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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
 Posted - 06/16/2001 : 16:34:05
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There are a great many otherwise sane and seemingly rational people who have a certain belief in the stars as having something do do with their destiny.
A wonderful book (my copy of which is somewhere hiding in my bookshelves) is *The Cambridge Guide to the Constellations* where, on one of its pages, the actual positions of the Zodiac are shown to be radically different from the positions which the Zodiac held 2000 years ago, still faithfully used by the Astrologers.
What does anyone here think about astrology?
ljbrs
Nobody knows better, so nobody can do better -- or something like that...
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rubysue
Skeptic Friend
USA
199 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2001 : 17:31:10 [Permalink]
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The only horoscope I read with any regularity is that provided by Lloyd Schumner, Retired Machinist and A.A.P.B certified Astrologer for The Onion.
http://www.theonion.com/
Look for this week's horoscopes under the features heading. I have literally spit wine through my nose reading some of the fine predictions by this wise sage.
Seriously, IMHO, astrology belongs to that group of trashy and idiotic beliefs and practices that have always infested the fevered brains of gullible human beings. Other similar nonsense: Psychics, palm reading, scientology, channeling, homeopathy, tarot, etc., etc.
You could literally poke the stick of reason into the eye of the typical believer in this crapola and they will still look beyond the pain and reality and prefer to believe in the myth and the magic. Human beings have not really evolved much beyond the cave painting and shaman magic craft, in spite of being surrounded by the trappings of science and technology. It's a conundrum!
rubysue
If your head is wax, don't walk in the sun.
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Randy
SFN Regular
USA
1990 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2001 : 17:51:16 [Permalink]
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quote:
There are a great many otherwise sane and seemingly rational people who have a certain belief in the stars as having something do do with their destiny.
(snip)
I think you can easily add religious belief with belief in the stars because both require similar input from followers,....to forget about questioning the claims made.
To re-write a famous Sagan quote for the "believers" to use....."Extraordinary claims require no proof what-so-ever!"
What irks me is the huge popularity of astrology columns in newspapers. Guess the papers want a broad-base readership.
I've known some people over the years who read the daily charts, as they say, just for fun. When they ask what my sign is, I'll usually say the "STOP" sign, followed with something of the effect the tooth fairy has more believability going for it than astrology.
Remember the Raygun presidency and of he and Nancy's consulting with their private astrologer about issues of the white house and the country? Scary stuff!
Astrology charts in newspapers need to be in the comics section or no section at all.
And what of the gawd-awful Cleo?...and the ad nauseum Psychic Network TV ads?
-Most excellent Rubysue!....and the Onion horoscope!!! Funny, funny stuff!
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@tomic
Administrator
USA
4607 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2001 : 19:42:00 [Permalink]
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I hate those Cleo ads sooooo much. What's also funny is the way the ads change. First it was astrology, then tarot cards...who knows what's next?? Cleo's entrail readings?
@tomic
Gravity, not just a good idea...it's the law! |
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Boron10
Religion Moderator
USA
1266 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2001 : 20:13:47 [Permalink]
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quote:
Astrology charts in newspapers need to be in the comics section or no section at all.
I must admit, I read the horoscope. Every paper I have ever read has the horoscope nestled among the comics, and I was shocked to find that some people actually take it seriously.
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Lisa
SFN Regular
USA
1223 Posts |
Posted - 06/16/2001 : 20:39:23 [Permalink]
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So I'm sitting down at the Rimrock Happy Tavern the other night, and some guy asks me what my interests are. I start listing them off. When I hit "astronomy", he says "really, what's your sign?" I didn't move a muscle, but I must have had an interesting look on my face. This 250lb biker actually flinched and said "did I get them mixed up again?" We quickly moved on to more pleasant topics like the upcoming rally.
Astrology, like so many of the other pseudosciences, makes absolutely no sense if you spend about a nanosecond thinking about it. As to why people continue to believe this crap, I don't have a clue.
