|
|
|
ConsequentAtheist
SFN Regular
641 Posts |
 Posted - 09/29/2002 : 15:48:54 [Permalink]
|
quote:
darwin alogos wrote:
John 19:33-35 "But when they came to Jesus and saw he was already dead,they did not break His legs...35And he who has SEEN has testified and his testimony is true:AND HE KNOWS THAT HE IS TELLING THE TRUTH ;Acts 2:22-32"Men of Israel,hear these words:Jesus of Nazareth,a man attested by God to you miracles,wonders,and signs which God did through Him IN YOUR MIDST,AS YOU YOURSELVES KNOW"...32."This Jesus God raised up,OF WHICH WE ARE ALL WITNESSES" ;2Pet.1:16 For we did not FOLLOW CUNNINGLY DEVISED FABLES[OR MYTHS]when we made know to you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ,BUT WERE EYEWITNESSES OF HIS MAJESTY. You asked for 1 there's 3 I could give more but its overkill and it demonstrates your complete ignorance of the subject matter.
Re John, circa 90-120 CEquote:
The supposition that the author was one and the same with the beloved disciple is often advanced as a means of insuring that the evangelist did witness Jesus' ministry. Two other passages are advanced as evidence of the same - 19:35 and 21:24. But both falter under close scrutiny. 19:35 does not claim that the author was the one who witnessed the scene but only that the scene is related on the sound basis of eyewitness. 21:24 is part of the appendix of the gospel and should not be assumed to have come from the same hand as that responsible for the body of the gospel.
Neither of these passages, therefore, persuades many Johannine scholars that the author claims eyewitness status.
- Robert Kysar The Anchor Bible Dictionary, v. 3, pp. 919-920); emphasis added
Re Acts, circa 80-135 CE, Luke was not a witness to anything.
Re 2 Peter, circa 100-160 CE, II Peter is a pseudepigraph, i.e.quote:
The conceptual world and the rhetorical language are so strongly influenced by Hellenism as to rule out Peter definitely, nor could it have been written by one of his helpers or pupils under instructions from Peter. Not even at some time after the death of the apostle.
- Kummel, Introduction to the New Testament
Try again ... you pathetic little fool. And this time: 1) try to understand the question, and 2) no matter how stupid your answer, make it at least readable.
Edited by - ReasonableDoubt on 09/29/2002 15:55:25 |
 |
|
|
moakley
SFN Regular
USA
1888 Posts |
Posted - 09/30/2002 : 05:33:42 [Permalink]
|
quote:
... epitomize the statement that " [u]THE FOOL HAS SAID THERE IS NO GOD"[/u.]
As far as your bravado just wait untell EkG registers ZERO( I know it's almost there)and we'll see what a tough guy you are then.
Matthew 5:22 "Whosoever shall say Thou fool, shall be in danger of hellfire." [Jesus speaking]
Psalm 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no god.
Is this Psalmist in danger of hell fire? Kind of a confusing rule book
for living.
|
|
|
|
Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
|
|
Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 09/30/2002 : 09:37:56 [Permalink]
|
Slater you epitomize the statement that " [u]THE FOOL HAS SAID THERE IS NO GOD"[/u.]As far as your bravado just wait untell EkG registers ZERO( I know it's almost there)and we'll see what a tough guy you are then.
It is amazing that every time you want to tell me how stupid I am you garble up your sentences. Don't put periods in these html commands by the way. And while you are at it, when you are pretending to be quoting from the bible instead of just copying & pasting from some duplicitous apologetic web site take the footnote numbers out of the copy. The funniest time was when you misspelled the word idiot, while calling me one.
So what is this latest piece of nonsense, a threat? Is the bogey-man going to get me? Are little red devils going to poke me with their pitchforks? Bllarrah! (I'm wiggling my index fingers over my head like horns and sticking my tongue out-a la Elaine Bennis as I write this)
You'll see how tough I am after I'm dead? News flash…I'll be dead…dead as a door-nail. Ya want brave from a corpse? How about this; I'll lie there in a box with a slight smile on my face as the box is fed into a crematorium. And I won't even flinch a muscle. Completely fearless…actually completely everything-less; I'll be dead.
