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jmcginn
Skeptic Friend
343 Posts |
 Posted - 05/07/2002 : 15:45:47 [Permalink]
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quote:
quote:
I have found the evolutionary history of the Platyrrhines to be more to my liking.
Sorry no monkeys on Maui.
There are two related projects in the works. In west Maui, a little inland from Napili a facility is under construction that will house gorillas and chimps who can use sign language. But in central Maui near Waikapu seventy five acres of the West Maui Forest Reserve are being dedicated to a gorilla preserve. An attempt will be made to rescue gorillas from Africa where they face extinction from on going wars and from the "bush meat" trade and establish a "wild" colony on Maui where they can live in peace.
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My business is to teach my aspirations to conform themselves to fact, not to try and make facts harmonize with my aspirations. ---Thomas Henry Huxley, 1860
Hey that sounds really interesting, and it is Maui afterall :). How are you related to the project?
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Badger
Skeptic Friend
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2002 : 21:36:58 [Permalink]
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How do you figure those gorillas will get on with the elk and wild boars?
Man, I love Maui!
In 20 years, you can come visit me in Kihei.
If you think it's work, you're doing it wrong. |
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Wolfgang_faust
Skeptic Friend
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - 05/20/2002 : 08:31:48 [Permalink]
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Wow! I am the one who suggested this poll and I am just now gettting around to posting in it. Let me give you a little background as to why I requested such a poll. When I married my very fundie wife I was also a fundie. I was actually preaching in SW Oklahoma. So I have a perticularly tough situation, in that I became an atheist after we were married. We now have a three year old son and a baby on the way. So I face some of the same problems that Jesus talked about. My wife refuses to even look at the evidence against her beliefs objectively. This morning my son kept saying that we all had to pray before we could eat breakfast. This is something that he learned in a school that he no longer attends. Anyway the reason that I asked for the poll was that I was wondering if anyone else is living in that kind of situation and maybe some advice on how to handle it. I know that my wife would not have married me if she had known that I would become an atheist. And if she were to meet me today she would never give me the time of day. But we are already married and she believes that divorce is a sin. She says that she still loves me and I believe her. She just wants me to come back to the faith and all the other rubbish I am sure you have all heard before. So there it is my story in a nut shell. Let me know what you think.
Add value to every day, Sharpen your skills, your understanding
Edited by - Wolfgang_faust on 05/20/2002 08:33:09 |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 05/20/2002 : 18:56:21 [Permalink]
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quote:
I asked for the poll was that I was wondering if anyone else is living in that kind of situation and maybe some advice on how to handle it. I know that my wife would not have married me if she had known that I would become an atheist.
I forget if or what I might have posted here before but since you put it that way, I think I could not live with someone if they changed that much nor tell them I still loved them while hoping they will change back. If people don't have anything in common what's the point of staying togather. LOL, ironicly, I AM in that very situation with my partner only it's not over religion, thank goodness. There are some things we still can talk about we just don't like to do the same things, watch the same TV shows, listen to the same music or eat the same foods, etc. So we fight about where to go and what to do. As soon as my house is built I'm moving, so that's my solution. I don't belive in Love, but I suppose what ever IT is, it can conquer anything. If you are willing to listen to her try to make you change and stand your ground and she knows you aren't going to change and she will still stay, then there must be some other thing that keeps you together. Otherwise, I'd leave. It's not worth the hassle.
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*Carabao forever.
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Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease
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Wolfgang_faust
Skeptic Friend
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 07:44:29 [Permalink]
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I have an interesting email that I lust got from my uncle in Arizona. The whole email is in response to the signature I have at the bottom of all of my emails. I will include my signature first and then the email that he sent back. Remember this is an uncle talking to his nephew.
"The very concept of sin comes from the bible. Christianity offers to solve a problem of its own making! Would you be thankful to a person who cut you with a knife in order to sell you a bandage?" -Dan Barker
"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction."
-Blaise Pascal
"I have never seen the slightest scientific proof of the religious ideas of heaven and hell, of future life for individuals, or of a personal God."-Thomas Edison
And now his response.
