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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
 Posted - 04/21/2009 : 12:38:01 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by Bill scott
I have seen this forum trash many of people on their deathbed who's work for humanity far out reaches yours, mine or Hawkings... |
Name one. |
Still waiting on an answer.
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You ain't got nuttin else better to do? |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 12:50:03 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
You ain't got nuttin else better to do? |
My nagging took all of ten seconds.
But, since you don't seem interested in answering, I'll conclude that your original statement was just more of your hot air, thanks. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 12:50:24 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
Dear God I pray that even in his midnight hour that you might remove the blinders from Mr. Hawkings eyes that he might know your love and grace before his journey into eternity begins. It is in Jesus name that I ask things Father God, Amen.
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You're adressing this to the wrong person/s. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 12:52:04 [Permalink]
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Ok, lets slow down here. He is an accomplished scientist, but he never rose from the dead.
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And neither has anyone else.
Ham and Falwell are merely comparisons who, in spite of their followings, pale beside Hawking. I am not all that up to speed with the day to day activities of either so I won't comment on them, but how many soup kitchens are run by "religious" people? How many homeless shelters? To think your boy Hawkings has a monopoly on "goods works" is silly and a moot point when discussing the limits of his recovery.
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And I, a hard atheist, am always good for a few bucks when our local Baptist church does a charity drive -- what's your point?
I do not like disparaging remarks made toward the disabled, especially those who give everything in life their best shot; be it in science or anything else. The "slobbering in a wheelchair" bit was 'way over my version of The Line.
There are many of us on these boards who would trade a testicle to hear Hawking lecture and as long as he can wheel or get wheeled over to the podium, he will have made a full recovery. Not all strength is physical.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 12:56:06 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by Bill scott
You ain't got nuttin else better to do? |
My nagging took all of ten seconds.
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I guess your "still waiting" reply gave me a mental picture of you sitting there twiddiling your thumbs, "still waiting", on me.
| But, since you don't seem interested in answering, I'll conclude that your original statement was just more of your hot air, |
Suit yourself.
Your welcome. |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 13:23:16 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by filthy |
| Ok, lets slow down here. He is an accomplished scientist, but he never rose from the dead. |
And neither has anyone else. |
We will just have to agree to disagree here.
| Ham and Falwell are merely comparisons who, in spite of their followings, pale beside Hawking. |
Simply your opinion, which you are entitled to.
| And I, a hard atheist, am always good for a few bucks when our local Baptist church does a charity drive -- what's your point? |
That your notion of Hawking have some monopoly over religious people when it comes to good works is absurd. And that it has nothing to do with his full recovery or no recovery.
| I do not like disparaging remarks made toward the disabled, especially those who give everything in life their best shot; be it in science or anything else. |
I agree.
| The "slobbering in a wheelchair" bit was 'way over my version of The Line. |
Well that's just your opinion. The facts are that even with his full recovery he will be left slobbering in his wheelchair. This is not a negative or a positive, just a fact. And really the only reason I added it was to demonstrate how limited the "full recovery" would be and that it wasn't really all that "great". And the only road I was trying to go down from there is that we all suffer the same fate as Hawking, to one degree or another. We all are facing a limited recovery and eventual death. This notion that I like to make fun of scientists in wheelchairs is just a figment of your imagination, or maybe you just like to argue with me, I don't know?
| There are many of us on these boards who would trade a testicle to hear Hawking lecture and as long as he can wheel or get wheeled over to the podium, he will have made a full recovery. |
Dude, you are reading way more into this then I ever said. And hs is all over youtube so no reason to go to such extreams.
| Not all strength is physical. |
Could not agree with you anymore then I already do on this.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joni_Eareckson_Tada |
"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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| Edited by - Bill scott on 04/21/2009 13:34:40 |
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Machi4velli
SFN Regular
USA
854 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 13:33:43 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by filthy
I do not like disparaging remarks made toward the disabled, especially those who give everything in life their best shot; be it in science or anything else. The "slobbering in a wheelchair" bit was 'way over my version of The Line. |
Speaking of being in a wheelchair as a somehow lesser state of being, which I think he did, is in fact disparaging. I have been in a wheelchair myself for several years, and for me, it did seem to be a significant barrier to important things in life, but it just becomes part of your reality after a while. It ceases to be a big deal if and when you realize you are not missing anything vital -- you will miss things that are enjoyable, but there are other enjoyable things you can do instead. I find mental pleasures more satisfying and fulfilling, so it becomes more of an annoyance than a major limiting factor in life.
| There are many of us on these boards who would trade a testicle to hear Hawking lecture and as long as he can wheel or get wheeled over to the podium, he will have made a full recovery. Not all strength is physical. |
Certainly not, and I think most of us would agree the mental is vastly more important than the physical.
