (MPMBNB system)...
... and, if you had gone to the moon, they would have melted during re-entry at 2800 °C
YOU CAN'T CONFUTE THIS STATEMENT:
If your astronauts had gone to the moon, they would have crashed during landing and would have burned to death during re-entry at 40,000 kilometres per hour like asteroids.
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 10:33:51 [Permalink]
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Moreover,
at that velocity,
even if lowered because of the friction with atmosphere,
parachutes would have surely broken.
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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