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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2011 : 19:37:52 [Permalink]
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Kil.....
| Smiley rolling eyes. I hate the damn things. Refuse to post them |
Kil, All's fair in love and war. And I am in love! |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2011 : 20:20:24 [Permalink]
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| Thing is Bill, the only thing that gives my opinion more weight, and not any more weight than any other administrator here, is that I have administrative powers. And I'm not the only one. The only value my opinion has is whatever value my opinion has. Just like everyone else... |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
 Posted - 02/28/2011 : 21:15:01 [Permalink]
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Dude :
le Penseur's failure to even try any of those things [to resist] is also bewildering.
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Read my account more carefully, I stated quite clearly my attempt to resist. Please stop distorting my account. |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2011 : 22:30:55 [Permalink]
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Dave, if you're going to lie about me, I'm done with you. This is your last warning.
1. you have only described a severely abnormal response to fear and danger.
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The dude is telling a LIE. My responses to fear and danger were completely normal, I was frightened out of my mind and screaming at the top of my lungs in panic, trying to resist by locking them out of my house.
How is that 'severely abnormal'?
2. | you were only abducted when you were a 10 year old boy? |
Another LIE from Dude. I also stated clearly I was abducted 5 years before in 1968, which would make me five years old, and even before that, at around age 4.
3. | If so, it sounds more like a catholic priest than an alien who abducted you. |
This isn't a LIE, I guess, but it's simply a stupid thing to say, and it's again completely removed from my account. If it's another of his failed attempts at humor, don't quit your day job.
4. | You claim repeated abductions, and your reaction to them is so off the wall that you can't honestly expect a reasonable person to not question it. |
Dude tells another blatant LIE. My reaction and my actions are completely consistent with the findings of years of extensive study done on alien abductees at Harvard University. My actions and reactions are consistent with not only the studies done by Professor John Mack, but also Budd Hopkins, who stated on CNN that the experiences of me and my family is "an important abduction case".
Dude, what post-graduate degrees in psychiatry do you hold?
5. | Why do you think its a "rush" when you think about your mother being terrified |
This is the lowest LIE dude has sunk to. People only say things this ugly on the internet, they wouldn't dare say it to your face. I never said any such thing. I said when speaking with my brothers about the aliens, it causes a surge of adrenaline sometimes. Adrenaline, actually Epinephrine, is created when a person senses extreme danger, or as a result of intense feelings of anger or fear. The body is preparing for fight or flight. Humans utilize adrenaline as a survival technique. Tell me how an adrenaline response when discussing these events is inappropriate? You just finished saying how my response wasn't strong enough. Which is it?
I never used the word "rush", and I never said it's a rush when I think about my mother being terrified. Dude just plain LIES.
6.| Shouldn't the normal reaction be anger and fear? |
Once again, Adrenaline is triggered by ANGER and FEAR.
7. | You've done nothing but hand-waving and ignoring legitimate criticism of your story. |
Another lie, Dude. I haven't waved my hands once, and I have clearly done an extensive , exhaustive job of responding to almost all criticism, both legitimate and yours. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2011 : 23:11:46 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by le Penseur
Dave, if you're going to lie about me, I'm done with you. This is your last warning. |
I'm guessing you meant Dude, there.
You do realize that he has nothing to lose by you not responding to him, right? |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2011 : 23:38:17 [Permalink]
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| Dave, Yes, sorry, I did mean Dude. My apologies. |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 02/28/2011 : 23:43:54 [Permalink]
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Kil.....
| Thing is Bill, the only thing that gives my opinion more weight, and not any more weight than any other administrator here, is that I have administrative powers. And I'm not the only one. The only value my opinion has is whatever value my opinion has. Just like everyone else... |
Yeah, I know, but see, you're my favorite administrator. Somewhere, probably about the time that you really reached middle age, you genuinely developed most of the symptoms of an open mind. And in your case, your brains definitely did not fall out.
