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Fripp
SFN Regular
USA
727 Posts |
 Posted - 03/19/2011 : 07:48:51 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dr. Mabuse
Just to make sure le Penseur understands and recognises
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Don't hold your breath.
This clown's had 38 pages and, as yet, hasn't provided one shred of evidence. Yet he calls us "idiots" because we don't believe him. At a skeptics' site no less.
And I thought a neutron star was dense... |
"What the hell is an Aluminum Falcon?"
"Oh, I'm sorry. I thought my Dark Lord of the Sith could protect a small thermal exhaust port that's only 2-meters wide! That thing wasn't even fully paid off yet! You have any idea what this is going to do to my credit?!?!"
"What? Oh, oh, 'just rebuild it'? Oh, real [bleep]ing original. And who's gonna give me a loan, jackhole? You? You got an ATM on that torso LiteBrite?" |
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2011 : 08:24:43 [Permalink]
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le Penseur:
There are dozens of alien races and sub-types visiting the Earth, according to a NATO Security Official, over 50 types of aliens. I cant say The Hills aliens are the same as mine. That's something to keep in mind. |
Whoa! This is starting to sound like MIB. Can you name the NATO security official and what his roll at NATO is or was? ('Security official" is too general a term to tell me much.) What makes you think that the aliens interested in your family travel inter-dimensionally? And if some aliens use intersteller travel, and they are not the same aliens, why would they be conducting the same experiments? You know. The Hills experience isn't all that different from what you have described. Table time and so on.
I understand that you are just guessing, but the similarities of experiences reported by abducties suggest only one general type of alien with one purpose, whatever that is. And with over 50 types of aliens up there, it would seem likely that they would not all be using the same playbook. Plus their physical descriptions would vary widely, it seems to me, haveing evolved on different planets no matter what dimension they hail from. But nothing of the sort has been reported. As I understand it, their are only two types and they work together... |
Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2011 : 11:26:12 [Permalink]
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| Kil, I am enjoying your posts, I will address your questions this weekend, probably later tonight. Thank you for the insightful comments. |
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alienist
Skeptic Friend
USA
210 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2011 : 11:50:15 [Permalink]
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My Dad used to work for NATO from 1967 to 1970. I will have to ask about any aliens traipsing through Brussels taking in the local beer, which is quite good. I bet the Irish aliens were still standing after all the drinking.... |
The only normal people are the ones you don't know very well! - Joe Ancis |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2011 : 20:17:55 [Permalink]
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Dave.....
| It didn't resonate with the public because it was wholly strange to them. |
Rephrase this, Dave, it is ambiguous as it stands. Does it mean A. or B.?
A. It did not resonate with the public. This is because it was wholly strange to them.
Or
B. It did resonate with the public. This is because it was not wholly strange to them.
I believe you meant B. But the statement as written could mean either A. or B. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2011 : 20:31:19 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by bngbuck
I believe you meant B. |
And you're correct. As noted earlier in the thread, Close Encounters of the Third Kind was very popular. That's the context that removes the ambiguity of the statement in question. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/19/2011 : 21:01:02 [Permalink]
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Le Penseur.....
You have indicated in several of your more recent posts that you will respond to Filthy and Kil who have legitimate questions regarding aliens.
Please read or scan the last 20-odd pages of this thread, and read a few of my comments directed to you, Most of them do not criticize you in any way. I simply want to learn more of what you know about aliens. I am not participating in this post to be critical of you or your narrative of abduction. Kil also largely wants to hear more, and perhaps Filthy also. There ar a few others that also would like to hear more of the aliens. I fear, however, that most of the other members simply want to heckle, pester or ridicule you or engage in nit-picking argumentation.
I have done a lot of this recreational verbal combat since being on SFN. It's fun, most of the time. I realize I have done far too much because it is addictive. Since you appeared here, I have been solely interested in hearing more about aliens. I have asked many questions. All have been about aliens. Few have been answered.
Please recognize my questions to you as representing fair and genuine questions concerning aliens, their nature, their origins, their modus operandi, etc., etc.