We would almost certainly call it a "full recovery." If someone has cancer and a peanut allergy, we would say they had a "full recovery" if the cancer was gone, even if they still had the allergy. With a more restrictive definition, a person would have to be in perfect health, so it would not really apply to any situation. |
"Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
-Giordano Bruno
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, but the illusion of knowledge."
-Stephen Hawking
"Seeking what is true is not seeking what is desirable"
-Albert Camus |
| Edited by - Machi4velli on 04/21/2009 13:34:33 |
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Simon
SFN Regular
USA
1992 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 14:45:05 [Permalink]
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First of all Bill, let me remind you that recovery means nothing more than 'return to the original state'.
Starting disabled, "slobbering in a wheelchair' are you so delicately put it, a full recovery will, indeed, bring him back to the wheelchair.
Also, let me state that if I'd were to choose between getting Hawkins' body and mind or yours, I would go for the wheelchair in a heartbeat...
It annoys me to no end. Hawkins might be the greatest mind alive. His contribution to our understanding of the universe is probably unequalled in this generation. And yet, small minded bigots don't hesitate to convince themselves that they are ho so much better and more enlighten than he is and brag and patronize about it.
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Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there – on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996 |
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Bill scott
SFN Addict
USA
2103 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 16:38:08 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by Simon |
First of all Bill, let me remind you that recovery means nothing more than 'return to the original state'.
Starting disabled, "slobbering in a wheelchair' are you so delicately put it, a full recovery will, indeed, bring him back to the wheelchair. |
My point is/was/continues to be that whether Hawkings makes a full recovery to pre or post wheelchair is irrelevant, he is still going to die. And this fate is shared by us all. My prayer was that Hawkings would come to grips with his need for a Redeemer before it is too late and his journey into eternity begins. I desire this for Hawkings sake and no other reason. Based on my own merits I shudder at the thought of standing before God with nothing but my own righteousness. What a naked feeling that would be. Those are my motives for Kil and all to see, that no more guess work may be required.
| Also, let me state that if I'd were to choose between getting Hawkins' body and mind or yours, I would go for the wheelchair in a heartbeat... |
Shocking.
Sorry to hear that.
| Hawkins might be the greatest mind alive. |
That's opinion.
| His contribution to our understanding of the universe is probably unequalled in this generation. |
What makes you say that?
| And yet, small minded bigots don't hesitate to convince themselves that they are ho so much better and more enlighten than he is and brag and patronize about it. |
I never said any such thing. I was simply concerned about his eternal destiny.
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"Lets get one thing clear, Bill. Science does make some assumptions." -perrodetokio-
"In the end as skeptics we must realize that there is no real knowledge, there is only what is most reasonable to believe." -Coelacanth-
The fact that humans do science is what causes errors in science. -Dave W.-
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Machi4velli
SFN Regular
USA
854 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 18:08:58 [Permalink]
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| Originally posted by Bill scottMy point is/was/continues to be that whether Hawkings makes a full recovery to pre or post wheelchair is irrelevant, he is still going to die. And this fate is shared by us all. |
Yep, we should really stop wasting our efforts on this medicine nonsense anyway! |
"Truth does not change because it is, or is not, believed by a majority of the people."
-Giordano Bruno
"The greatest enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, but the illusion of knowledge."
-Stephen Hawking
"Seeking what is true is not seeking what is desirable"
-Albert Camus |
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Simon
SFN Regular
USA
1992 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 19:06:36 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
My point is/was/continues to be that whether Hawkings makes a full recovery to pre or post wheelchair is irrelevant, he is still going to die. And this fate is shared by us all. My prayer was that Hawkings would come to grips with his need for a Redeemer before it is too late and his journey into eternity begins. I desire this for Hawkings sake and no other reason. Based on my own merits I shudder at the thought of standing before God with nothing but my own righteousness. What a naked feeling that would be. Those are my motives for Kil and all to see, that no more guess work may be required.
