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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 09/16/2005 : 10:42:53 [Permalink]
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quote:
YOU CAN'T CONFUTE THIS STATEMENT:
And you have yet to support it, therefore I don't need to confute it, merely cast doubt.
You have made the claim; it is your responsibility to provide proofs for it. Thus far, I have seen nothing but hand-waving and yet more doubtful claims along with photos that might or might not be as represented and in any case, have been "confuted" by others who actually know something about photography.
Do you have any, empirical evidence at all? Or just more bullshit?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 10:52:28 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by sts60
filthy, the inner heat shield (stainless-steel honeycomb structure) peaked out at about 600 deg. F (315 deg. C). The temperature gradient from shock wave to stagantion zone to front of ablator where the action is to the back of the ablator, only a few inches, is quite steep during a couple of minutes. The temperatures at the trailing surfaces could get as high as 3,000 F (1650 deg. C), but the heat loading was less and the fused-silica windows and other thermal shielding penetrations were recessed to protect them. Postflight analysis, in fact, showed that they could have done with much less ablative material on the sides and saved some mass.
Of course, again, three different countries (U.S., USSR/Russia, and China) have built and flown manned spacecraft using just this kind of technology, from heat shielding to spacecraft windows.
Thanks for the info, sts60. Y'know, I'd completely forgotten about the other flights; the Russians made quite a few of them, as I recall.
Hey bigbrain: Did the Russians fake theirs? And the Chinese as well? Was it all some huge, international, cold-war conspiricy?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 10:52:34 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Moreover,
at that velocity,
even if lowered because of the friction with atmosphere,
parachutes would have surely broken.
Since the craft slows to terminal velocity before the chutes deploy, your statement is craps. The parachutes were fine. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 11:05:11 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Since the craft slows to terminal velocity before the chutes deploy, your statement is craps. The parachutes were fine.
By my calculations velocity of
Lunar Module Columbia (LMC)
at 5000 metres of height
is 29,674 kilometres per hour
AND PARACHUTES WOULD HAVE SURELY BROKEN.
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 11:18:28 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Since the craft slows to terminal velocity before the chutes deploy, your statement is craps. The parachutes were fine.
By my calculations velocity of
Lunar Module Columbia (LMC)
at 5000 metres of height
is 29,674 kilometres per hour
AND PARACHUTES WOULD HAVE SURELY BROKEN.
Kindly post your figures.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 11:39:31 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Since the craft slows to terminal velocity before the chutes deploy, your statement is craps. The parachutes were fine.
By my calculations velocity of
Lunar Module Columbia (LMC)
at 5000 metres of height
is 29,674 kilometres per hour
AND PARACHUTES WOULD HAVE SURELY BROKEN.
But you don't have calculations, only conjecture. Air resistance will only allow an object to go so fast. It slows down to that speed when re-entering the atmosphere.
But, lets face it, your calculations have been wrong every other time yet you refuse to revisit them, why should now be any different? |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Fripp
SFN Regular
USA
727 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 12:23:21 [Permalink]
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By your calculations???
You as much as fully admitted that you were too stupid to solve a simple problem in this forum:
http://apollohoax.proboards21.com/index.cgi?board=theories&action=display&thread=1115413692&page=1
And, again, putting your posts in a bright red, bolded, and enlarged font adds no intelligence or import to your feeble arguments.
DaVinci is rolling in his grave right now. |
"What the hell is an Aluminum Falcon?"
"Oh, I'm sorry. I thought my Dark Lord of the Sith could protect a small thermal exhaust port that's only 2-meters wide! That thing wasn't even fully paid off yet! You have any idea what this is going to do to my credit?!?!"
"What? Oh, oh, 'just rebuild it'? Oh, real [bleep]ing original. And who's gonna give me a loan, jackhole? You? You got an ATM on that torso LiteBrite?" |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 12:24:54 [Permalink]
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Ask sts60 if my calculations are wrong.
My calculations are right and parachutes would have broken at velocity of 29,674 kilometres per hour.
YOU CAN'T CONFUTE THIS STATEMENT
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 12:30:15 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Fripp
DaVinci is rolling in his grave right now.
YOU MUST WRITE "DA VINCI"
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 12:35:26 [Permalink]
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quote:
By my calculations velocity of
Lunar Module Columbia (LMC)
at 5000 metres of height
is 29,674 kilometres per hour
AND PARACHUTES WOULD HAVE SURELY BROKEN.
Are you stupid or something??
Say it with me AIR FRICTION.
You know how you point out that there is a lot of heat generated???? That is air friction and air pressure slowing down the reentry vehicle.
Damn you really are stupid.
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If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 12:37:56 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Ask sts60 if my calculations are wrong.