Please answer questions from Filthy, Kil, and also me this weekend, Le Penseur. Thank you. |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 01:52:11 [Permalink]
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Dave.....
| As noted earlier in the thread, Close Encounters of the Third Kind was very popular. That's the context that removes the ambiguity of the statement in question. |
Old arguments never die, they just fade away!
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 11:19:54 [Permalink]
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BNGBUCK!
I'm not ignoring you, man, I'm counting on your help, defending my position from trollish malarkey. You are keeping it real, brother, and it's much appreciated. Did you ever know you are my hero? You are the wind beneath my wings! lol
Salute! |
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filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 12:55:27 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by bngbuck
Dave.....
| As noted earlier in the thread, Close Encounters of the Third Kind was very popular. That's the context that removes the ambiguity of the statement in question. |
Old arguments never die, they just fade away!
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I'm 'bout ready to give it up, buck. The thread has become all but endless and has generated not a scrap of useful information. I think I'll just go back to sitting on the Group W Bench for a while, and talk to the mother-stabbers & father-rapers. There, I might learn something.
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"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
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le Penseur
Banned
USA
142 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 13:13:07 [Permalink]
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Kil : | Whoa! This is starting to sound like MIB. |
The Men in Black movie is based on a fictional comic book that has little in common with actual MIB cases. Actual MIB show up to silence or threaten UFO witnesses or confiscate evidence. From the cases I've read, at least some of the MIB do not seem to be human at all. I suggest Jenny Randles "The Truth Behind Men in Black".
Kil: | Can you name the NATO security official and what his roll at NATO is or was? ('Security official" is too general a term to tell me much.) |
Yes, Kil. He is U.S. Army Command Sargeant Major Robert Dean, he worked in SHAPE (Supreme Headquarters Allied Powers Europe), he was stationed at SHOC (Supreme Headquaters Operations Center) with a COSMIC TOP SECRET security clearance.
Major Dean discusses in great detail several different alien species, and that by the 1980s they had catalogued over 50 alien species. Youtube has alot of video of Major Dean, I suggest checking it out, he has some startling information.
Here's a little about Dean: Dean also reported that government insiders feel that we are dealing with hundreds of ET civilizations, some intergalactic, some interdimensional. He noted that over 10 years ago, NASA set up a scientific committee, which came to the conclusion that there are an estimated 10 billion planets with intelligent life.
"Sgt.-Major Dean has assembled 20 astronauts, former intelligence officers, servicemen who participated in crashed UFO retrieval operations, generals, admirals, and even cosmonauts, who are willing to testify to a Congressional Committee about what they know about UFOs, provided that they are released from their National Security oaths. The videotaped depositions of sworn key witnesses have been taken by a prestigious Washington, D.C. law firm, and stored in its safe, awaiting public hearings," documents Dr. Richard J. Boylan in "UFO Reality Shift".
Former U.S. Military Commander Dean had began working with CSETI's [Committee for the Study of Extra Terrestrial Intelligence], Dr. Steven Greer, in concert with former astronaut Gordon Cooper, other astronauts, another high-ranking military officer, and a General, to plan the release of UFO information to which they are privy.
"Dr. Greer and Sgt. Major Dean are part of a Coalition of Starlight and Stargate Projects, which have been putting together the best evidence of UFO/ET reality. The evidence includes not only military and intelligence officers who participated in UFO crash retrievals and autopsies on ET corpses, but also fighter pilots, generals, astronauts and cosmonauts who have witnessed UFOs close-up, as well as UFO and ET tissue samples," further documents Dr. Boylan.
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Here's a video of Ret. U.S. Army Sgt. Clifford Stone discussing the exact number of alien species catalogued by our government at 57, as of 1989.
I will address Kils other comments and questions a little later, then try to get to filthy and bngbuck. thanks.
