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sailingsoul
SFN Addict

2830 Posts

Posted - 06/18/2013 :  07:45:45   [Permalink]  Show Profile Send sailingsoul a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

Dana Hunter: Ron Lindsay’s Extraordinary Bullshit Part III: A Fine Fuck You
I now know what sort of organization you are. You are the kind of organization that will ignore years of determined harassment in the interests of some mythical unity. You are the kind of people that will pay lip service to women while embracing their abusers. You would rather blame everything that happened on the people who were offended and the conference they attended rather than admit for one instant that your CEO did the slightest thing wrong. You are the kind of people who believe the Supreme Leader must never sully his lips with an apology. And you are the kind of people who either believe skeptic women are stupid enough to accept your statement as a proper close to this painful chapter, and if we turn out to be smarter than that, you figure you can do without us.

We’ll be happy to watch you try.

They must be using the same play book as the Catholic Church. Over a billion strong, all physically and financially mindlessly following and enabling their continued immoral activities. Hay! if it works for the Church why would anyone think it shouldn't work for others elsewhere.

There are only two types of religious people, the deceivers and the deceived. SS
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/18/2013 :  14:07:56   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Stephanie Zvan: What I'm Doing about That
I want the leadership of our movement to be effective and to represent the interests of the people in our movement. I won’t support any organization that is this incredibly bad at that. How could I trust a board that can’t even answer the question: Does your CEO’s behavior at a particular place and time speak for you as an organization?

So I’m done with all the work to promote CFI national. I’m done with their conferences, both as an attendee and in working to increase their attendance. That will go to organizations that–at a bare minimum–manage to look like they know what they’re doing. I will, however, as strange as this may sound, restart my monthly contributions to CFI.

These contributions will be earmarked for Melody Hensley’s salary. They can have my money as long as they support her. Given that Melody has stood up to Ron Lindsay publicly on several occasions recently*...

...*I’ve had a question on what I’m talking about here. Melody gave a speech on Friday night of the confernce that was everything Ron Lindsay”s should have been. It focused on concrete accomplishments in the last year and on the positive potential of the conference. Whether she intended it this way or not, that speech was a stark rebuke to her boss. The comments she left on his posts on the CFI blog also left little doubt that his behavior at the conference did not make her life easier.
There's a lot of focused talk on the differences between the CFI national group and its local affiliates, and with boycotting the former while supporting the latter. People understand that "CFI" does good work, and they want to see that work continue, but they also understand that there is no single "CFI" that's doing all of that good work.

(Oh, and CFI Canada got its start under CFI Transnational, but is now an independent organization. So our Canadian members/readers need not be embarrassed by Lindsay's nonsense, nor the CFI Board's lack of response, and cutting ties with your CFI won't send the right message.)

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/18/2013 :  14:12:39   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by sailingsoul

They must be using the same play book as the Catholic Church. Over a billion strong, all physically and financially mindlessly following and enabling their continued immoral activities. Hay! if it works for the Church why would anyone think it shouldn't work for others elsewhere.
Funny you should mention that particular group. It's been mentioned a lot in these CFI discussions. Folks saying that there are people in CFI who do nothing but good work and need to be supported, so nobody should boycott CFI. The response has often been along the lines of, "I'm sure there are people doing good stuff who happen to work for the Catholic Church, too, should we not urge people to get away from that group for the sake of those few?"

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/19/2013 :  06:03:03   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Skepticon Says Goodbye To a Sponsor
[A]fter witnessing the actions of one of our years long sponsors, the Center for Inquiry (CFI), it has come to our attention that, in order to uphold the values that we have come to embody and endorse, we will no longer accept their sponsorship.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/19/2013 :  07:58:32   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Seth Kurtenbach (who writes for CFI's "The Course of Reason" blog): A Fifth Grader’s Response to the CFI Board’s Statement
In the second paragraph, we learn that the CFI Board has a wish. A wish is a want, or a desire. Some people believe wishes come true under certain circumstances. For instance, some people believe a genie can make a wish come true. Other people believe wishing upon a star makes your wishes come true. I don’t believe in those things, but maybe the Board does.

The CFI Board’s wish is to express unhappiness. Unhappiness is a lot like sadness. This is a very sad wish. Why is the Board sad? Because of a controversy about their women’s conference. I wonder who did this to them? Whoever did controversy to them must be pretty mean, because it makes the Board wish to express unhappiness. The people who made this controversy must have a problem with women. I hope the Board’s wish comes true, so that they can express this unhappiness, and the people behind this controversy can feel ashamed! Maybe I will wish upon a star that their wish will come true.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13477 Posts

Posted - 06/19/2013 :  08:33:33   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Welp. This is getting interesting. I'm glad that most of the people who are pissed about the CFI response are not blaming local CFI chapters and ending their relationship with those. They do seem to be a very loose affiliation, and mostly independent.

