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Tim
SFN Regular
USA
775 Posts |
 Posted - 01/27/2002 : 02:50:32 [Permalink]
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Here is a link to the UU Church;
http://www.uua.org/main.html
This church is extremely inclusive, little or no dogma, and puts more emphasis on the 'search', rather than adherring to a preconceived outcome of that search.
I like this church, though I do not agree with most of its' members beliefs. It is more like an open forum on the road to finding one's own spirituality.
I personally find a lot of their ideas couched in so much New Age mysticism, but, honestly, most members are not adherents to New Age ideas, and no one has ever found fault with my skepticism, and humanistic approach. I am as accepted as anyone else. However, I do not think that you will find many conservative Christians within the UUA for any more than a visit.
I go to the church in New Orleans sometimes, but probably would not go if not for the prodding of my wife to go with her.
"The Constitution ..., is a marvelous document for self-government by Christian people. But the minute you turn the document into the hands of non-Christian and atheistic people they can use it to destroy the very foundation of our society." P. Robertson |
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Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 01/27/2002 : 13:31:07 [Permalink]
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In addition, I am a Criminal Justice major at Marshall University,
Then a working knowledge of Skepticism and its inherent use of logic should stand you in very good stead in your chosen career.
…there are two possibilities below, but feel free to add more.
1) That, at one point, there was a common religion. But, as humanity grew scattered, these became separate
You are reciting church dogma (superstition) while you are actually talking about history (science). History is to a great degree "provable". The history of religion during the last four thousand plus years has been quite well documented. There is nothing to suggest that there was ever a common religion.
2) This possibility is especially true of Christianity, and is a trend that developed much more recently. To gain followers from other regions, certain traditions were assimilated into the mainstream religion, thus adding to them an element of familiarity to the people in question. Examples include Easter and Christmas, both of which were pagan holidays.
Actually if you study mythology you will find that EVERY part of Christianity comes from other religions and not just "certain traditions". It is completely copied from earlier mythologies with no original concepts. In other words--it's a fraud.
When I said, "I don't know," I meant in particular about the Greater being (or beings, they can be plural).
Then if you don't know that means you are an Agnostic. So why are you making these speculations about the deities actions and now multiplicity? If you don't know then you cannot, in all honesty, make any of these claims.
As a soon-to-be former Latter-Day Saint, we had the concept of apotheosis: As we are now, so God was one day. As God is, so shall we be one day.
The deeper you get into it the sillier it becomes.
You can't say how god is today because you can't even prove that there is a god.
Since every person who has ever lived has died, since every person who is now living will die, it means that no one has ever turned into a god. If someone had then you would be able to prove god's existence.
"Sure, I can prove that there is a god. Dr Slater, I'd like you to meet Harry Cohen. Harry, this is Dr Slater. Harry became a god last week, isn't that nice?"
When I put it in every day terms like that it sounds ridiculous doesn't it? It is ridiculous.
But what keeps that from meaning that God isn't the only one in the Universe? Or that there is even one, for that matter? That is what I want to find out.
Then until you do find out that a god exists you'll have to stop claiming that one does. Because, by your own admission, you don't know.
That is the basis of Skepticism, Science and basic human honesty. You don't make any claims that you can't prove.
Let me play the Guru and give you a mantra to recite to yourself that will bring you to "enlightenment"
"PROVE IT"
Say those two words over and over while you consider religion and you will come to an answer you'll be able to live with.
The more I read into it, the more I have to wonder.
And the more you should wonder. You've been fed a cock & bull story since you were born. Because not only is there no way for you to know if god exists but there is no way for the people who have been telling you that god exists to know. Think about it. The people who you have trusted in this subject, how can they know any more than you do?
If God was watching over us, why didn't he prevent the attacks …
Occam's razor directs us to always go with the simplest answer. The question posed here is really why is the behavior of god indistinguishable from that which you would expect to find if there weren't any god?