Is that what all of this nonsense is that's coming from you? You espouse all of this medieval garbage because you are a coward?
Okay 'fraidy cat back to your topic, and a question you always avoid.
If your gospels are true simply because they say they are true then what about the "Gospel of Paul," the Gospel of Bartholomew," the "Gospel of Judas Iscariot," the "Gospel of the Egyptians," the " Recollections of Peter," the "Oracles of Christ," the "Sophia of Jesus Christ," the "Gospel of Mary Magdalene," the "Gospel of Thomas," and the "Acts of John?"
These were all books of the bible of the "historic" christian church. They were all written in the same time period as the books you know. They all say that they are the truth. Some claim to be first hand accounts.
Why don't you follow these books too? What standards do you use to tell a true bible from a false one?
-------
My business is to teach my aspirations to conform themselves to fact, not to try and make facts harmonize with my aspirations. ---Thomas Henry Huxley, 1860
Edited by - slater on 09/30/2002 09:41:52 |
|
|
|
Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 09/30/2002 : 11:08:03 [Permalink]
|
quote:
[ Bllarrah! (I'm wiggling my index fingers over my head like horns and sticking my tongue out-a la Elaine Bennis as I write this)
El Diablo! El Diablo!
|
|
|
|
Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 09/30/2002 : 14:23:19 [Permalink]
|
boo!
-------
I learned something ... I learned that Jehovah's Witnesses do not celebrate Halloween. I guess they don't like strangers going up to their door and annoying them.
-Bruce Clark
There's No Toilet Paper...on the Road Less Traveled |
|
|
|
ConsequentAtheist
SFN Regular
641 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2002 : 07:17:51 [Permalink]
|
quote:
darwin alogos wrote
It is amazing that every time you want to tell me how stupid I am you garble up your sentences. Don't put periods in these html commands by the way. And while you are at it, when you are pretending to be quoting from the bible instead of just copying & pasting from some duplicitous apologetic web site take the footnote numbers out of the copy. The funniest time was when you misspelled the word idiot, while calling me one.
I've come to suspect that darwin alogos has some form of disability and should probably be ignored. By the way, Slater, have I ever told you that you're an itiod? 
Edited by - ReasonableDoubt on 10/01/2002 07:18:26 |
|
|
|
Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 10/01/2002 : 09:07:01 [Permalink]
|
Isn't that what they called Clara Bow?
I think DA's problems are the result of injury and not genetic. Sure, he's not very bright and that probably left him open for it but this seems to be "brain washing" by some minor Protestant sect. One of those sects that stresses that man is "fallen," has a "sin nature," and that people are just all in all no good. There's any number of theses nasty sects around. They harp on the more anti-intellectual parts of the bible, like
Proverbs 12:15 The way of a fool is right in his own eyes, but he who heeds counsel is wise
Psalm 14:1, which says, "The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God...." And what was that old chestnut about gods wisdom making man's wisdom into foolishness? Anyway this anti-intellectualism is reassuring for the dim witted. First it says that those people who think that they are smarter than you are a bunch of dopes. Then it reinforces the feelings of inadequacy that that the victim already has. You'll notice that the thing that drives DA to distraction the most is the idea that you actually can think for yourself. The very idea of self reliance and self worth is more than the poor guy can bear. He is not worthy, people aren't worthy. Think for yourself and you are a fool, blindly follow what your church tells you and you are wise (Proverbs 12:15)
Then you top this off with his church's death threat--which he just mentioned when he told me that I'm not as tough as I think.
It's really very sad, I'd like to help him if I could. He's small and frightened and thinks himself to be worthless. ("Help" in this case would be a swift kick in the butt-do him a world of good. Or maybe a stint at Paris Island.) He only lifts from web sites and never expresses his own thoughts because he's been trained to believe that it is wrong for him to have independent thought. He's a modern day serf.
The idea that people on this board are thinking for themselves and entertaining differing opinions is horrifying to him. These opinions all indicate an intellectual freedom that scares the bejezzus out of him. Poor dumb bastard, he thinks he is safe inside of his cage when all the time the bars aren't real.