Dear Jamie,
We received your e-mail and believe that most of the info about social security is in error. Undoubtedly, there is much room for cleaning up the system, however.
I'm not sure however, why you thought it necessary to include the latter part of your message. If it was meant to shock us, send a message, get attention, be disrespectful, knowing that such trash would offend us, who knows?? Whatever your intent, this is the message we would like to give you. You, as our nephew, have our love as part of our family, and our profound sympathy because you are clearly among the self deceived. There is nothing more pitiful and sad. In our opinion, self deception falls in the same category as immaturity and ignorance. Rest assured that you will one day be judged on the basis of what you knew and rejected. Why anyone would want to gamble their eternal welfare on the words of Edison, who no doubt, was a brilliant man in some areas and a known mental case on the other, is totally beyond me. Death came into the world because of the sin of disobedience. Edison died and so will you. We feel sure if he could come back he would love to correct his mistake. You truly stand in the need of a Savior. We feel sure you have to keep up this silliness or you just might look around and see what is happening in the world and realize that things are coming to pass just as God's word says they would. Jamie, nothing is more disgusting than idiocy passed off under the guise of intelligence.
In the future, if you feel the need to pass on such garbage, please delete our names from your list. When you offend the God we honor, serve and love, you offend us.
You have now put yourself on the top of our prayer list and we are going to pray that God will do whatever it takes to get your attention. You seem to want the attention of others in our family and use this means of getting it, but God wants yours, and may we remind you that He loves you enough to play hardball in order to keep you out of hell!!!
We love you and will be praying for you.
Uncle Don and Aunt Norma
Just thought I would see what you guys thought of it.
P.S. Just so you know the original email was something about social security, and had nothing to do with religion. It was just the Yahoo signature that had him upset.
Edited by - Wolfgang_faust on 06/06/2002 07:46:26 |
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Bradley
Skeptic Friend
USA
147 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 08:24:51 [Permalink]
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Wolfgang, the thing which most strikes me about your aunt and uncles' email is that whichever of them composed it has unusually good language skills for a religious person -better, indeed, than those displayed by some of the postings on this website (this is assuming that you posted it as is with none of your own editing).
I think you should point out to your kin that the quotes they find objectionable are your email signature, and consequently were not intended to offend them in particular, as they appear on all your electronic communications, regardless of the addressee.
I can certainly relate to getting this kind of flack from relatives. Almost all of mine are religionists, one cousin I know is an agnostic, and none are professed Atheists (though I suspect several are closet Atheists). Oy, such a family I got.
My sweetheart of ten years is an Atheist. She has a daughter, a son-in-law (married to each other), and a granddaughter (the daughter of another daughter who is a theist), and they are all very intelligent and supportive.
"Too much doubt is better than too much credulity."
-Robert Green Ingersoll (1833 - 1899) |
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Wolfgang_faust
Skeptic Friend
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 08:41:41 [Permalink]
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Just to clear things up; the email he sent me was cut-and-pasted directly with no tampering on my part. You get it exactly as I got it. I am planning to write them and let them know that the email I sent them also went out to about 15 other people in my email address book and was not intened to offend. If anything I put it on my outgoing mail to make people think. I realize that most Xians hate to think and it is easier to simply attack and threaten the other side with eternal damnation.
Add value to every day, Sharpen your skills, your understanding
Edited by - Wolfgang_faust on 06/06/2002 08:42:32 |
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Jesus
New Member
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 10:55:48 [Permalink]
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Hi Wolfgang So sorry to here of your strife.Although my wife and I don't talk about religion much, we still do love each other and we have a miracle named Ciara (we hade sex one night unprotected) anyway the three of us were coming home from Jacksonville (to Kissimmee) and I was talking to our car saying please baby you can make it.She said I was really talking to god not the car!I was pissed !!! The car had been leaking radiator fluid .I had to patch it as best I could ,to make the three hour ride home in order get to work on monday.I said if you think god is responsible for getting us home ,then why did he blow the fucking hose in the first place ,and where was the almighty when Susane Smith was standing at the side of that lake thinking about drowning her children?He could have said NO Susane ,in a loud bomming voice I told her and her god to fuck off and stay out of my life ..... P.S.Bradley I know I can't write.