The simplest answer to why it seems that there is no god is because there is no god.
These are the paradoxes that leave me disillusioned with organized religion.
Don't fall into the trap of thinking that it's the "organization" that is the problem. The problem is the religion.
I would, however, like more information on the Unitarian-Universalist church. Sounds like it may be worth checking into.
More stuff and nonsense. If you join a bowling league or a softball team you'll get everything the UU offers PLUS you'll get some good healthy exercise and a lot of ice cold beer and pizza.
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The brain that was stolen from my laboratory was a criminal brain. Only evil will come from it. |
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Kaneda Kuonji
Skeptic Friend
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 01/28/2002 : 19:56:34 [Permalink]
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The UUA is all nice and well, but personally I find little use in a congregation. I find that congregations have many "me toos" among them.
Perhaps I adhere more to a philosophy than I do any deity. I'll keep searching for enlightenment, but within myself rather than a book.
Rodney Dean, CI Order of the Knights of Jubal
Ivbalis.org
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Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2002 : 14:37:09 [Permalink]
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quote:
I'll keep searching for enlightenment, but within myself rather than a book.
Rodney Dean, CI Order of the Knights of Jubal
Ivbalis.org
Ya know, Sir Rodney, books are not half bad. For instance, reading up on a few Philosophers could save you the trouble of reinventing the wheel "enlightenment-wise"
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The brain that was stolen from my laboratory was a criminal brain. Only evil will come from it. |
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Kaneda Kuonji
Skeptic Friend
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2002 : 16:20:50 [Permalink]
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Well, I meant that books will not be solely what I go by...in fact, various religions have good ideas, it's just that worship will not be among them.
As for addressing me by "Sir," flattering, but hardly accurate.
CI means "Companion." Just visit Ivbalis.org for more details.
Rodney Dean, CI Order of the Knights of Jubal
Ivbalis.org
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Slater
SFN Regular
USA
1668 Posts |
Posted - 01/29/2002 : 18:53:06 [Permalink]
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quote:
As for addressing me by "Sir," flattering, but hardly accurate.
Your signature says that you're a Knight. Gadzooks!
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The brain that was stolen from my laboratory was a criminal brain. Only evil will come from it. |
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Kaneda Kuonji
Skeptic Friend
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 02/01/2002 : 10:59:27 [Permalink]
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Here's a link to the page:
www.ivbalis.org
Take a look around. To become CI's, the following oath is taken:
I, full name, do solemnly swear and commit to:
Uphold the right, even at the cost of my life;
Meter even handed justice, tempered with mercy;
Assist and defend others;
and to strive to act with honour at all times.
This is something a lot of people do. You'll also find info on the hierarchy and the current members.
Rodney Dean, CI Order of the Knights of Jubal
Ivbalis.org
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ktesibios
SFN Regular
USA
505 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2002 : 21:37:40 [Permalink]
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FYI, Jubal is a character in the Web comic "Clan of the cats", which can be found at http://www.clanofthecats.com .
If you check out the Knights of Jubal page, you might also want to take a quick gander at the strip.
There are quite a few comics publishing on the Web. Anyone who likes the funny pages or comic books might like to spend a little time browsing around at http://www.keenspot.com , where several dozen Webcomics can be found.
Boris Karloff died for your sins. |
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Kaneda Kuonji
Skeptic Friend
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2002 : 23:01:49 [Permalink]
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Keenspot is why I do not read the sunday funnies anymore. Webcomics are usually better anyway. Also:
www.keenspace.com
Rodney Dean, CI Order of the Knights of Jubal
Ivbalis.org
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VVolfe347
New Member
Canada
22 Posts |
Posted - 02/23/2002 : 21:49:08 [Permalink]
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Although I said 1, and 2..... I think fundies are as paranoid as I am, after all that is where I get my paranoid view from, so within what is permissable of their dim views, I would have to say all of the above.