The proof of the pudding-head has yet to be displayed as to the rest of the administrators. Rational Wiki has some commentary on the Open Mind that I like. A few quotes:| Often evidence will lead to a conclusion that defies common sense, which an otherwise closed mind would have trouble with. |
| Quantum mechanics is often the most illustrative example of this process, as practically every aspect of quantum physics appears to defy concepts of common sense; duality, slit diffraction and quantum entanglement are all completely at odds with the way that we have evolved to view the world. Without the open-mindedness to reject our common sense view of the world, some of the most complex and counter-intuitive science would be off limits to human endeavour. A closed minded researcher, unwilling to consider alternatives to their own pet theory or hypothesis will not advance very far or contribute much to science. |
And now the other side of the quote-mine coin| There would be a lot of money and fame in a scientist showing, with the sufficient evidence to back it up and convince the rest, a lot of things such as the existence of ghosts, the (non-placebo) workings of homeopathy or even a young earth. Often proponents of woo will cry that science hasn't taken them seriously or refuse to do the research, screaming at scientists and skeptics to "have an open mind". This is blatantly false; science has very often tried out these ideas or trialled that piece of alternative medicine, it's just that the results have come back negative. |
More comment that is very necessary to define the Open Mind.| All that open mindedness requires is that one considers an idea or proposal and does not reject it outright before any considerations or evaluations are made. Having an open mind does not mean accepting any new idea as true as soon as they are presented. A lack of an "open mind", based on the misunderstanding between consideration and acceptance of new ideas, is therefore an often used criticism of skeptics. |
There is much more here These descriptions, I feel, are a fair representation of your mind-set and also aptly describe much of my approach to unlikely appearing phenomena. I really don't feel that any of the other administrators on SFN have yet achieved this degree of maturity. I sincerely hope that several of them do, someday, as SFN will be the better for it.
My opinion is that your views on most subjects do reflect an open mind as above described, therefore they certainly bear more weight with me. Of the other administrators om the forums, I feel that your carefully and tentatively worded opinions far outweigh those from others that generally are couched in strongly declarative language and frequently are largely dismissive in nature.
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 00:53:45 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by bngbuck
My opinion is that your views on most subjects do reflect an open mind as above described, therefore they certainly bear more weight with me. Of the other administrators om the forums, I feel that your carefully and tentatively worded opinions far outweigh those from others that generally are couched in strongly declarative language and frequently are largely dismissive in nature. |
In my opinion, which is only provisionally held and subject to change in the event of the arrival of new evidence or argument through rational inquiry, you are choosing to believe your own assessment of people based on nothing more than their writing style instead of what they have actually explained to you about their own attitudes towards knowledge. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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moakley
SFN Regular
USA
1888 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 06:16:52 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by bngbuck
Moakley.....
An alien corpse would be a very good start. Far superior to a personal testimony of alien abduction.
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Le Penseur is not claiming that he possesses supernatural powers. Logistically, how would you suggest that he acquire and transport an alien corpse to a place where you or anyone else could examine it?
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Which was in response to.
Originally posted by le Penseur
Maybe you find your time has been better spent petulantly demanding someone drop the corpse of an alien at your feet. As I said, I cannot change your mind, only you can do that. You are free to set whatever evidential threshold you choose, of course. Just let me know what that standard is, so we can stop pretending anything I could say would be good enough for you.
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I did not expect La Penseur to drop one at my feet, but when he offered, sarcastically or not, I agreed that would be good eveidence of his experience.
Originally posted by bngbuck
He is claiming that he and his family have had personal experience and interaction with aliens. It is indeed an extraordinary claim, but no one yet here has suggested the exact, defined "evidence" that it would be possible for him to offer by, as he says, "typing on an Internet forum."
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Why is it our responsibility to make suggestions to Le Penseur on how to tell a compelling story. Are we now the editors of his memories? Hell, I assume that he has been telling this story for nearly 40 years. Long enough for this story to have become hard wired into his memory. If he is showing up here after all this time and we still find inconsistencies then maybe he should have ventured into these types of forums long ago, for the sake of the story, editing of his memories.
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Life is good
Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 09:54:37 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by bngbuck
My opinion is that your views on most subjects do reflect an open mind as above described, therefore they certainly bear more weight with me. Of the other administrators om the forums, I feel that your carefully and tentatively worded opinions far outweigh those from others that generally are couched in strongly declarative language and frequently are largely dismissive in nature. |
In my opinion, which is only provisionally held and subject to change in the event of the arrival of new evidence or argument through rational inquiry, you are choosing to believe your own assessment of people based on nothing more than their writing style instead of what they have actually explained to you about their own attitudes towards knowledge.
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All sarcasm aside, what Dave has said here is correct. Yes, we do have different styles and we have even debated the effectiveness those differences openly on these forums. But we don't disagree on the tentative nature of all conclusions reached using the tools that skepticism provides us.
Now. Can we move on? |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 10:47:43 [Permalink]
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Moakley: | Why is it our responsibility to make suggestions to Le Penseur on how to tell a compelling story. Are we now the editors of his memories? |
It is not your responsibility, your help is neither requested nor required. Any intelligent questions you might have regarding my experiences are welcome.
If he is showing up here after all this time and we still find inconsistencies then maybe he should have ventured into these types of forums long ago, for the sake of the story, editing of his memories.
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I agree with that. If it were the case. However, it is not the case, there are no inconsistencies to be found in my account. Here's why:
You see, what I'm doing here is the easiest thing in the world to do: I'm simply telling the truth. I don't have to worry about it. I stick to what exactly happened, and tell it to you as clearly as I can. There is nothing easier than telling the truth. |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 11:23:38 [Permalink]
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le Penseur said:
It is not your responsibility, your help is neither requested nor required. Any intelligent questions you might have regarding my experiences are welcome.
