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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 09/24/2007 : 18:22:14 [Permalink]
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Here's another link. See if that makes a difference:
http://tinyurl.com/2w8m7n |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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JohnOAS
SFN Regular
Australia
800 Posts |
 Posted - 09/25/2007 : 00:13:07 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
Will you please make up your mind, you can't have the cake and eat it...?
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Not hassling you Mab, this expression is often misused, even by those for whom English is their first (or only) language.
The origin of the phrase is described well in wikipedia's entry.
The phrase's earliest recording is from 1546 as "wolde you bothe eate your cake, and have your cake?" (John Heywood's 'A dialogue Conteinyng the Nomber in Effect of All the Prouerbes in the Englishe Tongue') alluding to the impossibility of eating your cake and still having it afterwards; the modern version (where the clauses are reversed) is a corruption which was first signalled in 1812.
Comedian George Carlin once critiqued this idiom by saying, "When people say, 'Oh you just want to have your cake and eat it too.' What good is a cake you can't eat? What should I eat, someone else's cake instead?".
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Edited to fix wikipedia url. |
John's just this guy, you know. |
| Edited by - JohnOAS on 09/25/2007 00:50:01 |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 00:14:26 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Gorgo
It's a Realplayer file. It's still on the front page of http://www.c-span.org/
9/24/07
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Thanks for trying again and again. I'll need to get RealPlayer now.  |
“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 06:07:46 [Permalink]
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I've watched the entire conference now. Thanks, Gorgo.
Here's my personal impressions.
Colombia President Bollinger explained, I thought quite well, why Ahmadinejad was invited to speak at the university. It was not for Ahmadinejad's sake, but for everyone else's. Then Bollinger tore into Ahmadinejad, mostly in the form of pointed questions.
My first impression of Ahmadinejad was how much like a sermon his speech was, including prayers and many references to God and quotes from the Koran.
Then the politics began to be laid down. One refrain which Ahmadinejad returned to time and again, was his whine about Bolligner's "insults." Clearly, the Revolutionary Guard protects him much better in Iran from tough questioning, and he was not comfortable with being challenged. He also was much better at complaining than in answering Bollinger's questions. Evasion seems a natural tack for Ahmadinejad.
Ahmadinejad had repeated chances to answer "yes" or "no" to two main questions: Does he want Israel to be destroyed? He said plenty, but gave neither a yes or a no. Does Iran support terrorists? What terrorists? You are the terrorists. Again, no yes or no, but plenty of rhetoric, probably addressed primarily at his Palestinian clients.
Ahmadinejad's answer about the treatment of gays, once he was prompted to stop evading it, was an affirmation that he supports his regime's barbaric laws making homosexual acts punishable by death, while at the same time denying that homosexuals even exist. Ahmadinejad made this clear by denying that there are any homosexuals in Iran -- unlike the West.
On the Holocaust, Ahmadinejad took essentially a "teach the controversy" type position, insisting that further "research" -- even about the reality of the Holocaust itself -- is needed. He bemoaned the imprisonment of European Holocaust deniers, as though these neo-Nazis were real, but persecuted, historians.
On women's rights, Ahmadinejad made very pretty (and empty) noises about how wonderful women are, but used as one example of the great treatment of women by mentioning Iranian laws "exempting" them from unnamed "responsibilities." (By that logic, black people in the USA were clearly better off when they were not given "responsibilities" beyond fetching for Massuh.) Of course, the very idea of less responsibility for women is a clear mark of their continuing second class citizenship in mullah-ridden Iran. Again, Ahmadinejad was preaching to the theocratic choir back home.
Ahmadinejad sounded most convincing, or at least relatively less dishonest, when he spoke of Iran's nuclear ambitions. (Personally, I'm unsure of Iran's intentions, but I do feel that there's no need to rush to bomb their nuclear facilities, even if their intention is to make weapons. It would be years before they would have that capacity, with plenty of time for tough diplomacy.)
Ahmadinejad also said some vaguely worded things that sounded much like religious interference in science, ala George W. Bush. I'm sure his own scientists and scholars (some of whom are imprisoned) understood the words more clearly than did I.
Ahmadinejad was first elected as Mayor of Tehran in 2003 by rightist city council members who themselves had been voted in due to a low voter turnout (12%). He used his office to deconstruct many of the political reforms passed by his predecessors, giving many privileges to the mullahs. That gave him great popularity with the mullahs, who made his 2005 election as national President possible. I find this an interesting parallel to George W. Bush's rise. Like Bush, time and disillusionment are wearing away at Ahmadinejad's power. There are a lot of progressive people in Iran. The country may be run by the mullahs now, but it isn't composed of them, any more than the US is made up of fundy televangelists.
