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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 17:37:48 [Permalink]
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Filthy.....
| no legitimate photograph has ever been taken of a so-called "spaceship." |
That is a very strong statement, Filthy. How can you, or anyone, possibly know that a "spaceship" has never been legitimately photographed? Possibly never published, but think about it. I have looked at hundreds and hundreds of them, but I am not sophisticated enough in CGI to pick out but a few of the fakes. Mooner with his remarkable Photoshop skills, probably could spot most of the phonies, but how could he have access to, and time to analyze all of the many thousands of "Spaceship" images extant. I do not think that any human being, even with all the resources of FBI and CIA combined, could successfully perform that task!
And I am certain that I have not seen but a very small number of all the photos that have ever been taken, faked, published, or whatever. Hell, the UAP/ET phenomenon has been around longer than photography has. I have absolutely no guess how many photos of "spaceships" have been taken, whether legitimate or not. How could any human being alive know with certainty that "no legitimate photograph has ever been taken of a spaceship? I cannot believe that kind of absolute knowledge actually exists! |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
 Posted - 03/08/2011 : 17:43:54 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by le Penseur
If you don't want my opinion on UFO footage, stop asking me for it, that's pretty easily done. |
If you don't want your opinions to be criticized, stop volunteering them.| You have a problem with my methodology? Lol, then let me know when it fails me once. |
As far as I'm concerned, your methods cannot generate true positives or negatives, since your method is logically flawed. So all we can see from it are false positives and negatives. The negative result with the Haiti video involved nine No True Scotsmen fallacies all stacked up together, and so cannot be considered reliable even though we know from objective evidence that the video is fake. In other words, your method generated the correct result, but for logically indefensible reasons.
And this game you've set up where we present you with videos to judge is no way to test your method, since there's no way we can predict the results of a logically flawed method which relies heavily upon your specific knowledge and for which we are not yet privy to all the details (a new criteria was added for the Moscow video, for example). We can't comb through videos and come up with candidates that you might judge to be real, not without reading your mind (and none of us are aliens). So if you want to show us how your method works to generate a positive result (which might be a decent test), you're going to have to pick the video yourself.
That is, of course, if you're not going to get back to telling us about your personal abductions. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Hal
Skeptic Friend
USA
302 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 17:48:06 [Permalink]
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I'm not sure that lurking this thread will go down as one of my greatest accomplishments this week. 
Dipping back a bit, to the scrap over whether or not aliens were cooler than cowboys in the 50s - I just came across a documentary called "Shades of Gray" on Netflix Instant. Some of you may be familiar with the film, or the subject, but as I don't normally have much interest in these things, it was a nice find for me. It's a profile of Gray Barker, who is credited with having created much of the popular mythology around UFOs, and other legends. It's quite interesting, and somewhat germane to this thread. |
Nothing in all the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity.
Martin Luther King Jr.
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 17:55:33 [Permalink]
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I'm open to being convinced but it would take a lot to do it. Extraordinary claims/evidence, and all that slum. Thus far in this thread, the necessary criteria has not been met.
But let me ask; if you happened to be out in a field photographing whatever and a space craft appeared, and you, lucky fellow, got a good, clear shot of it, what would you do with do with that photo?
Edited to add that unless I can be convinced, I will continue to make difinitive statements. They are more likely to be read, and if I'm caught out, we'll all get a good laugh.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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| Edited by - filthy on 03/08/2011 18:03:47 |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 18:04:48 [Permalink]
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Hal.....
| I just came across a documentary called "Shades of Gray" on Netflix Instant. Some of you may be familiar with the film, or the subject, but as I don't normally have much interest in these things, it was a nice find for me. It's a profile of Gray Barker, who is credited with having created much of the popular mythology around UFOs, and other legends. It's quite interesting, and somewhat germane to this thread. |
Check out Page 25 of this thread, third post by Kil
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 19:14:38 [Permalink]
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Filthy.....
| I'm open to being convinced but it would take a lot to do it. Extraordinary claims/evidence, and all that slum. Thus far in this thread, the necessary criteria has not been met. |
Of course not. I, and everyone here knows that. But my point was that what you state is unreasonable! It stretches the limits of possibility to the extreme to think that any human being could have knowledge of all the photos ever taken of UAP. And even if by some miracle (don't believe in them)
you could amass copies of all such photographs, I doubt that you would have either the time or inclination to ascertain which were legitimate and which were not - because of the sheer volume of data to digest. Most important, no one could look at all of them because many (?) are probably generated every single day!| But let me ask; if you happened to be out in a field photographing whatever and a space craft appeared, and you, lucky fellow, got a good, clear shot of it, what would you do with do with that photo? |
I would do what has already, in part, been done many, many times. I would attempt to get my photo published any way possible and try to profit from the attendant publicity.
Probably a very difficult task, but not impossible, as they still pop up in places other than You Tube, where apparently there are no credibility barriers to get your photo - shopped or not, - on TV.
