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konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 14:17:34 [Permalink]
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Um, still it remains, that Darwin found evolution itself. No matter if he could mistake the rest he found the base of our next research and theories.
Also I mean: whole existence of clock is still link to creating will, in other words translation (in sense: link to s-t is translation of s-t) of that will, and finally foot of creating will at the ground.
I agree, that non-random musn't point to will. But at least to decision-like behavior. We must understand, that [will, consciousness, life, decision ~*1] are phenomenons, which can't be proved. But by telling there is will [etc] we can continue moving. So also we can easily suppose that non-random is hint to find decision, will, consciousness and life. Also I suppose randomizeness is only subjective phenomenon - I mean: there would be no random number if there was no consciousness. So randomizeness as category or property of object is only way how to understand very complex origin of object, so complex, that even intuition is not able to feel some rule there, but still it is not prove that there is no rule, origin of randomize phenomenon. So if we told: something is beeing sporadically; we only told, that there is too much connections within cause of that something. Now hold inability to prove word collection *1. If we take how random numbers are generated in computer: some crystal is generating impulses at some measure, and these impulses are going through whole line between 0 and 1 of real sporadically spread. But if we studied internal structure of concrete crystal, maybe some external influences (liguid-like magnetic field around, solar system impulses etc.), we would be able to suppose which number will come next. So we could compete, who creates randomness generator and on the other side who creates suppose system for that. And maybe once, we would stay and see, that there is no another crystal to try, and whole row of know objects, which we tried to be random, is not. :)
*1) It is eternal argumentation between Pro-Will and Deterministic parts in philosophy fight. We can look to AI, politics and justice (murdery insanity pleading), comunism centralising planning-capitalism effort and need, it is still two lines of thinking, which correlates as two parallels ending in foreverness. making small cross there :)
Note: is there some rule for primes, or is prime's spread to N-axe real random?
Also I would like to point out two big pillars, which are less understanded, than it seem, by my opinion. It is life and consciousness. If we look at definition of both of them, we must agree there is nothing defined. In czech area of defining this subject I was searching as part of my school work, and as necessary for discussion with Mr. Dokulil, what is definition of consciousness in czech. "Vedomi je stav uvedomeni si" - it means, to english, "Consciouss is told about subject having consciousness" - and this complex sentence is most brillant specification of such phenomenon. Also how would you divide what is living and what non-living creation? It seems to be easy, but in words? Everything what moves is not enough, everything what reacts is not, also I, personally Me, did the anti-turing test, so that AI told me, that I am really AI (if you try, there is one secret knowledge in any AI machine, which can be transferred only between AI and AI, and AI, after bit of testing, gave me that info...so I pass the test "I am machine", NOTE/ I am excluding AI of vocabulary response type, mostly I talk to jabberwacky or HAL). From what I suppose, that turing test isn't tool to check presence of intelligence. And maybe, there is no such tool at all. Maybe that word collection *1 is of such format, which could be never defined, and that is maybe because of every-moment-respecify character of its natures. In every moment there is movement, which is able to negate whole base of such definition. But there is no reason to kill suppose of such things, as there is no reason to have definitions for them. In whole evolution of science, there was no specification of any word from *1, which would have final form, which would tell us something new. But also in whole that history there was big, unfinishing and, tell, heroic fight between two parts, wheech hardwoked to set some good, but, alas, final, and so invalid, but interresting definition, or conclusion. Maybe we should conserve some phenomenons to stay secret. As we owe our wives to have. What boring thing would existence been, if there was nothing to hide, nothing inunderstandable.
ANEK.E:
But, even if we got nothing from whole such thinking, we can tell: Existence and present privileges of such definitions in quite high elites of science proved one sentence told around 50's. Maybe this sentence was the most important message from our dear Albert Einstein. |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/30/2007 10:14:35 |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
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konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/29/2007 : 14:44:14 [Permalink]
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| I mean - randomness is only word for extremely complicated rule. And also non-random footprint of will must be understanded from this possible point of souverenity decay. |
di:liny = mniamky |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
 Posted - 10/29/2007 : 18:10:02 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by konikula
I mean - randomness is only word for extremely complicated rule. |
That's an assumption that I cannot agree with for the simple fact that being able to predict (for example) the next gamma-ray collision in Earth's atmosphere would require knowledge requiring more bits of storage than there are elementary particles in the universe. Even if we knew all the rules, we still couldn't use them to predict collisions - and so they are, for all intents and purposes, utterly random.| And also non-random footprint of will must be understanded from this possible point of souverenity decay. |
Only if I were to grant your assumption, which I can't. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 01:16:02 [Permalink]
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Yes. But need of extra memory to calculate isn't reason to deny validity of assumption that it is calculable. And we need to validate assumption, not to calculate all phenomenons to predict. We only should accept, that all of them are predictable, without regard to real severity of predicting. Or on the other side, Dave W, how wold you define phenomenons which aren't really predictable? By the example of clock, every phenomenon is predictable, not random. I am still supporting vision of randomizeness as concept of measuring human ability to predict.
