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Tokyodreamer
SFN Regular
USA
1447 Posts |
 Posted - 01/22/2002 : 08:45:37 [Permalink]
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quote:
That's still an open issue, but there are fewer and fewer doubters among the scientific community.
Just out of curiosity, what do you base this claim on? Do you have a general list of the numbers of scientists who support it, and can show that this number has grown?
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Sum Ergo Cogito |
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Igrokit
New Member
USA
28 Posts |
Posted - 02/26/2002 : 21:37:32 [Permalink]
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quote:
Incomplete list of responses. How about:
The science is uncertain on whether warming is happening or not and uncertain on the causes if it is.
I agree. I did not answer because I could not find a response that fit my postion. I would vote for your answer, if I could.
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Omega
Skeptic Friend
Denmark
164 Posts |
Posted - 03/13/2002 : 18:44:08 [Permalink]
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Okay, so we're not absolutely sure what's causing the global heating. At least I hope global warming isn't an issue anymore? The new metro here in Copenhagen is being built taking into consideration that the sea-level will rise. And Antarcticas ice is melting at a rather uncanny rate.
But if humans may be a cause, isn't it rather stupid not to try and do anything? I think a lot of people "give up", because it's damn hard for just one person to change the politics of the world. Or the political attitude towards the environment.
Most people have very busy schedules, need their cars and want heat in their rooms without going broke over the bill. That isn't exactly such a big surprise.
What does surprise me, is that some people can cook up a theory, where scientist conspire to inspire fear in ordinary people with scary doomsday scenarios. Maybe the heat got to these people?
"In my opinion, nothing occurs contrary to nature except the impossible, and that never occurs." Galileo Galilei |
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Badger
Skeptic Friend
Canada
257 Posts |
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Chagur
New Member
USA
21 Posts |
Posted - 04/22/2002 : 19:49:06 [Permalink]
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Considering how little scientists 'know', whether on the micro or macrocosmic scale, why rely on their hypothesies? Seems like just tossing a coin would be adequate.
Edited by - Chagur on 04/22/2002 19:50:47
Edited by - Chagur on 04/22/2002 20:10:30 |
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Computer Org
Skeptic Friend
392 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2002 : 16:01:28 [Permalink]
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Even thought it sounds like the "silly response", I voted for the first one. I've just read the following about the Antarctic Ice-pack's melting and sliding down the continent's watershed:quote:
By plunging into the ocean, the East and West Antarctic Ice Sheets could raise sea level by 70 meters -- drowning coastal regions that are home to billions. Aside from a major asteroid impact, it's perhaps the nightmare scenario of global change.
I'm not sure what "waterworld" is or what it means but this quote sure sounds like response #1. 
Edited by - Computer Org on 05/02/2002 16:03:08 |
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Omega
Skeptic Friend
Denmark
164 Posts |
Posted - 05/02/2002 : 19:04:41 [Permalink]
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Chagur> So you think the scientists who say we better watch out for global warming, are speaking out of ignorance? I think geophysics, meteorologists and climate-researcher don't go about making unfounded claims.
Global warming may be “natural”, it may be the sun.
But isn't it an odd coincidence, that it happens, when humans pour massive amounts of carbon-dioxide into the atmosphere?
Freon isn't the bad guy in the ozone-holes creation either?
"All it takes to fly is to fling yourself at the ground... and miss."
- Douglas Adams |
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Tim
SFN Regular
USA
775 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2002 : 05:50:11 [Permalink]
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The more fossil fuels we burn, the more money I make...
Burn more fossil fuels. Hell, I need more overtime, (as if I don't get enough). And, the only way I can work more, (as if that were possible), is if we put a whole bunch more steel structures out in the Gulf, to pump up more dead dinos.
Yeah, burn more fossil fuels. I need a beach in my back yard.
It's going to be in the 90's today, and my upstairs A/C went down last night while I was at work. Burn more fossil fuels. I need a new compressor!
Damn, I'm in a foul mood today!
"The Constitution ..., is a marvelous document for self-government by Christian people. But the minute you turn the document into the hands of non-Christian and atheistic people they can use it to destroy the very foundation of our society." P. Robertson |
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Jesus
New Member
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2002 : 17:58:27 [Permalink]
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I watched a documentery on PBS recently about the oceanic convier that would stop if and when the salidity was lowered to much causing another ice age .In other words the greenhouse affect would cause an ice age .I think there was something in the book Noahs Flood that was said to flood the black sea lake.anyone know anything about that?sorry about the spelling!
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Jesus
New Member
USA
34 Posts |
Posted - 05/03/2002 : 18:03:24 [Permalink]
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By the way I voted some citys would be flooded
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Badger
Skeptic Friend
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/08/2002 : 21:33:31 [Permalink]
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Jesus, the conveyor referred to was probably the Gulf Stream. It brings warm water from the gulf of Mexico, north past Newfoundland and Labrador, then east towards Europe. There, it cools and travels south again, towards the equator, and back to the Carribean. Interruptions are postulated to be caused by increases or decreases in salinity, as there is a stream at the surface of the sea, and another flowing in the opposite direction, lower down. Therefore, differences in density of water caused by changes in salinity or temperature can interfere with this conveyor belt effect, and due to its scope will affect climate.