Eat more Xtian,taste like fish |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 11:20:00 [Permalink]
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quote:
Just to clear things up; the email he sent me was cut-and-pasted directly with no tampering on my part. You get it exactly as I got it.
Bradley, that's the thing that confusses me, there are so many 'educated' people who strongly believe in myths as the aunt and uncle of Wolfgang. You'd think if you show otherwise intelligent people the impossibility of a god they understand or at least entertain the question. But no, they try to convert you.
I was shocked to see the name of your aunt. Geeses, that's my name too. Well that blows my theory that people with the same name have similar traits.
Wolf, do you need help, of any kind? Hey! If so, they are praying for you. Who doesn't need all the help they can get? You might win the lottery now. You should thank them.
I might ask you seriously, how much do you want to keep in contact with your family? Just because someone is blood related doesn't mean you have to have any friendship with them. I no longer speak to my x-sister and it hasn't taken away anything from my life. (it wasn't for religious reasons, although I suppect Dr. Larua had something to do with the animosity).
I've found that people who are so stuck to their opinions are not going to change so you will have to decide what kind of relationship you will want in the future with your aunt and uncle. IMO, it's not worth arguing with them, unless you just like to hear yourself talk.
Norma
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*Carabao forever.
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Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease
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Wolfgang_faust
Skeptic Friend
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 12:14:47 [Permalink]
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I really don't want to argue with them about this issue. I am beginning to grow weary of the same old arguement over and over. I have come to the realization that Xians can't be rationalized with unless they are ready to think for themselves. Most Xians I know that have left the faith was because they figured it out for themselves and not because someone convinced them. However, I have also learned how to have a relationship with someone while agreeing to disagree. This uncle happens to live in Arizona while I am in Colorado, and I hadn't heard from him in years. The only reason he got the email about social security is because he was in my yahoo address book and I sent in out in a bulk mailing. I don't think I will respond except to let him know I got it and that I meant no offence.
I did buy a Powerball ticket just in case though, Snake. I guess we will see if this prayer thing works.
I forwarded my uncles responce to my atheist brother and this is what he said.
I find that this is a typical response. I recieved one very similar to it
from Uncle Norm and Aunt Lois. They typically would be very thankful to the
person who cuts them to sell them the bandage. I actually find that this is exactly in keeping with the ethics that I find in the bible in general. I very much prefer the acceptance of personal resonsibility for your own actions and the principle of non-initiation of force. Perhaps they are following the Golden Rule and wish us to treat them in a similar
manner. I find that their reasoning leave a great deal to be desired. I don't follow
that how you are self decieved, nor how this is somehow better than being
decieved by someone else. Perhaps if someone else fools you then you can
always cry that you didn't know. I find that if it is indeed self deception
that is better for you have relied upon your own reasoning and thought, and not relied on Faith or the reasoning of someone else.
The aunt and uncle he is referring to here told me that because I had left Xianity I had "damned my son's soul to hell." It just amazes me how brutal a person who claims to follow a person who said to love your neighbor could be. But, then again, Jesus also said if any man doesn't hate his mother and father can't be my disciple.
To be honest at family get togethers I just try not to bring it up.
Add value to every day, Sharpen your skills, your understanding
Edited by - Wolfgang_faust on 06/06/2002 12:17:40 |
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Snake
SFN Addict
USA
2511 Posts |
Posted - 06/06/2002 : 22:57:31 [Permalink]
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quote:
I did buy a Powerball ticket just in case though, Snake.
Do I get an encouragement fee? Like a finders fee. If you win.  Hell, I'll even pray for you then too.
quote:
I don't follow that how you are self decieved, nor how this is somehow better than being decieved by someone else.
It just amazes me how brutal a person who claims to follow a person who said to love your neighbor could be.
I wonder what would happen if you ever asked?
Looks like you have everything under contol.
Good luck.
And let me know when we win.
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*Carabao forever.
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Blessed are they who can laugh at themselves for they shall never cease
to be amused. |
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