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Kil
Evil Skeptic
USA
13477 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 14:01:52 [Permalink]
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le Penseur:
The Men in Black movie is based on a fictional comic book that has little in common with actual MIB cases. Actual MIB show up to silence or threaten UFO witnesses or confiscate evidence. From the cases I've read, at least some of the MIB do not seem to be human at all. I suggest Jenny Randles "The Truth Behind Men in Black". |
As I understand it, a “journalist” named Gray Barker introduced the idea of MIB and made it up out of whole cloth. That is to say that there was no comic book, or what you describe as the real MIB until Gray Barker invented them. In an article that was published in Skeptical Inquirer, John C. Sherwood writes about Gray Barker: My Friend, the Myth-Maker, and Sherwoods own complicity in creating the myth.
Sherwood writes:
They Knew Too Much about Flying Saucers made the Men in Black (M.I.B.) feared within UFO circles during the late 1950s and 1960s. The book now is hard to find, and my hardcover copy — the third printing — has crispy pages. In it, Gray told about alleged brushes between the sinister M.I.B. and a Connecticut man, Al K. Bender, who set the pace for what is now the stereotypical M.I.B. story: Someone sees a UFO and tries to tell the world about it. Without warning, three men in black suits and driving a big black car confront the witness. Afterwards, the witness appears too frightened to talk further about the UFO — or anything else. Woo-WOOO-oo!
In account after account within the pages of They Knew Too Much and subsequent writings by others (including John Keel, who began using the shorthand “M.I.B.” in his writings), the mysterious trio — who at times seem to have uncanny mental powers and weird, otherworldly faces — squelch all discussion about supposedly true UFO encounters. The whole notion smacked of a huge, pre-Watergate conspiracy.
As I began to write this apologetic revelation in July 1997, the news came that the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency indeed may have participated in a coverup not unlike that supposedly initiated by the fabled M.I.B. U.S. intelligence historian Gerald K. Haines wrote an unclassified article for Studies of Intelligence, a CIA journal, revealing that during the 1950s the U.S. Air Force and other agencies actually did conspire to suppress the UFO issue and to concoct false cover stories to explain sightings of such super-secret U.S. spy planes as the U-2 and later the SR-71 Blackbird (the Internet address for Haines’s study is odci.gov).
So, Bender, Barker, and the rest indeed may have been inspired by a grain (or several grains) of truth. But that doesn't contradict what I am about to disclose about Barker’s participation in — and encouragement of — actual fraud to perpetuate sales of his UFO books and magazines... |
Read on.
There is also a movie documentary about Barker that I believe was mentioned earlier in this thread. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this, le Penseur.
Also, that quote about Dean. Can you get me the link to it? It's common practice around here to link to any quoted materials or sources.
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Uncertainty may make you uncomfortable. Certainty makes you ridiculous.
Why not question something for a change?
Genetic Literacy Project |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 14:27:15 [Permalink]
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Originally quoted by le Penseur
"Sgt.-Major Dean has assembled 20 astronauts, former intelligence officers, servicemen who participated in crashed UFO retrieval operations, generals, admirals, and even cosmonauts, who are willing to testify to a Congressional Committee about what they know about UFOs, provided that they are released from their National Security oaths. The videotaped depositions of sworn key witnesses have been taken by a prestigious Washington, D.C. law firm, and stored in its safe, awaiting public hearings," documents Dr. Richard J. Boylan in "UFO Reality Shift". |
So Boylan has demonstrated that there are 20 people who should have been stripped of their clearances long ago for not being trustworthy enough to keep their oaths, and we're supposed to take what they say seriously?
Honestly, if I were a government disinformation agent, this is exactly the sort of theater that I would create. The situation is such that abductees have to both claim that people within the government are trying to shut them up, and that people within the government are trying to get the truth out. Sometimes (Hyneck) it's the same people. It doesn't matter what the truth really is, as a ploy to keep people confused, guessing and unsure of any source, this is a beautiful piece of work.
