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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
 Posted - 09/13/2004 : 23:30:56 [Permalink]
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http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oi=defmore&q=define:evil
I suppose this is a start.
http://dict.die.net/evil/
http://www.keyway.ca/htm2004/20040616.htm
4: And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:
5: For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.
6: And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.
22: And the LORD God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever:
23: Therefore the LORD God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken.
24: So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden Cherubims, and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life.
That is the start of evil and the road to Babylon on this planet. |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 09/13/2004 : 23:42:00 [Permalink]
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http://www.rom.on.ca/ossuary/ossuary_intro.html
This is a fake? Please. |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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Starman
SFN Regular
Sweden
1613 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 00:29:18 [Permalink]
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Most likely, yes!
Your own link:
http://www.rom.on.ca/ossuary/fake.html
Other links from earlier threads here on SFN
(by ktesibios and ConsequentAtheist)
http://www.archaeology.org/0301/newsbriefs/ossuary.html [jan/feb 2003]
"Lacking an archaeological context that might prove or disprove the inscription is real and refers to the biblical Jesus, the James ossuary seems destined to join the Shroud of Turin, its meaning and importance wholly in the eye of its beholder."
http://www.archaeology.org/online/features/ossuary/index.html [june 18, 2003]
Israel Antiquities Authority declares James Ossuary and Jehoash Inscription Fake
http://www.archaeology.org/online/news/patina.html [june 23, 2003]
" The patina of the James Ossuary inscription was tested independently by IAA scientific committee members Yuval Goren (micromorphology) and Ayalon (mass spectrometry). Both tests independently support the IAA's conclusion that the Jehoash Inscription and the inscription on the James Ossuary are forgeries. "
Final Report on the James Ossuary - by Dr. Rochelle I. Altman
"The two parts[of the inscription] are not related; the differences between them
are striking."
"The second part of the inscription bears the hallmarks of a fraudulent later
addition, probably around the 3rd or 4th centuries, and is questionable to say the least."
Paul Flesher, Director of Religious Studies Program at the University of Wyoming:
(The link is now dead)
"In what Aramaic dialect is the inscription written, and is that dialect appropriate for first-century Jerusalem? It turns out that although the dialect of the inscription can be made to fit into first-century Jerusalem, it actually fits much better with the Galilean dialect of the late second to sixth century. There are two linguistic indications that suggest the dialect of Jewish Palestinian Aramaic, which was used in texts and inscriptions from Galilee of a century or more later."
[edited to add link] |
"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones |
| Edited by - Starman on 09/14/2004 00:37:18 |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 03:05:43 [Permalink]
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Thanks Starman. I'm in a little better shape this morning, bur still don't feel up for doing research -- I lost the necessary links and would have to hunt them down.
It's almost as interesting a story as Archeoraptor. Archological fraud is and has long been very common in the Mid East due to new antiquties being found almost daily. The collector's market for them, legal and otherwise, is huge.
My mother visited Egypt some 20 or so years ago and brought back a large, beautifully carved, soapstone scarab. The scoundrel that sold it to her claimed it was stolen from some tomb or other, which she didn't believe for a minute but bought it anyway. She said that it wasn't very expensive, and she liked it. Today, it is my paper weight and I am as fond of it as she was. But still, it ain't the real deal. I've since learned that these things are turned out almost on a production line basis.
The James Ossuary differs from the scarab only in that it is a genuine antiquity that has been tarted up to increase it's value, either monetary or spiritual, or both.
But it's a fascinating story.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 05:14:32 [Permalink]
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Hi, verlch. Regarding the so-called James Ossuary, an object you cited as proof of Jesus (you wrote: "Well they have found the name James Brother of Jesus on it!!! For starters..."), I have to agree at least to some degree with what others have already written. What is clear as that the first part of the inscription, the "James son of Joseph" part is written in one hand, while the second part, "brother of Jesus" is in a different, obviously later, hand.
Does this mean that the whole thing is a fake? That is, does this proove that the ossuary could not have held the remains of James, son of Joseph, brother of Jesus? No-- not on the surface. But it makes the case that it did hold such remains far less convincing.