-------
I learned something ... I learned that Jehovah's Witnesses do not celebrate Halloween. I guess they don't like strangers going up to their door and annoying them.
-Bruce Clark
There's No Toilet Paper...on the Road Less Traveled |
|
|
|
darwin alogos
SFN Regular
USA
532 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 09:29:19 [Permalink]
|
quote:
It's really very sad, I'd like to help him if I could. He's small and frightened and thinks himself to be worthless. ("Help" in this case would be a swift kick in the butt-do him a world of good. Or maybe a stint at Paris Island.) He only lifts from web sites and never expresses his own thoughts because he's been trained to believe that it is wrong for him to have independent thought. He's a modern day serf.
quote:
Neither of these passages, therefore, persuades many Johannine scholars that the author claims eyewitness status.
- Robert Kysar The Anchor Bible Dictionary, v. 3, pp. 919-920); emphasis added
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Re Acts, circa 80-135 CE, Luke was not a witness to anything.
Re 2 Peter, circa 100-160 CE, II Peter is a pseudepigraph, i.e.
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The conceptual world and the rhetorical language are so strongly influenced by Hellenism as to rule out Peter definitely, nor could it have been written by one of his helpers or pupils under instructions from Peter. Not even at some time after the death of the apostle.
- Kummel, Introduction to the New Testament
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interesting I'm accused of being "anti-intellectual"(among other things) for quoting competent respected scholars and yet you hypocrtes have no problem quoting any leftwing liberal biblical "scholars" to support your OUTDATEDideas on NT Introduction(see-The Historical Reliability of John's Gospel - Craig Blomberg for John;for Luke- Acts: Luke,an educated Greek, he was writing within the historical traditions,established by Thucydides and may have been present at some the events he records....he shows a DETAILED KNOWLEDGE OF ROMAN WORLD.His account of Paul's shipwreck on the way to Rome, for instance,is a VALUABLE PIECE OF HISTORICAL EVIDENCE IN ITS OWN RIGHT....The doings of Paul and the early Christians are WELL DOCUMENTED IN THE ACTS OF THE APOSTLES,composed probably in the 60'sAD,as a sequel to his gospel Luke. CHARLES FREEMAN, EGYPT,GREECE,AND ROME,OXFORD UNIVERSITY PRESS,1996 (pps487-488 emph. mine);for 2nd Peter:The evidence of the letter leaves no doubt on this question.The writer is 'Simon Peter,...' No MS evidence would suggest that any of these facts were written into the letter to gain acceptance.The New Bible Commentary:Revised,p1249,David H. Wheaton). As far as "thinking for myself" I least recognize a joke when I see it.Slater you completely missed my point when I pointed out to Atomic the impossibility of proving "
universal negative"and you go off on a tangent trying "define"God's Non-Existence(another Fool's Errand) but you never quite "get it" that to do so one would have to be everywhere at the same time Logically,which seems to be the real problem you display no training in logic.
Edited by - darwin alogos on 10/03/2002 09:34:38 |
|
|
|
PhDreamer
SFN Regular
USA
925 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 09:37:21 [Permalink]
|
Hey DA, I just wanted you to know there was some smack talking going on in the chat room last night and your name might have been mentioned. I assure you I don't approve of such practices and I did everything I could not to participate, I mean to prevent further nastiness. Now the least you could do for me is post a coherent argument.
Generally speaking, the errors in religion are dangerous; those in philosophy only ridiculous.
-D. Hume |
|
|
|
darwin alogos
SFN Regular
USA
532 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 09:45:39 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Try again ... you pathetic little fool. And this time: 1) try to understand the question, and 2) no matter how stupid your answer, make it at least readable.
I'll continue to pray that before I shuffle off this mortal coil the privilege of putting my fist into your arrogant fat head.Now why don't you attempt to answer ONE QUESTION before you hide behind your self fabricated smoke screens:Easy Phd RD will simply resort to the same fallacious reasoning as you just did,namely,how do you know the NT is a collection of"myth-based doctrines"?You don't and offer no evidence to support it,that's called begging the question.But since you brought it up which type of myth is it?
|
|
|
|
darwin alogos
SFN Regular
USA
532 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 10:22:09 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Matthew 5:22 "Whosoever shall say Thou fool, shall be in danger of hellfire." [Jesus speaking]
Psalm 14:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no god.
