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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
 Posted - 02/04/2008 : 09:02:48
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So since D&D seems to be at least semi-popular around here, I thought we might detail our love for the game and such...
2.0RULZ!!!, Ive always been anti 3.0/3.5
I started in seventh grade or so, playing a toned down version since I had no books and no real knowledge of the game. This quikly descended into anarchy as we gained magical Elvish flamethrowers and other oddities which made the game unplayable. We then switched to a space based political rpg that our DM made up, that too failed when I ruined everyone elses game by blowing up one of the main planets, Ender style. Later we booted our DM as we felt that he was far too into the role, he took it so hard we seriously thought he might try to kill himself.
After that I moved away and was relegated to video game versions of D&D, which were wholly inadequate at the time. Also I moved on to MUDs(Multi User Dungeons) which are text only games on the ol' 1400k modem. I obsessed with the Diku MUD for awhile until my game was shut down.
I hooked up with a new buddy from Wisconson as a senior in HS who had all of the materials needed for me to actually learn how to play. He had always been a DM and wanted to be a player and I was more of the DM type so after some minor campaigning I took over as DM.
More later I gotta go...
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"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 09:28:56 [Permalink]
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Yeah. I played a little 1e but was too young to really fully grasp all the nuances of the rules. By the time I was in junior high, 2e had come out and I really got into it. I really hated the whole 3e thing, mostly because I didn't feel like investing another $100 in new rule books that I'd rather have invested in continued 2e material.
And now, in what seems like a really short time, they're already talking about 4e! |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 10:41:06 [Permalink]
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| Yeah ever since TSR got bought out its been all about the benjis, players be damned. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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H. Humbert
SFN Die Hard
USA
4574 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 10:49:22 [Permalink]
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Despite enjoying the fantasy genre and playing quite a few RPG video games, I've never played a pen-and-paper role playing game in my life, including D&D. I've played Baldur's Gate II, which was based on the Advanced D&D rule set, but that's pretty much the extent of my dabbling. I can't say I was all that impressed. The system seemed unnecessarily complex and clumsy to use. Too many things to micromanage imo, which distracted from the fun.
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"A man is his own easiest dupe, for what he wishes to be true he generally believes to be true." --Demosthenes
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool." --Richard P. Feynman
"Face facts with dignity." --found inside a fortune cookie |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 11:00:51 [Permalink]
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ummm Even when TSR owned D&D, it was all about the $$! They put out dozens of "class" books and other must-have supplements on a monthly basis.
WotC and 3.5 is actually a superior D&D game compared to 2.0, the classes are more balanced, there are countless monsters with "level adjustments" that let you use them as player characters, there are racial levels and template levels so you could start playing a monster or other powerfull creature at low level (it doesn't get all its abilities right off) and not disrupt your group's game. There are dozens of "variant" rule sets contained in official books. All in all its a very good product. I'll admit I was also wary of it when 3.0 was released... but changed my mind after giving it a try.
Also, you can pirate all the books online nowdays with P2P.... not that I would do such a thing, but I may know people who might have...
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 11:01:29 [Permalink]
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Yes, a good DM is critical to enjoyment, as are having at least a few players who know what the hell they are doing. If you didnt get into BG, then you probably wont like pen and paper, but it is an altogether different experience.
When I DMed my players were woefully poor, two of them really could have cared less and they all were drunk the entire time. The poor players would always do something stupid because they did not care about the consequences, which would then screw the players who did care. I never understood why I got bitched at when I granted my wishes as DM, it says right on the spell that the DM should and will screw you over. The last one I remember was a PC wishing to be the strongest man in the world, so naturally I had the players mind put into that persons body and his mind in the PCs body, the guy was not happy about being transported around the world and into some weaklings body in a dungeon somewhere. Oh well... |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 11:08:47 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by Dude
ummm Even when TSR owned D&D, it was all about the $$! They put out dozens of "class" books and other must-have supplements on a monthly basis.
WotC and 3.5 is actually a superior D&D game compared to 2.0, the classes are more balanced, there are countless monsters with "level adjustments" that let you use them as player characters, there are racial levels and template levels so you could start playing a monster or other powerfull creature at low level (it doesn't get all its abilities right off) and not disrupt your group's game. There are dozens of "variant" rule sets contained in official books. All in all its a very good product. I'll admit I was also wary of it when 3.0 was released... but changed my mind after giving it a try.
Also, you can pirate all the books online nowdays with P2P.... not that I would do such a thing, but I may know people who might have...
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Really I have no doubt that 3.0 is more balanced, however converting a well constructed campaign into 3.0 is a complete nightmare and converting the new material into 2.0 is virtually impossible, and as someone who has hundreds of hours and dollars invested into 2.0, it was a slap in face the followed by a kick in the nuts. They made no attempt to help or cater to those players who wished to remain with the old system. The new way or no way attitude completely put me off.
Also I know that TSR and 2.0 was in it for the money, however those suppliments were not needed to play a functional game. The Humanoids Handbook is the greatest thing ever. I would have no issues with the new system if they had made the slightest attempt to make it convertable, but they did not. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
| Edited by - BigPapaSmurf on 02/04/2008 11:12:05 |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 12:31:40 [Permalink]
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Started playing in 1977. Played weekly or more often until 1984 or so. Except for a couple times in the mid-80s, I haven't played paper-and-pencil again since.