I mean if alien visitors are really blue gelatinous cubes with a thousand eyes, we've got Mr. Dean to tell us that they're so close to human they could be walking around in the White House. But if that's the truth, we've got Dean's admitted security violations to show that he can't be trusted. It's a win-win for whoever wants to keep ET a secret. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 14:43:43 [Permalink]
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I want to keep ET secret, because I'm an ET. I'm mind controlling LP right now, I am going to make him say something ridiculous and offensive to Dave_W to prove my powers over him. I also claim responsibility for making say the government can't be trusted and then making him cite government stuff as "proof"! (I agree Dave_W, that was rather brilliant of me, thanks for noticing)
Next week I'll make him act like a total retard on a skeptic's internet forum.... oh, wait, I already made him do that. Hmmm, maybe I'll make him post a youtube vid with him going off the deep end ranting about aliens and how they probed him. Hmmmm, yeah, that could be entertaining!
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 03/20/2011 : 15:29:32 [Permalink]
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Le Penseur.....
| I'm counting on your help, defending my position from trollish malarkey. |
Thanks for your response to my posts, LP
But you really don't need help in defending yourself from anyone here, you are extremely capable - as witness the 579 replies and 39 pages that this thread has run. The "trollish malarky" that you mention will continue as long as you respond to it or care to initiate additional stimulus in defense of what the "trolls" perceive as your violations of the tenets of critical thinking, your committing one or more of the List of Logical Fallacies, and possibly even failing to apply the mandates of the Scientific Method to your thinking.
This is what most of the members of SFN do here, and is the reason that they are here. The existence of "aliens" has long been seen by Critical Thinkers as highly suspect, not meeting the requirements of the rigid evidence that Critical Thinking demands. Hence, no evidence not meeting standards set by the Scientific Method, CT, and possibly showing some indication of a Logical Fallacy; is acceptable as presented to Critical Thinkers. Particularly purely anecdotal evidence.
I may be the only person on this forum that does not fully share the view that Critical Thinking (in its broadest application) is the end and all and final quietus to the search for truth or fact. That subject is proper topic for another thread someday, which I am planning to do. But that will only make my unpopularity grow and I would rather not become a total pariah at this time. Just running into a person like yourself is a remarkable stroke of luck for me.
These people are not Trolls, nor are they hectoring you just to be mean although there is an element of exhibitionism in some of their application of the Critical Thinking process. Irrespective of that, several of the SFN members really do want to hear more of your experiences. Kil, for example. And.....
I do!..... I truly am sick to death of the endless repetitive analyses given, to the effect that your narrative is a psychological aberration of some manner or another. Of course that is a possibility. Another possibility is that you are telling the truth. Personally, I can not possibly reach any conclusion about you individually or the nature of your description of alien abduction until I can hear much more of your actual story. I am in no way focused on your mental health, your purpose in coming to SFN, or anything else than the details of your story and particularly the details of what exactly these alien visitations are and what they mean.
As I have said elsewhere, I have read extensively concerning UFO's, all kinds of UAP, and alien visitation. The net effect of hundreds of hours of research is still a feeling of uncertainty. You are the first human being with whom I have ever had direct contact that states he has been abducted by, and has had communication with, alien beings. I am actually thrilled by the opportunity to listen to what you have to tell. And to be able to ask questions!
But so much of the actual content of this extraordinarily long thread has been devoted to questioning your credibility, and your completely understandable responses to the attacks upon you, that there has been relatively little real information revealed about the aliens. And I truly fear that you will simply leave, fed up with the endless dissection and parsing and ah-hah's and gotcha's, and there will be no way that I can contact you independent of SFN.
I completely understand that you feel high emotion and that you must defend your position. As I have detailed fully in an earlier post in this thread, I endured an extremely lengthy similar interrogation several years ago when I first joined SFN. I had not had an abduction experience, I only had what I thought were reasonable questions for Skeptics. My naiveté was quickly destroyed, I found that here, without"evidence", one should not even mention the subject.
As soon as you are comfortable is so doing, LP, please answer as many questions as you can about the nature of the aliens - many of which I have already asked.
Is there a reason that we cannot have private contact?
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ETs are here, despite guesses to the contrary