Much more annoying, though, is the tired 'archaeology-proves-the-bible' argument:
quote:
Guess what, when we dig in the earth we find 'missing links'. Unearthed evidence our bible is true!!! We don't have to say the bible is fiction, because when we dig things up it speaks of Daniel, Kings of Babylon and such.
And this, lifted from who knows where:
quote:
The first excavation was made by British consul J.E. Taylor, who partly uncovered the ziggurat. Clay cylinders found in the four corners of the top stage of the ziggurat bore an inscription of Nabonidus, the last king of Babylon (639 BC), closing with a prayer for his son Belshar-uzur Bel-sarra-Uzur), the Belshazzar of the book of Daniel. Evidence was found of restoration by the ziggurat by Ishme-Dagan of Isin and Gimil-Sin of Ur, and of Kuri-galzu, a Cossaean (Kassite) king of Babylon, of the 14th century BC. Nebuchadrezzar also claims to have rebuilt the temple. Taylor further excavated an interesting Babylonian building, not far from the temple, and part of an ancient Babylonian necropolis. All about the city he found abundant remains of burials of later periods. Apparently, in the later times, owing to its sanctity, Ur became a favourite place of sepulture, so that after it had ceased to be inhabited it still continued to be used as a necropolis.
Why are you talking about Ur? In any case, some of the above is true, and some sounds a bit misleading. The Ur settlement dates at least as far back as the Ubaid period (ca. 4500 BCE), when it was a good-sized town, and remained so into the Uruk and Jemdet-Nasr periods. By the Ur III period (ca. 2100 BCE), it reached its zenith (your Gimil-Sin, now read Shu-Sin, was the 4th king of the dynasty). It continued to be occupied through the Old Babylonian (there's your Ishme-Dagan) and Kassite periods down to about 400 BCE.
It is perhaps most famous for its so-called 'Royal Tombs', which date to the Early Dynastic period (ca. 2600 BCE). But of course there were burials found from other periods, too. After all-- it was a city, and in cities, people die. Your implied notion that Ur was some sort of Babylonian necropolis (a bit of an anachronism, since Babylon wasn't a major city until after 1800 BCE) based on burials found there is false, since you're going to find burials at any site that's seriouslt been excavated.
And none of this has much to do with sun worship, so again: what's your point? |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 05:30:17 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by Skyhawk
It's funny. Verlch goes on wild tangents, makes unusual claims, and angers/confuses the forums (to a point where it makes me laugh). So I have my own conjecture. Maybe he is purposely doing all this to yank on our chains, so he can get a laugh. Even at the expense of going through all this work.
Hi, Skyhawk. Welcome to SFN.
What you're describing above is an internet troll. This person, as you note, delights in riling people up on forums and chat rooms by making insulting, obnoxious, or annoying posts. The term comes from the fishing technique of trolling, wherein one "trail[s] a baited line from behind a slowly moving boat" (from [url=www.websters.com]Websters[/url]. That kind of describes what verlch does quite well, no? Once a topic is dead, he'll introduce a new crazy idea/insult/whatever that will generate a whole new string of responses (witness the two huge creation/evolution posts).
This thread began because earlier verlch asserted that the Babylonians originated sun worship (this, doubtless to keep with some biblical idea). However, as I demonstrated, his argument is bunk. But in true verlch fashion, he comes back months later with new, unrelated posts that make no sense but nevertheless general lots of replies.
I had hoped he'd go away, but as long as he's here I might as well play along... |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 06:23:32 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
quote:
Originally posted by Ricky
Does anyone see a point to that last post?
Just trying to stay on topic there good pal old buddy!!!
Since the topic was sun worship originating in Babylon, I fail to see how your post on the 13th did anything to stay on topic.
We read in your post the same, tired "beware false prophets" being equated to "science which disproves church dogma denies God" arguement. And, quite frankly, it is church dogma and not the Bible which makes the absurd claims of species never changing and the Earth is only 6,000 years old.
Try again, sunshine. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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verlch
SFN Regular
781 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 17:52:03 [Permalink]
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http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/siteindex.html
Check out that site and put your little bs spin on that...There is more things pointing to what the bible says beware of. Radical Evolutionism is just one of these things. |
What came first the chicken or the egg?