This is starting to feel like the never ending dustup.

Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/19/2013 :  10:49:04   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Kil

This is starting to feel like the never ending dustup.
It could end very quickly. Secular/atheist/skeptical leaders could write pieces like this or sign letters like this and actually fucking mean it.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2013 :  13:44:00   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
By the way, today marks the third second anniversary of "Guys, don't do that."

(The video on that page is NSFW.)

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
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ThorGoLucky
Snuggle Wolf

USA
1487 Posts

Posted - 06/20/2013 :  22:58:26   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit ThorGoLucky's Homepage Send ThorGoLucky a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Dave W.

By the way, today marks the third second anniversary of "Guys, don't do that."

(The video on that page is NSFW.)

Sweet sweet satire.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/22/2013 :  15:47:03   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Ron Lindsay: Some Remarks on My Talk at WIS2 in full:
It has been a few weeks since I have said anything in public about the controversy over my remarks at the Women in Secularism 2 conference. As CFI announced via Twitter, this pause was to enable the board to have time to consider the matter. The board has issued its statement. It is now an appropriate time for me to make some remarks.

I am sorry that I caused offense with my talk. I am also sorry I made some people feel unwelcome as a result of my talk. From the letters sent to me and the board, I have a better understanding of the objections to the talk.

I am also sorry that my talk and my actions subjected my colleagues and the organization to which I am devoted to criticism.

Please accept my apologies.
Ophelia Benson comments:
Ok it’s downright stiff. But it still might make conversation possible. I think that would be better than permanent war.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/23/2013 :  12:25:31   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Stephanie Zvan: Apologies Are Hard
CFI is holding a branch leaders meeting at the moment. Several people who are there are telling me (in varying degrees of public settings) that discussions there have been intense. They are also confirming that when Lindsay says he’s starting to understand what the letters told him. He is listening again.

Lindsay has apologized to CFI staff. Official communications from CFI refer to this apology as “heartfelt”, and people at the meeting confirm this. Both in terms of professionalism and in terms of him dealing with people I care about, this is huge to me.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/26/2013 :  03:44:49   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Everyone: Point of Inquiry staff moves to Mother Jones
On Friday, Point of Inquiry’s two co-hosts—Indre Viskontas and Chris Mooney—resigned from their positions at the Center for Inquiry. On Monday, Point of Inquiry producer Adam Isaak followed suit. This note is to explain our reasons for departing CFI and our future plans.

...

These actions have generated much discussion, criticism and polarization within our community. In addition, they created an environment at CFI that made it very difficult for our producer, Adam Isaak, to continue working there.

We, like others, welcome Lindsay’s recent apology. That apology, however, was not followed by any direct effort to retain Chris or Indre, nor did it make up for the very real toll this controversy has taken upon our podcast and our ability to produce it.

The actions of Lindsay and the Board have made it overwhelmingly difficult for us to continue in our goal to provide thoughtful and compelling content, including coverage of feminist issues, as in past interviews with guests like Amanda Marcotte, Katha Pollitt, MG Lord, and Carol Tavris.

The Center for Inquiry has supported us in the past and has asked Chris and Indre to speak at many of its conferences. We are thankful for that. But we’re a team and we do this together. We believe that this controversy has impaired our ability to produce the highest quality podcast under the auspices of CFI and that our talents will be put to better use elsewhere.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
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Kil
Evil Skeptic

USA
13477 Posts

Posted - 06/26/2013 :  09:29:40   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Kil's Homepage  Send Kil an AOL message  Send Kil a Yahoo! Message Send Kil a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Hey Dave. Does this mean you have to like Chris Mooney now?


Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.

Why not question something for a change?

Genetic Literacy Project
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 06/26/2013 :  09:36:18   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
Originally posted by Kil

Hey Dave. Does this mean you have to like Chris Mooney now?

LOL. Let's just say that I appreciate him a little more, now.

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie

USA
26022 Posts

Posted - 07/28/2013 :  15:16:17   [Permalink]  Show Profile  Visit Dave W.'s Homepage Send Dave W. a Private Message  Reply with Quote
CFI News and Updates:
Right now, we are in the early planning stages for Women in Secularism 3.
That's good news!

(Via Richard Carrier)

- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too.
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