I would submit to MUFON etc. which Dave. god bless him, has detailed elsewhere in this thread. I certainly would submit them to Skeptical Enquirer, and, for whatever it would be worth, although at this point I have some doubts about SFN (some here would say the "well has been poisoned", but never I); I would post them here, and if Dave and I could share the cost; I would meet with him and show him the original card, disc, or, for crissakes the film on which they originated.(I used to live in the DC area, and I love it. I probably would go without sharing costs both to experience Dave in person and to return to DC for a visit, which I have not taken for almost seven years.)
Why Dave? Because if I could convince him that the photos were authentic, I would have a much better chance to convince the really professional folks that I would have to face before making serious money off of the photo. I mean people whose full time job is analyzing such kinds of things. I really kind of doubt that a single real photo of a Spaceship could ever be completely authenticated or differentiated from a faked one, given the level of image manipulation that is available today - for a price, of course. Could Lucas or others in Hollywood produce a digital still that could not be differentiated from a real image? Maybe, I don't really know.
But first of all I would seek out the most professional appraisal and documentation of their authenticity that I could find in order to build an evidence base. This would be expensive, but I am confident that I could pay the tab and that it would be an excellent investment! Just to be able to honestly advertise that my photo had been analyzed by the best in the business and could not be declared a fake! It would be a partially calculated gamble of which I have made many in my life!
I would forever be wary of black helicopters and visitors to my door dressed in conservative suits and fedoras. Or military uniforms!
| Edited to add that unless I can be convinced, I will continue to make difinitive statements. They are more likely to be read, and if I'm caught out, we'll all get a good laugh. |
I am completely OK with definitive statements, it's the declarative sentences that begin to really annoy me.
He that laughs at himself is on the path to wisdom! |
| Edited by - bngbuck on 03/08/2011 20:02:18 |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 19:25:49 [Permalink]
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Pot Calling Kettle, come in Kettle...
However, those readings show why it is impossible to argue with le Penseur. He is as set in his story as a fossil in it's matrix and will not budge from it. This is the "True Believer" syndrom we meet in the religiously rabid, albeit considerably milder.
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You, filthy, and your ilk, are displaying "true Believer" syndrome, or shall we call it "true Denier" syndrome? Either way, you are sounding like Fundamentalists. You have your conclusion, and will concoct the most elaborate, hilarious nonsense to cling to your deeply-held belief that alien sightings and abductions are false.
You've already established you're willing to call important, respected men like our Astronauts, "lunatics" "madmen" and worse, based solely on their statements regarding aliens that disagree with your beliefs.
You don't even see the logical failure of calling millions (and tens of millions) of witnesses to events "insane" or "wrong", when these people were at the event, and you were snug in your beds. THAT is "true Believer" syndrome/
Oh, and THIS is "True Believer" syndrome. | no legitimate photograph has ever been taken of a so-called "spaceship." |
And I could be a dick like you have been , and point out the obvious...There are tens of thousands of legitimate photos of "spaceships". Mercury, Gemini, Apollo. And the Space Shuttles; Enterprise, Atlantis, Challenger, Discovery, Endeavor...
But that would be a dick move, and not my style. I understand your intent and give you the benefit of the doubt. |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 19:28:27 [Permalink]
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Dave.....
| If you click the [permalink] link in the header above someone's comment, you can then cut-and-paste the URL in the navigation bar of your browser and make a direct link to a comment. |
Thanks, Dave, I did not know that. I am so computer-challenged that I still, after 2000-odd posts, struggle a bit with the Shitz, excuse me Snitz, software! That is a real nifty shortcut to get directly to a specific quote or post, rather than just the page of the thread! Change Shitz to Ritz! |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 19:44:39 [Permalink]
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I consider this legitimate.
Let me know what you think. |
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alienist
Skeptic Friend
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 20:12:34 [Permalink]
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Hmmm.. This thread is now 28 pages long. I talked to someone about this thread, and he pointed out that the group "has been abducted by an alien."
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The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well! - Joe Ancis |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 20:47:28 [Permalink]
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Alienist: | Hmmm.. This thread is now 28 pages long. I talked to someone about this thread, and he pointed out that the group "has been abducted by an alien." |
Lol Alienist. "Resistance is futile." To quote the Daleks. And the Borg. And the Republicans. |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 21:04:59 [Permalink]
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Kil said:
| Would it be asking too much to allow le Penseur to get back to his stories? |
He has been invited to do so a dozen times. Doesn't seem like he is interested in doing anything other than being an arrogant dumbass.
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 21:30:17 [Permalink]
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Alienist.....
| Hmmm.. This thread is now 28 pages long. I talked to someone about this thread, and he pointed out that the group "has been abducted by an alien." |
Great start Alienist! (Does anybody other than you, me, and Michelle/Kil understand the cleverness of your stage name (sorry!)
To whom did you talk? now you're sorry, aren't you? |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 03/08/2011 : 22:37:10 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by le Penseur
I consider this legitimate.Let me know what you think. |
So you're not going to describe your method for determining that it is an alien craft? That's the important part. Without it, we learn nothing. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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ETs are here, despite guesses to the contrary