How do plants exist without bugs in the soil, and bugs in the soil without plants producing oxygen?
There are no atheists in foxholes
Underlying the evolutionary theory is not just the classic "stuff" of science — conclusions arrived at through prolonged observation and experimentation. Evolution is first an atheistic, materialistic world view. In other words, the primary reason for its acceptance has little to do with the evidence for or against it. Evolution is accepted because men are atheists by faith and thus interpret the evidence to cor-respond to their naturalistic philosophy.
For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; And they shall turn away their ears from the truth, and shall be turned unto fables. II Timothy 4:3,4
II Thess. 2:11 And for this cause God shall
send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
You can not see the 'wind', but you can see its effect!!!!
Evolution was caused by genetic mistakes at each stage?
Radical Evolution has 500 million years to find fossils of fictional drawings of (hard core)missing links, yet they find none.
We have not seen such moral darkness since the dark ages, coencides with
teaching evolution in schools. (Moral darkness)
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
"Thus, many scientists embracing naturalism find themselves in the seeming dilemma recently articulated by biochemist Franklin Harold: "We should reject, as a matter of principle, the substitution of intelligent design for the dialogue of chance and necessity [i.e., Darwinian evolution]; but we must concede that there are presently no detailed Darwinian accounts of the evolution of any biochemical system, only a variety of wishful speculations."
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 18:01:55 [Permalink]
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| Oooooooooeeeeeee... I'm a "Radical Evolutionist!" Bra hahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha...... |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 19:49:56 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/siteindex.html
Check out that site and put your little bs spin on that...There is more things pointing to what the bible says beware of. Radical Evolutionism is just one of these things.
I don't see anything to spin. It's merely another Masonic conspiricy site. There ane a lot of them, some even more hysterical.
But it's interesting to note that a fair number of our country's founding fathers were Freemasons, including George Washington.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 21:03:16 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/siteindex.html
Check out that site and put your little bs spin on that...There is more things pointing to what the bible says beware of. Radical Evolutionism is just one of these things.
Here's my "little bs spin": that site is the dumbest, most poorly designed site on the internet. Link after link, all I got were dumb fucking pictures of what I assume to be images associated with Masons. Oh no! There's a Mason-- and he's... shaking hands! With another Mason!!! The godless whores!!!! Save me Jesus!
Whatever verlch. You're losing your edge. Where are those Neo-nazi sites you used to link? If you're going to troll, at least do a good job of it! |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 09/14/2004 : 22:32:22 [Permalink]
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quote:
There is more things pointing to what the bible says beware of. Radical Evolutionism is just one of these things.
rofl.... you're an idiot. Please show the chapter/verse in the bible that warns people to beware of "radical evolutionism".
And then define evil, not quote some nonsense scripture. Tell me what evil is. No anecdotes, no drivel, no braindead idiocy from some retarded christian website. If "evil" is such a big concern for you, then you should have a clear definition don't you think? A sentence or two, maybe even a paragraph, that lays out a clear concept of what "evil" is. |
Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2004 : 07:09:54 [Permalink]
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quote:
Originally posted by verlch
http://www.freemasonrywatch.org/siteindex.html
Check out that site and put your little bs spin on that...There is more things pointing to what the bible says beware of. Radical Evolutionism is just one of these things.
Ah, yes. Yet another "Freemason conspiracy" site. Same old unsubstantiated claims. Same old fear mongering. Same old unsupported assertation by verlch.
Typical.
Try again, sweetie bumps.
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Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
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furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 09/15/2004 : 07:26:49 [Permalink]
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quote:
Ricky said:
Anything which unjustly restricts or takes away others rights and freedoms.
Hows that Dude?
I can't agree with that definition. According to that definition most state governments are evil. I do not think that the government is evil.
Prostitution is illegal. There is no reason for this to be illegal. Adult prostitutes will go to jail for trying to earn a living the way they want to.
Polygamy is illegal. If the participant are OK with the setup why should the government interfere.
I think the government is wrong to restrict the rights of these people but I don't think it is 'evil'. |
If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
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