Lisa
Chaos...Confusion...Destruction...My Work Here Is Done |
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Randy
SFN Regular
USA
1990 Posts |
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Randy
SFN Regular
USA
1990 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2001 : 00:09:46 [Permalink]
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From skeptic.com
If People could read minds........
--We wouldn't need trials or juries, just psychic judges.
--Exams would be pointless with the teacher in the room
--It would put an end to lying and lie detectors.
--Guys would have to be very careful about their thoughts when out on a date.
--Some teenage kids would be in really really big trouble with parents
If people could really remote view:
--automatic teller numbers and credit card numbers would be up for grabs
--doctors could dispense with x-rays, and cat scans
--hide and seek would go out of fashion as a playground activity
--Strip joints and topless bars would go out of business
--Pregnant women would not need sonograms to see if they were having a girl or a boy.
--Cheating spouses would be in big trouble.
--No one would have to watch sports on TV because you could just go there in your mind.
If people could really see the future:
--Las Vegas would become a ghost town.
--lottery jackpots would always be shared by tens of thousands of people.
--airlines would have an "Early Psychic Warning System" and merely cancel flights that are going to crash.
--divorce would be unknown with psychic marriage councilors.
--psychics would dominate wall street
If psychics could really bend metal with their minds:
--Enemy psychics could bend the wings on Air Force planes.
--Enemy psychics could bend army tank barrels.
--When tested by skeptics, psychics would not actually have to touch the metal with their hands! |
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Randy
SFN Regular
USA
1990 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2001 : 00:25:05 [Permalink]
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quote:
I hate those Cleo ads sooooo much. What's also funny is the way the ads change. First it was astrology, then tarot cards...who knows what's next?? Cleo's entrail readings?
@tomic
Yeah, notice how she picks at herself, looks at whatever it is, then funbles with "da carts on da tabel", all while she babbling on with incredibly pedestrian comments that are so vague. Fake Carribean accent.....
"Oh, an dat beebe?, your new beebe?....it haos dat chinn, dat weird chinn."(she pushes her index finger into her chin, like Kirk Douglas must be the dad! 
Call now for your free psychic reading. |
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2001 : 16:05:08 [Permalink]
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Folks:
Before I get to answering anybody's individual (and wonderful) comments, I am posting this interesting list (which I have carefully typed up and carefully checked) from:
THE CAMBRIDGE GUIDE TO THE CONSTELLATIONS
by Michael E. Bakich
==========
Sun signs -- the constellations of the zodiac
1. TRADITIONAL DATES
Aries - 21 Mar - 19 Apr (30 days)
Taurus - 20 Apr - 20 May (31 days)
Gemini - 21 May - 21 Jun - (32 days)
Cancer - 23 Jun - 22 Jul - (31 days)
Leo - 23 Jul - 22 Aug - (31 days)
Virgo - 23 Aug - 22 Sep - (31 days)
Libra - 23 Sep - 23 Oct - (31 days)
Scorpius - 24 Oct - 21 Nov - (29 days)
Sagittarius - 22 Nov - 21 Dec - (30 (days)
Capricornus - 22 Dec - 19 Jan - (29 (days)
Aquarius - 20 Jan -18 Feb - (30 (days)
Pisces - 19 Feb - 20 Mar - (30/31 days)
2. ACTUAL DATES
Pisces - 12 Mar - 18 Apr - (38 days)
Aries - 19 Apr - 13 May (25 days)
Taurus - 14 May - 19 Jun (37 days)
Gemini - 20 Jun - 20 Jul - (31 days)
Cancer - 21 Jul - 9 Aug - (20 days)
Leo - 10 Aug - 15 Sept - (37 days)
Virgo - 16 Sep - 30 Oct (45 days)
Libra - 31 Oct - 22 Nov - (23 days)
Scorpius - 23 Nov - 29 Nov - (7 days)
Ophiuchus - 30 Nov - 17 Dec - (18 days)
Sagittarius - 18 Dec - 18 Jan - (32 days)
Capricornus - 19 Jan - 15 Feb - (28 (days)
Aquarius - 16 Feb - 11 Mar - ( 24/25 days)
Note: 45 dates are in agreement with the traditional dates.