What I mean to say is this, the freedoms of the homosexual are not considered by the fundy, there can be no dought of that. But freedom from goverment, yes the do, liberty to follow thier gawd, yes they do.
I think the pagans/wiccan culture holds it close to the heart more then the rest of the time, but then again, I hang out with a bunch of activist, most of whom are pagan, so my view there my be tainted ;-)
D.F.
quote:
In your experience, who is it that holds individual freedoms and liberties in higher esteem:
Dan Foscarini
"The Blind don't lead the blind, People walk around with thier eyes closed" |
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 02/24/2002 : 20:45:11 [Permalink]
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Garrette:
quote:
quote:
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Only INDIVIDUALS care about individual freedoms. Everybody else looks for ways to silence everybody else who disagrees with him/her/it. (I used *it* for the brainless ones who want to silence INDIVIDUALS.
Therefore, I selected Atheists, Agnostics, Free Thinkers, and Humanitarians (just so long as they are individuals and not just members of cults created by anti-individuals.
ljbrs
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Damn, ljbrs, this is so simple and obvious it's almost brilliant. BTW, I'm saying this seriously, not facetiously. I think there's much to be said for this...
Garrette, I missed your earlier comment. Anyway, a belated thank you. I have always been an individual. Of course, at times, it is difficult. However, a person who is an individual has always ONE FRIEND -- himself/herself -- and can count on that throughout life. Then again, when individuals run around with other individuals (as I often do), there are many more friends.
I have enjoyed reading all of your posts which I have come across, although sometimes I read and run because of a lack of time (need for sleep, etc.) I usually spend more time here reading the posts of others.
Anyway, all of your posts here (SFN) have been very interesting. Better to say it late than never...
ljbrs 
"Nothing is more damaging to a new truth than an old error." Goethe |
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ljbrs
SFN Regular
USA
842 Posts |
Posted - 02/27/2002 : 20:50:42 [Permalink]
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I, myself, am not at all religious (and never have been religious). My family TRIED, but without success.
However, to protect myself (because religious fanatics can really be dangerous), I usually tell people that I believe that whatever exists, exists. That usually takes care of animosities and I can go on my merry way without any serious problems (except, perhaps, with those who want me to join their cult-like religions). When people approach me with religious literature, I immediately ask them if they would LIKE TO HEAR ABOUT MY RELIGION. They always run away as fast as they can go. It always makes my day to watch them scurry off in terror, poor things...
ljbrs  
"Nothing is more damaging to a new truth than an old error." Goethe |
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Wolfgang_faust
Skeptic Friend
USA
59 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2002 : 09:13:17 [Permalink]
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[font=Century Gothic][/font=Century Gothic]
I would have to go with 1. I was involved in a fudamental Baptist church. Religion places classes on people, therefore making it innately intolerent
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 03/12/2002 : 11:33:09 [Permalink]
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quote:
Religion places classes on people
I would have to agree with this in regards to the monotheistic religions. But of all the religions in the world, I don't think this is as true for the vast majority of polytheistic religions.
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There is no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our world. It underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another, to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've known. Sagan |
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Hook
Skeptic Friend
USA
79 Posts |
Posted - 03/17/2002 : 00:12:31 [Permalink]
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quote:
quote:
Religion places classes on people
I would have to agree with this in regards to the monotheistic religions. But of all the religions in the world, I don't think this is as true for the vast majority of polytheistic religions.
I think you are being a little to kind to polytheistic religions, Hinduism being an obvious example. Perhaps the distinction you are looking for is patriarchal religions vs matriarchal religions, but I'm not enough of a historian to know if that holds up either.
Frankly, it seems like greater than two people in a room with a finite desired resource imposes class on people. It's just so much easier when the gods give you permission.
(P-)>
"I don't care whether my neighbor believes in zero gods or 20 gods, I care whether my neighbor believes in democracy."
--Bill Moyers |
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