Is this Psalmist in danger of hell fire? Kind of a confusing rule book
for living.
Just a guess but perhaps He's giving FOOL'S like you,Slater,and RD something to ponder for eternity?
|
|
|
|
Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 10:41:37 [Permalink]
|
It has come to my attention that the original Superman comic books were also written by Jews. Therefore there must be an historic Clark Kent.
We know he is historic because there are witnesses. A whole crowd of people were eyewitness to Clark's miracles. At first they thought he was a bird or a plane but very soon they realized that he was Superman.
Why would a crowd of people subject themselves to public ridicule by declaring at the top of their lungs "It's SUPERMAN" if they did not believe he was real? It is only a naturalistic bias that keeps you from believing that he had powers and abilities far beyond those of normal men.
Astronomers have found over 100 planets circling other stars, and we know that meteorites fall to Earth everyday so obviously there was a Krypton. Left wing Skeptics (who have no morality because without Clark Kent there are no grounds for truth, justice and the American way) that the modern day town of Metropolis (which has a two story tall statue of the man of steel in front of their town hall which is proof enough for anyone who isn't a fool) isn't where Clark lived. And that archeologists have never actually found Metropolis. But we do have confirmation from ancient records that there was such a place as Metropolis because that's were Fritz Lang's sexy C3PO type of robot lived.
There are many Superman comic books written by different authors.
BUT!….
1)They all were written within the lifetime of people who would have known Superman.
2) They are all written in English, the language spoken in Metropolis in those days.
3) Although they vary on details they all agree on the basic doctrine of Superman. This would be impossible if they didn't share direct knowledge of a historic Clark Kent "mild mannered reporter for a great metropolitan newspaper."
After Superman tied the gun turret of the Nazi super electro battleship in a knot President FDR shook his hand at the White House. Are Skeptics now going to say that there was no FDR? How could FDR shake Superman's hand if he was only a myth?
Fewer books were written about Buzz Aldrin than about Superman. Yet Skeptics are more than willing to believe in this so called Astronaut. But their bias prevents them from believing in the strange visitor from another planet even though he is better documented.
Modern day Superman scholars declare "You WILL believe that a man can fly!" Only the outdated thinking of mothers and house-wives of the past that say foolish things like "Put down that stupid comic book and do your homework."
-------
I learned something ... I learned that Jehovah's Witnesses do not celebrate Halloween. I guess they don't like strangers going up to their door and annoying them.
-Bruce Clark
There's No Toilet Paper...on the Road Less Traveled |
|
|
|
Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 15:10:29 [Permalink]
|
how do you know the NT is a collection of"myth-based doctrines"?You don't and offer no evidence to support it,that's called begging the question.But since you brought it up which type of myth is it?
How many times must this same question be answered? We know it is a myth because it is a retelling of myths that were existing at the time.
The type is called "agrarian savior myth". A sub class of "hero myth" sometimes called "Saoshyant" or "Soteriological myths."
This type of myth is traced back almost to the Neolithic (see Joseph Campbell: Occidental Mythology pg6-7) That is a very good book by the way and it's only $16.95. It will open your eyes about western mythology, which you are pitifully ignorant of.
-------
I learned something ... I learned that Jehovah's Witnesses do not celebrate Halloween. I guess they don't like strangers going up to their door and annoying them.
-Bruce Clark
There's No Toilet Paper...on the Road Less Traveled
Edited by - slater on 10/03/2002 16:46:23 |
|
|
|
ConsequentAtheist
SFN Regular
641 Posts |
Posted - 10/03/2002 : 18:21:29 [Permalink]
|
Damn you Slater, I really don't think they were Orthodox Jews, and that's precisely the type of detail I would expect you to screw up.
|
|
|
 |
|
|
|
Topic Locked