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The problem, as you have been told repeatedly, is that it is impossible to ask intelligent questions about your (a story you insist is true) unless you provide a way for us to distinguish between your story and fiction.
You clearly don't understand this.
You become arrogant and belligerent when the problems with your story are pointed out to you. You refuse, repeatedly, to engage in an honest attempt to validate your story. I point out a small number of problems with your fairy tale and you break into an angry rant calling me a liar.
Then:
I agree with that. If it were the case. However, it is not the case, there are no inconsistencies to be found in my account. Here's why:
You see, what I'm doing here is the easiest thing in the world to do: I'm simply telling the truth. I don't have to worry about it. I stick to what exactly happened, and tell it to you as clearly as I can. There is nothing easier than telling the truth. |
So now we can add delusional to arrogant and belligerant. Not delusional because you insist your fairy tale is true, but because you insist that there are no problems with it (which is fucking hilarious because you have previously pointed out an inconsistency in it yourself).
But let me see if I can redirect this conversation a little bit. Two questions that require only one word answers. How many times have you been abducted and how old were you the last time you were abducted?
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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moakley
SFN Regular
USA
1888 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 11:31:52 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by le Penseur
Moakley: | Why is it our responsibility to make suggestions to Le Penseur on how to tell a compelling story. Are we now the editors of his memories? |
It is not your responsibility, your help is neither requested nor required. Any intelligent questions you might have regarding my experiences are welcome.
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I had dropped out as of page two, but bngbuck commented on something I said from page two. That is who I had intended for my comment.
As far as intelligent questions are concerned, I don't see where they are necessary. As was pointed out after your first story and was my impression, these seem like reoccurring vivid dreams.
From story 1:
But in the summer of 1968,I was in my room, watching a little black-and-white television. Most of the room was dark ...
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At night alone in your room ...
From story 2:
February is like 5 in the afternoon, and I tried to get my brother to talk about what had just happened, but he fell asleep in front of me on the couch. I followed him , falling into a deep deep sleep.
Next thing I remember, my father is home, bellowing, "Jesus Christ, why are all the lights off? Where is your mother? Why is she sleeping?"
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Originally posted by le Penseur
If he is showing up here after all this time and we still find inconsistencies then maybe he should have ventured into these types of forums long ago, for the sake of the story, editing of his memories.
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I agree with that. If it were the case. However, it is not the case, there are no inconsistencies to be found in my account. Here's why:
You see, what I'm doing here is the easiest thing in the world to do: I'm simply telling the truth. I don't have to worry about it. I stick to what exactly happened, and tell it to you as clearly as I can. There is nothing easier than telling the truth.
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I understand your commitment, it has been 40 years in the telling. |
Life is good
Philosophy is questions that may never be answered. Religion is answers that may never be questioned. -Anonymous |
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Hawks
SFN Regular
Canada
1383 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 11:36:39 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by le Penseur
Any intelligent questions you might have regarding my experiences are welcome. |
Do they have Elvis?
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METHINKS IT IS LIKE A WEASEL
It's a small, off-duty czechoslovakian traffic warden! |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/01/2011 : 12:19:15 [Permalink]
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The DUDE lies again...I gave him his last chance to stop lying.
The problem, as you have been told repeatedly, is that it is impossible to ask intelligent questions about your (a story you insist is true) unless you provide a way for us to distinguish between your story and fiction.
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That, folks, is a LIE. It is very easy to ask intelligent questions about my account.
| You clearly don't understand this. |
Sorry dude, but you have to stop lying. There is nothing stopping you from asking intelligent questions, several others in here have had no problem asking intelligent questions.
| So now we can add delusional to arrogant and belligerant. Not delusional because you insist your fairy tale is true, but because you insist that there are no problems with it (which is fucking hilarious because you have previously pointed out an inconsistency in it yourself). |
First, it's spelled "belligerent", insults are always more effective when spelled correctly, otherwise you end up sounding uneducated.
I guess you weren't much of a student in school, and I'm certain you don't hold any degrees, post-grad or under-grad, simply because you display very poor reading comprehension skills. Let's make this clear yet again: There are no problems with my account, sorry. It's the truth, and I reported it quite accurately, and my account has never wavered once with any inconsistencies.
I was also quite up front in stating that some people may find the actions or behavior of the aliens themselves to be inconsistent. My account has always been consistent, but the actions of the aliens may not always make sense to us from our human point of view.
Can you understand that distinction? Apparently not. "Fucking hilarious" indeed. |
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ETs are here, despite guesses to the contrary
