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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
 Posted - 07/12/2007 : 15:36:43
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U.S. Army block public forum on the Security and Prosperity Partnership
http://www.canadians.org/media/DI/2007/11-July-07.html
| Founded in 1985, the Council of Canadians is Canada's largest citizens' organization, with members and chapters across the country. |
Why is the US army involved in Canada?
Why has a long term active political group with a large membership been prevented from this venue?
Why does not anyone talk about the North American Union?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
 Posted - 08/26/2007 : 10:31:58 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Ricky
I find it quite amazing in how selective you are at what you will take at face value. To me, the story sounds quite fishy and it seems as if a lot of details were left out. Perhaps not, I don't know. The point being is that if it were me, I'd search for more information before I even began to ask questions.
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Looks like the Canadian police attempted to use agent provocateurs to start a riot.
Police caught trying to start a riot.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 10:54:27 [Permalink]
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I think it's all right there in the article, Jerome. On the one hand, you have the "Council of Canadians" who wanted to rent a building to hold a public forum. They want to hold the forum at the same time as the "Security and Prosperity Partnership" meeting.
According to security protocols, the "RCMP [Royal Canadian Mounted Police] and the SQ [Sûreté du Québec] will be enforcing a 25-kilometre security perimeter around the Chateau Montebello." The proposed building where the Council of Canadians wanted to meet is in the Municipality of Papineauville, "which is about six kilometres from Montebello," where the "Security and Prosperity Partnership" is meeting.
In light of this, it seems like mention of the US Army in the press release is a bit gratuitous. That is, the perimeter is being enforced by Canadian police and security forces.
In any event, it is certain that if the Council of Canadians wanted to hold their forum in, say, Toronto or Calgary or virtually anywhere else in Canada, there would be no problems.
As for talk of the North American Union, I think we'll bring that up right after we finished talking about the Illuminati.
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| Edited by - Cuneiformist on 08/26/2007 10:56:16 |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 10:59:37 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Originally posted by Ricky
I find it quite amazing in how selective you are at what you will take at face value. To me, the story sounds quite fishy and it seems as if a lot of details were left out. Perhaps not, I don't know. The point being is that if it were me, I'd search for more information before I even began to ask questions.
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Looks like the Canadian police attempted to use agent provocateurs to start a riot.
Police caught trying to start a riot.
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What does this have to do with your original post?!? If you want to start a discussion about yet another You Tube video, start a new thread. |
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Ricky
SFN Die Hard
USA
4907 Posts |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 12:07:04 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Cuneiformist
As for talk of the North American Union, I think we'll bring that up right after we finished talking about the Illuminati.
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The Illuminati have been defunct for many, many years. Now on to the NAU. Lou Dobbs from CNN seems to think a NAU is being established.
NAU on CNN
Lou Dobbs and a Brave New World
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 15:35:40 [Permalink]
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I've heard about Dobbs and his 'North American Union' paranoia, but only briefly. In general, I don't put much stock in speculative media ramblings, especially when CNN dismisses such talk as fringe talk.
Jerome, are you going to at least acknowledge the other parts of my post?
Also, just as a personal note, I really detest using You Tube as "evidence" of anything. I'll go there to watch episodes of Flight of the Conchords or something, but if you really want to discuss an issue, I'd rather be able to read it. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 15:52:32 [Permalink]
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You tube is just a venue of video, both of those videos are clips from CNN broadcast. The other is a video of Canadian police trying to start a riot.
Go read the SPP web site instead of claiming that Lou Dobbs is a paranoid based on nothing.
Dobbs has won nearly every major award for television journalism. He received the George Foster Peabody Award for his coverage of the 1987 stock market crash. In 1990, he was given the Luminary Award by the Business Journalism Review for his "visionary work, which changed the landscape of business journalism in the 1980s." In 1999, he received the Horatio Alger Association Award for Distinguished Americans and Dobbs was named "Father of the Year" by the National Father's Day Committee in 1993.
He graduated from Harvard University with a degree in economics. Dobbs serves on the boards of the Society of Professional Journalists Foundation, the Horatio Alger Association, the National Space Foundation and SPACE Holdings, Inc., in which he owns a minority stake, as he does in Integrity Bank. He is also a member of the Planetary Society, the Overseas Press Club, the American Economic Association and the National Academy of Television Arts & Sciences. |
Do you really think Lou Dobbs is a paranoid?
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 16:13:56 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
You tube is just a venue of video, both of those videos are clips from CNN broadcast. The other is a video of Canadian police trying to start a riot. |
I'll refrain from sarcasm in the slight chance that my explanation was just too unclear. But again, the point is that I don't think it's a good use of my time to have to sit through five or ten or fifty minutes of a video to find a point or points in question. When reading, I am able to skim, skip ahead, repeat, etc., at my leisure. It's how I prefer to process data. You obviously love watching videos. I don't. While I'm not the only person at SFN, in general, the practice here is been to post links to written discussions of things, and not video clips, be they on You Tube or anywhere else.
| Go read the SPP web site instead of claiming that Lou Dobbs is a paranoid based on nothing. |
And if I do, and then offer valid critique, will you ignore it like you've done already in this thread? Because if so, then I don't think I'll bother.
| Dobbs has won nearly every major award ... |
Do you really think Lou Dobbs is a paranoid? |
His more recent work-- particularly on immigration-- does border on xenophobic paranoia. Regardless of the awards he's won. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 16:32:22 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Cuneiformist
| Go read the SPP web site instead of claiming that Lou Dobbs is a paranoid based on nothing. |
And if I do, and then offer valid critique, will you ignore it like you've done already in this thread? Because if so, then I don't think I'll bother. |
I read what you posted and you misrepresented what the link was. It was not CNN dismissing Lou Dobbs.