==========
I have friends who have two wonderful children whose horoscope would be under Ophiuchus! What a great conversation piece for them to have when responding to some *true believer* wants to know their *sign*!
You, too, can find your *real sign*. Perhaps that might be why none of those horoscopes really work...
ljbrs
If you knew your *sign* better, you might be able to do better. Flip a coin and find out.
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2001 : 16:24:26 [Permalink]
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Wonderful! Not a *true believer* in the bunch of posts here! Great posts! I think all of you scare away the *true believers* and *religious nuts*. That's just fine with me. It is great to know that so many of you exist.
Now, where did I put my Ouija board? Oh well, I shall have to make do with my crystals...
How can I get through the day without them?
ljbrs
You all know better, so you all do better!
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Zandermann
Skeptic Friend
USA
431 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2001 : 16:26:46 [Permalink]
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drat! So now I'm a Taurus.
I'll have to revise my thinking...I've always blamed my split personality on being a Gemini
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Randy
SFN Regular
USA
1990 Posts |
Posted - 06/17/2001 : 17:12:22 [Permalink]
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quote:
Folks:
Before I get to answering anybody's individual (and wonderful) comments, I am posting this interesting list (which I have carefully typed up and carefully checked) from:
THE CAMBRIDGE GUIDE TO THE CONSTELLATIONS...
"This is the (d)yawning of the Age of Aquarius,....."
Thanks for the typing efforts ljbrs! Interesting to see how consistant the inconsistancies are following back to astrology's roots.
Whoever follows this astrology malarky wouldn't be distracted by the simple, yet powerful facts you've presented here.
This reminds me of the religious metaphor of the shepard tending his "flock of sheep"! How sheep-like one has to be to truly believe in astrology.
Astrology, of course, is just one of the myriad of quackery beliefs out there bouncing around in a lot of people's gray matter.
Like Zandermann said elsewhere, we must keep on our kids to develop healthy critical thinking skills, so as not to fall prey to the Cleo's of the world.
An observation here,...ever notice in an occasional movie when "What's your sign" is asked, - the character asking is usually a zipperhead?
Call 1-800-ANA-LYZE for your FREE Skeptic reading today!
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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2001 : 09:56:51 [Permalink]
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quote:
From skeptic.com
If People could read minds........
I saw an article somewhere that explained that if psychic abilities were real, then Bill Gates would not be the richest man in the world (this was back when he was  ). They then explained using math and statistics how even the slightest edge in predicting the Stock Market would produce untold billions the likes of which have never been seen. Not to mention all the lottery winnings.
Also, speaking of Miss Cleo, there's a good article linked from www.skepticnews.com about one guy's experience working for the company behind Miss Cleo.
I also find it very sad that the commercials have quickly degenerated (if that's possible) into soliciting to a select group of people by exclusively talking about cheating partners, and "who's baby is it?" kind of calls.
------------
Gambatte kudasai! |
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Randy
SFN Regular
USA
1990 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2001 : 11:21:35 [Permalink]
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quote:
(snip)
Also, speaking of Miss Cleo, there's a good article linked from www.skepticnews.com about one guy's experience working for the company behind Miss Cleo.
I also find it very sad that the commercials have quickly degenerated (if that's possible) into soliciting to a select group of people by exclusively talking about cheating partners, and "who's baby is it?" kind of calls.
Boiler rooms! Parasites on humanity for sure.
I can get quite cynical on this subject and it's vehicle.
The Jerry Springerism of America. Quite dis-heartening to see the sewer/gutter used as attention-getting devices and elevated to the likes of entertainment
in the public domain. It's a virtual tsunami of it now adays.
Today, our video-eyed huddled masses are watching wretched refuse on Television's teeming shore, for how many hours each day?
Made me think of a early Frank Zappa song......
-I'm the Slime-
"I am gross and perverted
I'm obsessed 'n deranged
I have existed for years
But very little had changed
I am the tool of the Government
And industry too
For I am destined to rule
And regulate you
I may be vile and pernicious
But you can't look away
I make you think I'm delicious
With the stuff that I say
I am the best you can get
Have you guessed me yet?
