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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
 Posted - 04/27/2009 : 06:57:35
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As featured in today's New York Times (it's also among the paper's "most emailed" stories today):CHARLESTON, S.C. Two months after the local atheist organization here put up a billboard saying Don't Believe in God? You Are Not Alone, the group's 13 board members met in Laura and Alex Kasman's living room to grapple with the fallout.
The problem was not that the group, the Secular Humanists of the Lowcountry, had attracted an outpouring of hostility. It was the opposite. An overflow audience of more than 100 had showed up for their most recent public symposium, and the board members discussed whether it was time to find a larger place. ... |
Interesting trend, this...
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Edited by - Cuneiformist on 04/27/2009 06:58:11
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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2009 : 07:22:34 [Permalink]
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And more and more people think the US is going in the right direction. Coincidence?
(yeah, probably) |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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Boron10
Religion Moderator
USA
1266 Posts |
 Posted - 04/27/2009 : 15:29:49 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Cuneiformist
As featured in today's New York Times (it's also among the paper's "most emailed" stories today):CHARLESTON, S.C. Two months after the local atheist organization here put up a billboard saying Don't Believe in God? You Are Not Alone, the group's 13 board members met in Laura and Alex Kasman's living room to grapple with the fallout.
The problem was not that the group, the Secular Humanists of the Lowcountry, had attracted an outpouring of hostility. It was the opposite. An overflow audience of more than 100 had showed up for their most recent public symposium, and the board members discussed whether it was time to find a larger place. ... |
Interesting trend, this... |
That's great news! I regularly met with that group while I was stationed in Charleston, and I was by far the youngest one there.
I remember that one of the main people in their organization (a college professor) had run for state office to challenge the law that you must believe in a higher power in order to hold any government position. |
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The Rat
SFN Regular
Canada
1370 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2009 : 19:42:37 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by Boron10I remember that one of the main people in their organization (a college professor) had run for state office to challenge the law that you must believe in a higher power in order to hold any government position. |
Don't you have something in the constitution that forbids any 'religious test' for holding office? If so then how would that law ever be enacted in the first place? |
Bailey's second law; There is no relationship between the three virtues of intelligence, education, and wisdom.
You fiend! Never have I encountered such corrupt and foul-minded perversity! Have you ever considered a career in the Church? - The Bishop of Bath and Wells, Blackadder II
Baculum's page: http://www.bebo.com/Profile.jsp?MemberId=3947338590 |
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Boron10
Religion Moderator
USA
1266 Posts |
Posted - 04/27/2009 : 22:04:50 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by The Rat
| Originally posted by Boron10I remember that one of the main people in their organization (a college professor) had run for state office to challenge the law that you must believe in a higher power in order to hold any government position. |
Don't you have something in the constitution that forbids any 'religious test' for holding office? If so then how would that law ever be enacted in the first place? |
I think that was the point. The law will remain on the books until the state or the Supreme Court has reason to overrule it. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2009 : 06:22:16 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by The Rat
Don't you have something in the constitution that forbids any 'religious test' for holding office? If so then how would that law ever be enacted in the first place? |
Just because the Constitution forbids something doesn't mean that unconstitutional laws won't get passed.
Also, these religious tests are typically buried within state constitutions. They're not regular laws. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2009 : 17:23:22 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Boron10
Originally posted by The Rat
| Originally posted by Boron10I remember that one of the main people in their organization (a college professor) had run for state office to challenge the law that you must believe in a higher power in order to hold any government position. |
Don't you have something in the constitution that forbids any 'religious test' for holding office? If so then how would that law ever be enacted in the first place? |
I think that was the point. The law will remain on the books until the state or the Supreme Court has reason to overrule it.
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Already was, Boron. In the 70's. SCOTUS ruled on an atheist being barred from a Notary Public position. SCOTUS threw it out based on Article VI, Clause 3.
Torcaso v. Watkins.
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Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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Zebra
Skeptic Friend
USA
354 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2009 : 19:12:09 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Originally posted by Boron10
Originally posted by The Rat
Originally posted by Boron10
I remember that one of the main people in their organization (a college professor) had run for state office to challenge the law that you must believe in a higher power in order to hold any government position. |
Don't you have something in the constitution that forbids any 'religious test' for holding office? If so then how would that law ever be enacted in the first place? |
I think that was the point. The law will remain on the books until the state or the Supreme Court has reason to overrule it.
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Already was, Boron. In the 70's. SCOTUS ruled on an atheist being barred from a Notary Public position. SCOTUS threw it out based on Article VI, Clause 3.
Torcaso v. Watkins.
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But 7 states still have such laws on the books (mostly in their constitutions), which rankles, even though those laws can't be enforced due to the Supreme Court's decision. See here: http://www.religioustolerance.org/texas.htm.
A new Arkansas representative (Green party) introduced a bill earlier this year to have the language struck from the Arkansas constitution, but it has to get through committee, then would go to the voters, & it's felt unlikely to pass the first hurdle.