An attack on Iran now could boost Ahmadinejad's support, as 9/11 did for Bush. My feeling is that careful diplomacy by the West will give the Iranians time to reclaim more democracy, and be drawn into a more positive engagement with the world.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
| Edited by - HalfMooner on 09/25/2007 06:15:34 |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 06:38:24 [Permalink]
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| I remember reading somewhere that Ahmadinejad is a cleric himself. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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perrodetokio
Skeptic Friend
275 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 06:50:00 [Permalink]
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for any one interested in what is like to be a progressive iranian:
http://www.randomhouse.com/pantheon/graphicnovels/satrapi.html |
"Yes I have a belief in a creator/God but do not know that he exists." Bill Scott
"They are still mosquitoes! They did not turn into whales or lizards or anything else. They are still mosquitoes!..." Bill Scott
"We should have millions of missing links or transition fossils showing a fish turning into a philosopher..." Bill Scott |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 07:30:28 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JohnOAS
Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
Will you please make up your mind, you can't have the cake and eat it...?
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Not hassling you Mab, this expression is often misused, even by those for whom English is their first (or only) language.
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Thanks, I welcome corrections whenever they are needed. It's a part of my growing and learning experience.
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Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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Original_Intent
SFN Regular
USA
609 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 09:14:09 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by perrodetokio
A decade ago the american people didnīt know Iran existed (except for a small elite). Today iran is the wolfman, dracula and the devil altogether. Go figure!
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LMAO.
Where are you from. Here a lot of us remmeber hostages for 444 days in the 1970's.... Held in Iran by the same party that Ahmadenijad is part of. |
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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 09:19:40 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Original_Intent
Originally posted by perrodetokio
A decade ago the american people didnīt know Iran existed (except for a small elite). Today iran is the wolfman, dracula and the devil altogether. Go figure!
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LMAO.
Where are you from. Here a lot of us remmeber hostages for 444 days in the 1970's.... Held in Iran by the same party that Ahmadenijad is part of.
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I remember distinctly in middle school the entire crisis, the failed rescue attempt, and Ronny boy coming in to save the day. I remember going to an event with my father (I think it was the Shriners, my father was heavy into it back in the salad days) where people were shooting targets with guns - and the Ayotollah's face was on the bullseye. |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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| Edited by - pleco on 09/25/2007 09:23:45 |
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Original_Intent
SFN Regular
USA
609 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 09:21:00 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
Original Intent... I don't get you.
First you write:
Originally posted by Original_Intent
I refuse to hope someone assassinates a duly elected offical of the United States (no matter how treasonous/scumbag acting), as he serves as the choice of the people. |
And in your second breath you write:
Aidding and abetting the enemy should always be dealt with with lead.
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Will you please make up your mind, you can't have the cake and eat it...?
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The president has to be dealt with in a way outlined in the constitution. It is not my fault that the scumbags on both sides of the aisles that get elected cannot act in a way befitting their offices. |
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Original_Intent
SFN Regular
USA
609 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 09:23:20 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by pleco
I wonder if he is a global warmer denier too?
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Probably not a denier, definitly a denier in MMGW. After all, it is all the will of Allah. |
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pleco
SFN Addict
USA
2998 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 09:25:08 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Original_Intent
Originally posted by pleco
I wonder if he is a global warmer denier too?
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Probably not a denier, definitly a denier in MMGW. After all, it is all the will of Allah.
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Oops, that's what I meant - must get careful with the terms, god willing. |
by Filthy
The neo-con methane machine will soon be running at full fart. |
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Original_Intent
SFN Regular
USA
609 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 20:34:42 [Permalink]
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Progressive Iranian Expatriate. I wonder what she would think about packing up the show and taing it all to Tehran. |
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Original_Intent
SFN Regular
USA
609 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 20:51:42 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Gorgo
I remember reading somewhere that Ahmadinejad is a cleric himself.
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That is not true, as far as I know.
However he is
He has said in that it is Iran's political, cultural,and economic policies are to pave the way for the Imam Mahdi to return.
Interestingly enough, the the Imam he is looking for cannot return until the end of days. No delusion from that psychopath.
Psychopaths here, psychopaths there.
Edited to remove stuff that should have gone before posting. |
| Edited by - Original_Intent on 09/26/2007 03:55:46 |
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HalfMooner
Dingaling
Philippines
15831 Posts |
Posted - 09/25/2007 : 21:47:10 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Original_Intent
Originally posted by Gorgo
I remember reading somewhere that Ahmadinejad is a cleric himself.
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That is not true, as far as I know.
However he is
He has said in that it is Iran's political, cultural,and economic policies are to pave the way for the Imam Mahdi to return.
Interestingly enough, the the Imam he is looking for cannot return until the end of days. No delusion from that psychopath.
Psychopaths here, psychopaths there.
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I can find no evidence he's formally a cleric, and in Shi'ia Iran, clerics are very formal indeed. He's a civil engineer by training.
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“Biology is just physics that has begun to smell bad.” —HalfMooner
Here's a link to Moonscape News, and one to its Archive. |
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We'd invite Hitler to speak , says Columbia dean