I am the slime oozin' out
From your TV set
You will obey me while I lead you
And eat the garbage that I feed you
Until the day that we don't need you
Don't got for help...no one will heed you
Your mind is totally controlled
It has been stuffed into my mold
And you will do as you are told
Until the rights to you are sold
That's right, folks..
Don't touch that dial
Well, I am the slime from your video
Oozin' along on your livin'room floor
I am the slime from your video
Can't stop the slime, people, lookit me go."
====
-from Overnite Sensation, 1973
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Bozola
Skeptic Friend
USA
166 Posts |
Posted - 06/18/2001 : 11:37:44 [Permalink]
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also:
----------------------------------------
Frank Zappa
Dumb all over
(Zappa)
From the album You are what you is, 1981, (Bark 2-Barking PW2-37537)
----------------------------------------
Whoever we are
Wherever we're from
We shoulda noticed by now
Our behavior is dumb
And if our chances
Expect to improve
It's gonna take a lot more
Than tryin' to remove
The other race
Or the other whatever
From the face
Of the planet altogether
They call it THE EARTH
Which is a dumb kinda name
But they named it right
'Cause we behave the same...
*We are dumb all over*
Dumb all over,
Yes we are
Dumb all over,
Near 'n far
Dumb all over,
Black 'n white
People, we is not wrapped tight
Nurds on the left
Nurds on the right
Religous fanatics
On the air every night
Sayin' the Bible
Tells the story
Makes the details
Sound real gory
'Bout what to do
If the geeks over there
Don't believe in the book
We got over here
You can't run a race
Without no feet
'N pretty soon
There won't be no street
For dummies to jog on
Or doggies to dog on
Religous fanatics
Can make it be all gone
(I mean it won't blow up
'N disappear
It'll just look ugly
For a thousand years...)
You can't run a country
By a book of religion
Not by a heap
Or a lump or a smidgeon
Of foolish rules
Of ancient date
Designed to make
You all feel great
While you fold, spindle
And mutilate
Those unbelievers
From a neighboring state
TO ARMS! TO ARMS!
Hooray! That's great
Two legs ain't bad
Unless there's a crate
They ship the parts
To mama in
For souvenirs: two ears *(Get Down!)*
Not his, not hers, *(but what the hey?)*
The Good Book says:
*("It gotta be that way!")*
But their book says:
*"REVENGE THE CRUSADES...
With whips 'n chains
'N hand grenades..."*
TWO ARMS? TWO ARMS?
Have another and another
Our God says:
*"There ain't no other!"*
Our God says
*"It's all okay!"*
Our God says
*"This is the way!"*
It says in the book:
*"Burn 'n destroy...*
*'N repent, 'n redeem*
*'N revenge, 'n deploy*
*'N rumble thee forth*
*To the land of the unbelieving scum on
the other side*
*'Cause they don't go for what's in the
book*
*'N that makes 'em BAD*
*So verily we must choppeth them up*
*And stompeth them down*
*Or rent a nice French bomb*
*To poof them out of existance
*While leaving their real estate just where
we need it*
*To use again*
*For temples in which to praise
OUR GOD*
*("Cause he can really take care of
business!")*
And when his humble TV servant
With humble white hair
And humble glasses
And a nice brown suit
And maybe a blond wife who takes
phone calls
Tells us our God says
It's okay to do this stuff
Then we gotta do it,
'Cause if we don't do it,
We ain't gwine up to *hebbin!*
(Depending on which book you're using
at the time...Can't use theirs... it don't work
...it's all lies...Gotta use mine...)
Ain't that right?
That's what they say
Every night...
Every day...
Hey, we can't really be dumb
If we're just following *God's Orders*
Hey, let's get serious...
God knows what he's doin'
He wrote this book here
An' the book says:
*He made us all to be just like Him,"
so...
If we're dumb...
Then God is dumb...
*(An' maybe even a little ugly on the side)*
Bozola
- Practicing skeet for the Rapture.
Edited by - Bozola on 06/18/2001 11:45:09 |
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