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Yes, because that's a healthy and normal reaction to hearing about anybody getting better.
And what exactly did the delicate mention of 'slobbering in a wheelchair' had to do with this point? |
Look again at that dot. That's here. That's home. That's us. On it everyone you love, everyone you know, everyone you ever heard of, every human being who ever was, lived out their lives. The aggregate of our joy and suffering, thousands of confident religions, ideologies, and economic doctrines, every hunter and forager, every hero and coward, every creator and destroyer of civilization, every king and peasant, every young couple in love, every mother and father, hopeful child, inventor and explorer, every teacher of morals, every corrupt politician, every "superstar," every "supreme leader," every saint and sinner in the history of our species lived there – on a mote of dust suspended in a sunbeam.
Carl Sagan - 1996 |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 19:47:05 [Permalink]
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I rather think that if more people were less concerned with other folk's "eternal destiny," which is open to doubt & question from all directions, and more concerned with their well-being "here & now," the world would be a better place. Or at least a less aggravating one...
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 20:02:05 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Bill scott
My point is/was/continues to be that whether Hawkings makes a full recovery to pre or post wheelchair is irrelevant, he is still going to die. And this fate is shared by us all. |
So why waste time with irrelevancies like invisible dieties?| My prayer was that Hawkings would come to grips with his need for a Redeemer before it is too late and his journey into eternity begins. I desire this for Hawkings sake and no other reason. |
Why? Neither Hawkings nor you nor anyone else gets to do anything of any value after death, regardless of one's destination.| Based on my own merits I shudder at the thought of standing before God with nothing but my own righteousness. What a naked feeling that would be. |
I would guess that's because you have so little self-worth that you think yourself beneath the consideration of a self-described whining, codependent bully. Too bad for you.| Those are my motives for Kil and all to see, that no more guess work may be required. |
But your whole rationale for wanting this for Hawkings is guesswork. Otherwise, you would have laid out the argument correctly by now and we'd all be Christians.
Wow, is that ever annoying. Everything you write is opinion, Bill, so it's the height of hypocrisy to use that to criticize others.
Since I figure you try to live by the Golden Rule, here is my Bill scott-flavored reply to your last post:| My point is/was/continues to be that whether Hawkings makes a full recovery to pre or post wheelchair is irrelevant... |
That's opinion.| ...he is still going to die. |
That's opinion.| And this fate is shared by us all. |
That's opinion.| My prayer was that Hawkings would come to grips with his need for a Redeemer before it is too late and his journey into eternity begins. |
That's opinion.| I desire this for Hawkings sake and no other reason. |
That's opinion.| Based on my own merits I shudder at the thought of standing before God with nothing but my own righteousness. |
That's opinion.| What a naked feeling that would be. |
That's opinion.| Those are my motives for Kil and all to see, that no more guess work may be required. |
That's opinion.That's opinion.That's opinion.
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 20:12:48 [Permalink]
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| Isn't it the case that whenever there's a discussion of a famous person's death or serious illness, Bill scott chimes in that we at SFN take glee when said person is a fundamentalist/Christian, but are sad when said person is a scientists/atheist? And hasn't this generally been shown to be wrong each time? |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 04/21/2009 : 21:02:52 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Cuneiformist
Isn't it the case that whenever there's a discussion of a famous person's death or serious illness, Bill scott chimes in that we at SFN take glee when said person is a fundamentalist/Christian, but are sad when said person is a scientists/atheist? And hasn't this generally been shown to be wrong each time? |
Not so sure about that, but this time Bill specified deathbed. HalfMooner, for example, waited until Falwell was long dead before posting this joke.
Ah, but I do remember Bill claiming that someone here was "gleeful" that some theist or other was dead. It all depended upon Bill's bizarro-land definition of the word "glee," which to the rest of us was more of a "not unhappy statement of fact." |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Stephen Hawking ill, hospitalized