With regard to the Black Sea being flooded, the premise is that about 10-15K yrs ago, the Mediterranean sea was at a higher level than the Black sea. The Black sea was a freshwater lake, and the Mediterranean was saltwater, as it is today. The straits of Hormuz were not there until the water level in the Med rose due to glacial melt. Then suddenly, the equivalent of 100 Niagara Falls were let loose, when the straits were breached, causing the Black sea to be inundated with salt water from the Mediterranean. This increased water levels by approx. 400 ft, causing land to disappear at about 1 mile/day and giving rise to the tale of Noah.
All of the above is still being studied so it is by no means cast in stone.
As a side note, the same thing happened at the Straights of Gibraltar, when the Mediterranean got flooded, but I can't remember when that was to have occurred.
Tim, do you work for Midcoast?
If you think it's work, you're doing it wrong. |
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Tim
SFN Regular
USA
775 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2002 : 03:24:03 [Permalink]
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quote:
Tim, do you work for Midcoast?
By Midcoast, do you mean Enbridge Midcoast? If so, No. They are a natural gas pipeline company, I believe.
I work for a company that actually builds the rather large production rigs that go offshore. We do mostly deep water stuff, and are now working on about five years of various projects for BP/Amoco. We have an exclusive contract. It seems the big production companies are now trying to consolidate, and control their own networks of service companies. Anyway, we are an independent stock owned company, but the facility I work in is pretty much controlled by BP, But, they are a good company, as these things go.
"The Constitution ..., is a marvelous document for self-government by Christian people. But the minute you turn the document into the hands of non-Christian and atheistic people they can use it to destroy the very foundation of our society." P. Robertson |
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Garrette
SFN Regular
USA
562 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2002 : 05:39:54 [Permalink]
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quote:
Badger:
With regard to the Black Sea being flooded, the premise is that about 10-15K yrs ago, the Mediterranean sea was at a higher level than the Black sea. The Black sea was a freshwater lake, and the Mediterranean was saltwater, as it is today. The straits of Hormuz were not there until the water level in the Med rose due to glacial melt. Then suddenly, the equivalent of 100 Niagara Falls were let loose, when the straits were breached, causing the Black sea to be inundated with salt water from the Mediterranean. This increased water levels by approx. 400 ft, causing land to disappear at about 1 mile/day and giving rise to the tale of Noah.
I think you mean the Bosphorus straits as opposed to the Straits of Hormuz.
And I think the time frame is more along the lines of 5000 - 7000 years ago.
The book is very interesting, though it reaches a bit.
Try this site for a summary of the hypothesis:
http://www.nationalgeographic.com/blacksea/ax/frame.html
This is from there:
quote:
Columbia University geologists William Ryan and Walter Pitman wondered what could explain the preponderance of flood legends. Their theory: As the Ice Age ended and glaciers melted, a wall of seawater surged from the Mediterranean into the Black Sea.
• During the Ice Age, Ryan and Pitman argue, the Black Sea was an isolated freshwater lake surrounded by farmland.
• About 12,000 years ago, toward the end of the Ice Age, Earth began growing warmer. Vast sheets of ice that sprawled over the Northern Hemisphere began to melt. Oceans and seas grew deeper as a result.
• About 7,000 years ago the Mediterranean Sea swelled. Seawater pushed northward, slicing through what is now Turkey.
• Funneled through the narrow Bosporus, the water hit the Black Sea with 200 times the force of Niagara Falls. Each day the Black Sea rose about six inches (15 centimeters), and coastal farms were flooded.
• Seared into the memories of terrified survivors, the tale of the flood was passed down through the generations and eventually became the Noah story.
Next: The Search
Black Sea map courtesy of William Haxby.
© 1999 National Geographic Society. All rights reserved.
My kids still love me. |
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Mespo_man
Skeptic Friend
USA
312 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2002 : 05:51:45 [Permalink]
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quote:
As a side note, the same thing happened at the Straights of Gibraltar, when the Mediterranean got flooded, but I can't remember when that was to have occurred.
[Badger]
Hi Badger,
Wow, that takes me back to some early Geology classes. You have to go back about 4 million years into the Pliocene Epoch. The action of plate tectonics had created the Mediterranean basin. At some point the Straits of Gibralter became one continuous mountain range from North to South across Spain and Western Africa. The Mediterranean Sea became land-locked. The rate of evaporation was (and is today) about 3 times greater than the amount of water flowing into it from all sources, so the Mediterranean began to dry up. The rivers flowing into it, particularly the Rhone and the Nile, cut deeper and deeper gorges as the water level sank. Estimates are that it took only 1500 years to dry up the Med. But when the Straits opened up again, there was a water fall several thousand feet high with a volume 100 times that of Niagara Falls. That's how I remember it being presented. I found a web site that is actually a slide show on this topic.
http://www.geo.arizona.edu/geo2xx/geo212/07/sld001.htm
(:raig |
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Badger
Skeptic Friend
Canada
257 Posts |
Posted - 05/09/2002 : 07:34:08 [Permalink]
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Thanks for the corrections/further information, guys. I appreciate it.
Tim, yup, I was referring to Enbridge Midcoast.
If you think it's work, you're doing it wrong. |
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