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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 04/14/2007 : 15:52:17
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This has gotta be the livin' end! Did you know that brain tumors, as an evolutionary process, could/might/should be prime examples of Darwin's Theory? Well, thus does Dr. Michael Egnor attack a process that he knows little about, and understands even less.........
quote:
Dr. Novella is missing a much better example of random mutation and natural selection that's not metaphorical at all. Cancer is a test of Darwin's theory. Cancer is real biological evolution by random mutation and natural selection, writ fast. There's no reason to invoke encyclopedia typos or tractor engines in order to understand what "chance and necessity" can do to a living system. Brain tumors are perfect little Novellian "two-cycle engines" nestled inside the skull, "random mutations" coming out the ears, and "natural selection" like there's no tomorrow (excuse the metaphors). Brain tumors are constantly generating new biological variation, and they are avatars of natural selection. They provide a tremendous spectrum of variation, from "variation jet-engines" like malignant glioblastoma multiforme to "variation tortoises" like benign pilocytic astrocytomas. Cancer wards are full of patients brimming with "two-stroke engines" of evolutionary change.
Therefore, a brain tumor is a Jet Ski...... Or something.
I dunno. Egnor was probably trying to be a smartass, but sometimes I think these clowns in their own persons are a good argument against evolution. After all, how can idiotcy be a survival advantage in any ecosystem outside of those found in rubber-walled rooms?
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/14/2007 : 18:22:14 [Permalink]
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| Egnor's the doctor who denies that evolutionary theory is at all useful to the practice of medicine. The folks at Panda's Thumb and Science Blogs have fisked him mercilessly. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
 Posted - 04/14/2007 : 21:43:59 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Dave W.
Egnor's the doctor who denies that evolutionary theory is at all useful to the practice of medicine. The folks at Panda's Thumb and Science Blogs have fisked him mercilessly.
I haven't been following the adventures of Dr. Egnor as closely as I might have. Beyond watching The Thumb gouge at him now and then, I don't know all that much about him. Heh, every time I read his name, I think of the old Foghorn Leghorn quip: "That's a yoke, son!"
The little of his writings I have read have convinced me that he defiantly knows not whereof he speaks. The DI is going to have some difficulty getting any credibility at all out of this guy.
Sign o' the times, I think. ID is in the process of withering on the vine, or so it looks to me.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
 Posted - 04/14/2007 : 22:18:50 [Permalink]
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Cancer would only be an "avatar of natural selection" if it killed off members of a species before they reached sexual maturity, and in large enough numbers to cause negative population growth.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2007 : 01:10:49 [Permalink]
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| There is a reason why he has been called egnorant... |
METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden! |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2007 : 03:19:03 [Permalink]
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Well, there is a certain similiarity between oeuf and oaf....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2007 : 04:12:03 [Permalink]
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My question: How can Dr. Egnor's statement that evolution is unimportant to medicine coexist with the statement that brain cancer is an example of evolution?
If the second statement is true, then evolution is very important to his own field of medicine, brain surgery. Egnor, pious fraud that he is, has just tripped over his own lies, by contradicting himself.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 04/15/2007 04:14:01 |
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 04/15/2007 : 17:45:25 [Permalink]
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| Patron Saint of ID! Quite apt, methinks. Apologies to anyone who likes the movie. Pity to anyone who thinks that it is a "good" movie. |
METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden! |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2007 : 02:39:16 [Permalink]
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quote:
Anything is possible in a world that is not limited to natural explanations for the existence of life as we know it. In such a world, cats can give birth to dogs, bacterial flagella are manufacured by minute engineers and the occurrence of an unlikely event implies intelligence. The sky is the limit...
In an ID World
Are we certain that this is not a sarcasm? Or have I read it wrong?
The quote might make a good signature....
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Starman
SFN Regular
Sweden
1613 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2007 : 06:05:22 [Permalink]
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Egnor is going to be a major embarrassment to the Disco Institute.
He seems to be a real person but are his creationist views genuine? Is this some kind of "How stupid things can I say before the Disco Institute will distance itself from me" field study, ala Alan Sokal ?
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"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2007 : 14:49:08 [Permalink]
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A few days ago...Dr. Michael Egnor, creationist neurosurgeon and Discovery Institute blogger, has a problem. Either he hasn't figured out that we're way past April Fools Day, or he has just managed to produce what might just be the single dumbest anti-evolution argument that I have ever seen. We're talking about a demonstration of absolute, rock-bottom, Kent-Hovind-eat-your-heart-out, triple-distilled essence of pure stupid.
The argument today - and I warn anyone who knows anything at all about evolution to put down all food and drinks right now - is that if evolution was right, we should see some brain tumors acting to make better brains.
- The Questionable Authority Dunford filed it under "just plain dumb."
And a commenter to that blog entry accurately noted:No longer can the tacit relation between brain surgery and brilliance be taken for granted. Egnor has ruined it for a lot of neurosurgeons. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2007 : 16:23:27 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by filthy
Are we certain that this is not a sarcasm? Or have I read it wrong?
The quote might make a good signature....
Just me taking the piss out of ID. It can, of course, be difficult to tell the difference between this and when someone is genuinely serious... |
METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden! |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2007 : 17:49:35 [Permalink]
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quote:
The argument today - and I warn anyone who knows anything at all about evolution to put down all food and drinks right now - is that if evolution was right, we should see some brain tumors acting to make better brains.
He just rented "Phenomenon" and had an epiphany. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 04/16/2007 : 19:51:52 [Permalink]
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Just like "In the ID World" pokes fun with ID, there are various sites that do the same with "evolution". In reality, of course, they don't. Since, like in this example, they are making fun of a straw-man, they are actually making fun of themselves.
In brief, what they are doing is "selling" a "Paley Shaker", wherein you place all the parts of a watch, shake it and hope that an assembled watch comes out by the end of it (yes, it's a combination of Paley's-watchmaker and the tornado-through-the-junkyard "arguments"). The only reason I'm posting about this here is that the site was blogged about at uncommondescent AND I felt compelled to speculate that at least some IDers might be suffering from shaken-baby syndrome. Could explain a lot. |
METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden! |
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From Dembski's Folly & one Dr. Michael Egnor......