Or if you would still stayed behind random randomizeness, you should include god, as cause of that row of phenomenons... And it is bit far behind to thing on God in philosophy or science... |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/30/2007 01:18:25 |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 08:55:42 [Permalink]
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Dave.....
Your patience is monumental. And saintly! From the degree that you have been able to communicate with Konikula, do you feel he is reading your posts as well as you are apparently reading his?
I am dead serious here. Could you precis what information has passed between you and K and post it here? I am truly becoming interested in this phenomenon.
I have a very good friend on the Navajo reservation in Arizona who was one of the Navajo code talkers during WWII. He became a linguist and I want to contact him re Konikula, as he may know something about translation!
Bill Buck |
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 10:13:26 [Permalink]
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A very quick overview of Cestina (the Czech language. My keyboard will not permit proper punctuation characters to correctly print many Czech words)
This only represents what I was able to pick up in an hour or so of reading, but I hope it gives some suggestion of the enormity of the task that Dave has undertaken!
Cestina - 3 Dialects, 42 character alphabet involving exotic punctuation, a highly inflected language with complex morphology.
Apparently there are 10 vowels, 3 dipthongs, and 21 consonants.
There are 10 parts of speech, complex declension with 7 noun cases.
Verb conjugation appears to be similar to English.
The counting system appears to be highly complex, and will require more time than I was able to give to relate it to English. There are three genders, male, female, and neuter. Tense is simple: Past, Present, and Future. Whew! That's a relief. I was expecting a fifth dimension!
Cestina is a West Slovak tongue, a subdivision of the Indo-European class of languages. West Slovak includes Cestina (Czech), Polish, Sloak, Sorbian, and Pomeranian (which may offer some explanation as to why it appears to be a bitch!)
The language dates back to the second half of the 12th century NE. It was originally solely from the Latin alphabet, but transmorphed into highly punctuated characters over the next six to seven hundred years. There are no Cyrillic characters, as in Russian, thank god!
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konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 10:25:29 [Permalink]
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You've got me laughed a bit :) With that dimension. For me is english bit more easy than german, but bit more difficult than Spanish
But maybe you are wrong with that "Slovak", because "Slovak" is what was until y94 part of Czechoslovakia. Now, as we are divided, our cultures and politics are continuously degrading, falling. But what I wanted to say: that language group of Russians, Czechs, Slovaks, Polaks, and ThE eLsEs is Slovan. And personally, I love Russian Cyrillic from childhood, and it is pretty easy to learn, because in real, it is only graphical redesign of latin to greek :) There is no char more than in latin. If you get used that D is partially equal to A, you should be able to read Cyrillic in two or three days...
In real there was absolutely negative public reaction to CSFR downgrade to SR and CR. It was only politic step, which was never really accepted by our hearts. |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/30/2007 10:28:33 |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 11:01:27 [Permalink]
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In real there was absolutely negative public reaction to CSFR downgrade to SR and CR. It was only politic step, which was never really accepted by our hearts.
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How did that happen then? Who did it hurt and who did it help? |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 11:01:53 [Permalink]
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Matej Kasper.....
How did you find your user name Konikula?
bngbuck (Bill Buck) |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 11:21:31 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Gorgo
In real there was absolutely negative public reaction to CSFR downgrade to SR and CR. It was only politic step, which was never really accepted by our hearts.
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How did that happen then? Who did it hurt and who did it help?
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Does the name George Soros come up at all when people discuss this, or the initials NED? |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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bngbuck
SFN Addict
USA
2437 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 11:42:46 [Permalink]
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Gorgo.....
I'm not sharp enough to get the connection between Soros (I read your excellent link) and the current thread involving Konikula, who is a Czech computer programmer (and apparently many other things, possibly a stalking horse) but I don't get a global power play vibe?
What are you saying? CSFR? CS=Cyrillic Russian? SR=Slovan Russian?