[Edited to correct "can" to "can't"] |
| Edited by - Zebra on 04/28/2009 19:13:29 |
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dglas
Skeptic Friend
Canada
397 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2009 : 19:22:04 [Permalink]
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| Such wonderful naivete. Anything can be enforced if there is no recourse. |
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- dglas (In the hell of 1000 unresolved subplots...)
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The Presupposition of Intrinsic Evil
+ A Self-Justificatory Framework
= The "Heart of Darkness"
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 04/28/2009 : 21:04:15 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Zebra
Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Originally posted by Boron10
Originally posted by The Rat
Originally posted by Boron10
I remember that one of the main people in their organization (a college professor) had run for state office to challenge the law that you must believe in a higher power in order to hold any government position. |
Don't you have something in the constitution that forbids any 'religious test' for holding office? If so then how would that law ever be enacted in the first place? |
I think that was the point. The law will remain on the books until the state or the Supreme Court has reason to overrule it.
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Already was, Boron. In the 70's. SCOTUS ruled on an atheist being barred from a Notary Public position. SCOTUS threw it out based on Article VI, Clause 3.
Torcaso v. Watkins.
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But 7 states still have such laws on the books (mostly in their constitutions), which rankles, even though those laws can't be enforced due to the Supreme Court's decision. See here: http://www.religioustolerance.org/texas.htm.
A new Arkansas representative (Green party) introduced a bill earlier this year to have the language struck from the Arkansas constitution, but it has to get through committee, then would go to the voters, & it's felt unlikely to pass the first hurdle.
[Edited to correct "can" to "can't"]
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Yup. And it's illegal in the city of Chicago to tie your alligator to a fire hydrant.
They are unenforceable. The 7 states mentioned have not changed their constitutions since the decision. The language is sort of like the deeds to properties in some counties. My grandparents lived in Lombard. They purchased a house in 1952 there. Their deed forbade them from selling the house to a negro. That language, as well as the state constitutions religious provisions, is completely unenforceable. Since the verbiage in question has not been challenged and no elected person without faith has thus far been barred from holding office. I'm not seeing why there should be any rush to have these changed.
If no oxen are being gored and the cost to remove unenforceable detrius from the state constitutions is prohibative, why bother going through the exercise until a constitutional convention is called for? |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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the_ignored
SFN Addict
2562 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2009 : 03:26:19 [Permalink]
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And, of course, anytime that atheists do anything, or if atheism is portrayed in a non-negaative light, the religous right (or in this case, the Telegraph) goes batshit. Details are at PZ's place, in the link I gave.
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>From: enuffenuff@fastmail.fm
(excerpt follows):
> I'm looking to teach these two bastards a lesson they'll never forget.
> Personal visit by mates of mine. No violence, just a wee little chat.
>
> **** has also committed more crimes than you can count with his
> incitement of hatred against a religion. That law came in about 2007
> much to ****'s ignorance. That is fact and his writing will become well
> know as well as him becoming a publicly known icon of hatred.
>
> Good luck with that fuckwit. And Reynold, fucking run, and don't stop.
> Disappear would be best as it was you who dared to attack me on my
> illness knowing nothing of the cause. You disgust me and you are top of
> the list boy. Again, no violence. Just regular reminders of who's there
> and visits to see you are behaving. Nothing scary in reality. But I'd
> still disappear if I was you.
What brought that on? this. Original posting here.
Another example of this guy's lunacy here. |
| Edited by - the_ignored on 04/29/2009 03:27:28 |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2009 : 04:33:47 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Valiant Dancer
Yup. And it's illegal in the city of Chicago to tie your alligator to a fire hydrant. |
I like to imagine the event that sparked this law...
Street entertainer who performs sidewalk gator wrestling chains his partner to a hydrant and takes a lunch break. Gator gets bored, decides to chase a passing pedestrian. Rips the hydrant out of the ground, causing huge water eruption, flooding, and sinkhole. Gator drags hydrant down the street with leash, as hydrant smashes cars, storefronts, knocks down dope dealers and hookers.
Legislators react firmly.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2009 : 05:57:03 [Permalink]
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I bet it was...
Street entertainer who performs sidewalk gator wrestling chains his partner to a hydrant and takes a lunch break. Fire breaks out in nearby building, which burns to the ground because firemen can't reach the gator-guarded hydrant. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2009 : 07:02:38 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
I bet it was...
Street entertainer who performs sidewalk gator wrestling chains his partner to a hydrant and takes a lunch break. Fire breaks out in nearby building, which burns to the ground because firemen can't reach the gator-guarded hydrant.
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Yours is better. Even better, I mean.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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Simon
SFN Regular
USA
1992 Posts |
Posted - 04/29/2009 : 07:32:32 [Permalink]
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| Firemen do reach the fire-hydrant, but not before the courageous captain John Firestache Junior loose his arm to the vicious reptile! |
Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996 |
| Edited by - Simon on 04/29/2009 07:34:34 |
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Atheism growing more popular