His more recent work-- particularly on immigration-- does border on xenophobic paranoia. Regardless of the awards he's won.
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You have presented zero evidence that Lou Dobbs is either xenophobic or paranoid.
By the way, Lou Dobbs wife is Mexican American. Some how I do not think he is xenophobic.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 17:00:53 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Originally posted by Cuneiformist
| Go read the SPP web site instead of claiming that Lou Dobbs is a paranoid based on nothing. |
And if I do, and then offer valid critique, will you ignore it like you've done already in this thread? Because if so, then I don't think I'll bother. |
I read what you posted and you misrepresented what the link was. It was not CNN dismissing Lou Dobbs. |
But the question is if you will bother to consider and respond. Already, I addressed the main thrust of your original post, and we've already gone off on myriad tangents.
As for my CNN comment, the point-- since perhaps I wasn't clear, was that Suzanne Malveaux, who regularly appears on Lou Dobbs' show, said that the chatter about the nefarious SPP came from "the blogosphere and conspiracy theorists," even though her own network has a major personality saying the same thing. Take it for what it's worth regarding Malveaux, Dobbs, and CNN.
| You have presented zero evidence that Lou Dobbs is either xenophobic or paranoid. |
I guess I didn't pepper my post with enough random You Tube clips from Dobbs' show? In any case, Media Matters has documented how Dobbs misuses data regarding immigration on his show (e.g. here, here, and so on). But that's neither here nor there; I'd rather get to a discussion of the SPP and NAU after we clear up the discussion of your original arguments. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 18:10:03 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
By the way, Lou Dobbs wife is Mexican American. Some how I do not think he is xenophobic. |
When did xenophobia become "fear of Mexican Americans?" |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 18:18:34 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Cuneiformist
But the question is if you will bother to consider and respond. Already, I addressed the main thrust of your original post, and we've already gone off on myriad tangents. |
I will read what ever you post. What tangent?
| As for my CNN comment, the point-- since perhaps I wasn't clear, was that Suzanne Malveaux, who regularly appears on Lou Dobbs' show, said that the chatter about the nefarious SPP came from "the blogosphere and conspiracy theorists," even though her own network has a major personality saying the same thing. Take it for what it's worth regarding Malveaux, Dobbs, and CNN. |
If you read and not skim the article, you would see she is reporting on the things that CNN has reported concerning the NAU. There is nothing there that even hints that CNN dismisses Lou Dobbs in any way.
I guess I didn't pepper my post with enough random You Tube clips from Dobbs' show? In any case, Media Matters has documented how Dobbs misuses data regarding immigration on his show (e.g. here, here, and so on). But that's neither here nor there; I'd rather get to a discussion of the SPP and NAU after we clear up the discussion of your original arguments.
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What argument did I miss? I am willing for any talk.
Are you going to retract your comments about Lou Dobbs being paranoid and xenophobic, which was a silly ad hom attack with no basis in fact.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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JEROME DA GNOME
BANNED
2418 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 18:21:57 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dave W.
Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
By the way, Lou Dobbs wife is Mexican American. Some how I do not think he is xenophobic. |
When did xenophobia become "fear of Mexican Americans?"
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Ask Cune, he said Dobbs was xenophobic concerning the border. What do group of people do you think Cune might have been referring to? I assumed it was Mexicans as that is the border that Dobbs talks about alot.
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What a man believes upon grossly insufficient evidence is an index into his desires -- desires of which he himself is often unconscious. If a man is offered a fact which goes against his instincts, he will scrutinize it closely, and unless the evidence is overwhelming, he will refuse to believe it. If, on the other hand, he is offered something which affords a reason for acting in accordance to his instincts, he will accept it even on the slightest evidence. The origin of myths is explained in this way. - Bertrand Russell |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 08/26/2007 : 19:20:43 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by JEROME DA GNOME
Ask Cune, he said Dobbs was xenophobic concerning the border. What do group of people do you think Cune might have been referring to? I assumed it was Mexicans as that is the border that Dobbs talks about alot. |
I'm asking about your rebuttal. I see how being married to a Mexican American might make a rational person more accepting of Mexicans, but we're discussing xenophobia, a strictly irrational fear of strangers. He may as well be married to a Zulu for all it'd matter to such a charge. The fact is that his wife isn't one of the anonymous masses of Mexicans just South of the Border, and so her heritage is irrelevant as a rebuttal of that particular accusation against Dobbs.
Wikipedia reports that he's also been accused of anti-Hispanic racism, a charge against which his wife's race is relevant. But anti-Hispanic racism isn't the same as border xenophobia. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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US Army Censoring Political Speech in Canada