Can you confirm, comment? |
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konikula
New Member
Czech Republic
31 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 12:01:00 [Permalink]
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bngbuck: it is s-t like "Small horse". in slovan we "decrease expressed aggression" of called subject by "rounding" original word by appending y:sek, y:nek, i:cschek. so it sounds smaller in pronouncing. I am not sure but it can be compared to ((Lord of the ring)'s Glum)'s "Oh my dealesht" where dear is decayed by invalid pronounciation, so it sounds to be more dear than dearest. So, I like animals and in czech horse is "Ku:nj", lowered "Konietzschek" and neologism "Konikula" means if I may quick associate, the first is nature, animal, but I don't know, what I have to do with animals (I am consultant of them, both side reformer, atache of Christine, and both side security unit member, I understand them as man understand to man, anyway I can talk to any language unit, it is really only think of self-belief and talking about animals it depends mainly at knowledge, that they aren't submissive to us, that they are same part of nature as we do). So instead of using known appendixements of Kun to specify my relation to them, I created neologism. By the way telling "Earth is spheric" ~ "Zem#283; je kulatá [Zemje ye koolataaa]", som -kula is also part of sphericity... so translation of konikula could easily be horseric :)
gorgo: it is based at believs in modern lines in world after Havels revo at 89. we've simply got opportunity to care ourselves about our nation. we've got new television channel. we've removed all polititians and we started again. but we didn't realise, that privatisation will be good chance to become victim of our national thieves. so there was lot of theftries at the beginning, lot of economic mistakes. and after few years our actual president Klaus and Slovak premier Meciar officially declared republic division. And by the trend, which is dominant to our post-hitler-stalinic culture to now, we disagreed to it, but told nothing to that, because it came from godlike television, and godlike pair of reformers [I don't know their roles in revo, I suppose NONE]. So we let it be, looking our neighboirs disagreeing sadly in that new television... We did that to bombings in Irak, where many different plans could be done (by our reason [whole Europe disagreed to that actions, at public, I guess]). Also when Twins felt, many of US fans felt in crying, but after earthquake in Tu:rkce noone remembered. While irrelevant "Fight to the [t]errorism" begun, we, wordly, czechs, begun to securize our stupid objects with old transporters, what was very funny, at least for me. And now we, by the same line of errors, we are going to host us radar, without any thought, only for "You will have something from that", and when Russia, after my secret request for it, told, that we will get nuclear bombing if we allow us forces to build it here, "conference about radar continue, plebiscit is refused". In other words: if usa officially (keporkak message) submits Czech Republic to be annihilated, e.g. as consequence of secret resolutions of E.Ts, our President will check out that ETs, and we, behind our TVs will prepare to applaud to the great secret resolution, which is enough strong to change our impotent life. (I am beeing funny right now)
from need of complex standarts of usa you will be exterminated, do you agree? |
di:liny = mniamky |
| Edited by - konikula on 10/30/2007 12:09:49 |
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 12:10:23 [Permalink]
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| securize our stupid objects with old transporters, what was very funny, at least for me. And now we, by the same line of errors, we are going to host us radar, without any thought, only for "You will have something from that", and when Russia, after my secret request for it, told, that we will get nuclear bombing if we allow us forces to build it here, "conference about radar continue, plebiscit is refused". In other words: if usa officially (keporkak message) submits Czech Republic to be annihilated, e.g. as consequence of secret resolutions of E.Ts, our President will check out that ETs, and we, behind our TVs will prepare to applaud to the great secret resolution, which is enough strong to change our impotent life. (I am beeing funny right now) |
Having problems understanding this part. Because of the so-called "war on terrorism" the Czech Republic is being forced to put in U.S. radar, but the Russians don't like that and are threatening nuclear bombing? What are the "E.Ts?" |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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Gorgo
SFN Die Hard
USA
5310 Posts |
Posted - 10/30/2007 : 12:17:11 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by bngbuck
Gorgo.....
I'm not sharp enough to get the connection between Soros (I read your excellent link) and the current thread involving Konikula, who is a Czech computer programmer (and apparently many other things, possibly a stalking horse) but I don't get a global power play vibe?
What are you saying? CSFR? CS=Cyrillic Russian? SR=Slovan Russian?
Can you confirm, comment?
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I thought it had something to do with the breakup of Czechoslovakia. |
I know the rent is in arrears
The dog has not been fed in years
It's even worse than it appears
But it's alright-
Jerry Garcia
Robert Hunter
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| Edited by - Gorgo on 10/30/2007 12:17:59 |
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Global communication - beta