My calculations are right and parachutes would have broken at velocity of 29,674 kilometres per hour.
YOU CAN'T CONFUTE THIS STATEMENT
Until you put forth those calculations to be checked by all, your statement has no value. Therefore, it is unnessary to refute it.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 13:34:48 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by bigbrain
Ask sts60 if my calculations are wrong.
My calculations are right and parachutes would have broken at velocity of 29,674 kilometres per hour.
YOU CAN'T CONFUTE THIS STATEMENT
Your calculations are fucked.
http://www.jdkbph.com/ALMT/ALMTdocs/17reentry.pdf#search='apollo%20reentry%20velocity'
Space craft starts re-entry at 400,000 ft (122,000 m).
Space craft deploys drogue chute at 24,000 ft (8,000 m).
Space craft velocity at start of re-entry 36,300 ft/s (11,064 m/s).
Space craft deplys pilot chutes at 10,350 ft (3,420 m approx)
Space craft deploys main chutes at 10,000 ft (3,333 m)
Max accelleration/decelleration: 6.5 G
It was going much slower than 11,064 m/s when the drogue chutes deployed. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 13:56:03 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
It was going much slower than 11,064 m/s when the drogue chutes deployed.
Hey, you don't understand.
Re-entry velocity is 11,064 m/s = about 40,000 kilometres per hour
Velocity decreases because of air friction.
At 5000 metres of height velocity is 29,674 kilometres per hour and parachutes brake.
YOU NEVER CAME BACK FROM THE MOON
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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ktesibios
SFN Regular
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 18:34:20 [Permalink]
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Even though I know that bigmouth couldn't calculate how long it is to dinnertime with a digital clock, I did get curious about how fast the CM was going when the parachutes deployed. Finding this out was a little bit of a PITA.
It was easy to find deceleration profiles for the reentry, but these didn't give velocity, and working it out interval by interval from the initial conditions and a graph was more than I'm willing to do for bigmouth's benefit.
I did find this, from the Apollo 15 Flight Journal at http://history.nasa.gov/ap15fj/25day13_splashdown.htm :
quote:
[The time is coming up for the ELS (Earth Landing System) to come into play. The SECS (Sequential Events Control System) orchestrates all the events using timers and barometric switches. The system is highly redundant because, like so many systems aboard a spacecraft, the crew's lives depend on it.]
[At 7,300 metres (24,000 feet) the RCS is disabled and the forward heatshield jettisoned.
Also known as the apex cover, this part of the heatshield wraps around the CM forward compartment where the parachutes and their mortars are mounted. Once jettisoned, a small parachute attached to it slows it down to take it away from the descending Command Module. 1.5 seconds later, two drogue parachutes are deployed to stabilise the CM's attitude and slow it from 500 km/h to 280 km/h.]
So, by the time the drogues deployed, drag had slowed the CM down to 500 kph (about 310 mph), and the main chutes deployed at a velocity of around 280 kph (about 174 mph).
To put that in some sort of perspective, terminal velocity for a human being falling in the classic spread-eagled skydiver position is around 120 mph; a skydiver in a head-down position can reach around 250 mph. So the CM's velocity is hardly unheard of for a parachute deployment.
And bigmouth is confuted once again  |
"The Republican agenda is to turn the United States into a third-world shithole." -P.Z.Myers |
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bigbrain
BANNED
409 Posts |
Posted - 09/16/2005 : 22:45:41 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by ktesibios
"The time is coming up for the ELS (Earth Landing System) to come into play. The SECS (Sequential Events Control System) orchestrates all the events using timers and barometric switches. The system is highly redundant because, like so many systems aboard a spacecraft, the crew's lives depend on it.
At 7,300 metres (24,000 feet) the RCS is disabled and the forward heatshield jettisoned.
Also known as the apex cover, this part of the heatshield wraps around the CM forward compartment where the parachutes and their mortars are mounted. Once jettisoned, a small parachute attached to it slows it down to take it away from the descending Command Module. 1.5 seconds later, two drogue parachutes are deployed to stabilise the CM's attitude and slow it from 500 km/h to 280 km/h"
HA,HA,HA NASA's buffoons continue to use acronyms to solve unresolvable problems:
ELS (Earth Landing System)
SECS (Sequential Events Control System)
NASA's buffoons continue to lie impudently.
"... two drogue parachutes are deployed to stabilise the CM's attitude and slow it from 500 km/h to 280 km/h"
Have astronauts landed at 280 km/h 
Then, already burned to death, the three poor astronauts have broken during splashdown.
YOU ARE MORE AND MORE GULLIBLE PEOPLE.
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"Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit" (Flattery gets friends, truth hatred)
Publius Terentius Afer, "Terence", Roman dramatist
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