I've still got my dice, but my AD&D (and OD&D) rulebooks all were given away, long ago.
Played a handful of different computer variants. Was an implementor on a highly customized DikuMUD variant, too. One of these days, I'm going to make time to start a new MUD. Maybe. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2008 : 12:34:25 [Permalink]
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Oh, if anyone wants to put together an online-and-paper game here, go ahead. I'll be the guy the GM says "yes, sir!" to.  |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2008 : 08:59:48 [Permalink]
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Im a big fan of epic,
After I became DM I created my own campaign world which took place 5000 years in the future of the Dragonlance world, thousands of years ago the Dragonlance world Krynn was frozen solid and the Dragons and their kin called a truce to save their kind from destruction, they created a portal to another world where they lived well and reestablished themselves until at last the old world was forgotten. The PCs first adventure was to a town which had been frozen in ice by a constant winter wind which had recently begun eminating from a nearby cave. Investigating they found a portal to Krynn where they found a White Dragon had enslaved the locals. After freeing the slaves they fled back through the portal and collapsed the cave, damaging the portal in the process.
Later in the campaign they were in the desert when they were accosted by a smallish blue dragon who toyed with them for awhile, only to be attacked from below the sand by an Ancient Bronze Wyrm, the Wyrm was quite pushy and demanded that the PCs tell him all of the stories that they knew and of all their adventures. When the Great Dragon learned of the portal they had collapsed he knew immediatly what it was, as he was one of only a few Ancient Dragons who was alive during the great migration. He took the PCs and forced them to take him to the portal. There the dragon began preparing for something big, keeping the PCs in the dark. Then came the Day of the Wyrm when all of the Dragons would renew their truce and those who wished to return to Krynn would be allowed to do so. Soon the skys and waters were filled with dragons arriving from all over the world. A sight to behold indeed as 12 of the oldest dragons formed a circle and the trembling PCs told their story to all of the dragons. Never passing up a chance for destruction, A tarrasque came through the portal and cut the head from the Gold Wyrm, the dragons swarmed the beast of beasts and 'smote his ruin upon the mountainside' (Since the PCs would never be able to kill a tarrasque I thought this was an opportune time to throw one in for fun.)
to be continued...
edit...
For those who dont know, there is one tarrasque per planet and it lies dormant for decades at a time appearing occasionally to ravage the countryside, it is the baddest, meanest freak of nature in the D&D world, outside of the Gods and extra-planar uber demons.
Anyway back to the story, The dragons fixed the portal to Krynn and many of the dragons left my world for that one (leaving an unknown number of dragon hordes unguarded) The five strongest dragons remained to ensure that the portal would be protected. They called forth an army of men and dwarves to build a great keep at the base of the mountain surrounding the cave and estabilished the Order of the D20, which is 20 powerful representitives from the various races which would defend the keep with their lives if need be. Of course the PCs were made a part of this Order and they rainbow crest they wore was a powerful ally. The keep was extremly elaborate and held 5 other portals to the Master Wyrms lairs so that they could come and go as needed.
After this the main storyline was set and they continued with their minor adventures here and there, until they met the max leveled Papa Smurf, whom one should not underestimate, anyway they foolishly made mortal enemies of Papa by eating Smurfette for dinner and spent some time in temporal stasis deep underground, which I already covered in the How you got your screen name thread.
I still make excel programs and adventures which will never be used most likely as I enjoy the creation aspect very much...Oh and I dabbled in Neverwinter Nights for awhile, the first video game where you can actually DM and create things not programed already but I havent the patience for programming. Also I EverCracked out for 3 years or so as Tankenstein on the Povar server, gaining fame for my Newbielympics events and suicidally heroic deeds. |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
| Edited by - BigPapaSmurf on 02/05/2008 12:35:07 |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2008 : 15:19:31 [Permalink]
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I only did some minor playing if 2nd edition Forgotten Realms.
My party, named "Fried chickens" got split up rather quickly. After a successful dungeon-raid near Tilverton, the party lost the heavy packing dwarf (strength 18/96) through a teleportation mirror to Waterdeep Magistrate, and two members through another teleportation way off to Moonshaes.
While this opened up for a campaign to retrieve lost friends, unfortunately the people I was playing with moved out of town and the game was abandoned.
I also started to play the "Curse of the Azure Bounds" module (2nd ed. rules), but there as well, game was interrupted by friends not being geographically available.
Edited to add:
Some times I'm not sure that the suspension of the games were all that bad. Consider this: My Game Master had our party meet an half-elf named Elron.... That friend of mine, though I love him as a friend dearly, was never really that imaginative, to really bring that edge with him to the game. His characters were always playing it safe, and could always counted upon to not make all those unexpected or stupid actions that makes gaming interesting. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
| Edited by - Dr. Mabuse on 02/05/2008 15:28:28 |
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Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 02/05/2008 : 16:25:34 [Permalink]
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BPS said:
| I would have no issues with the new system if they had made the slightest attempt to make it convertable, but they did not. |
There are extensive rules and instructions for converting 2.0 to 3.0, but not so much the other way.
The Forgotten Realms authors have also been creating tons of new content for 3.0/3.5, new adventure paths, new classes, new prestige classes, new monsters.... its massive. There are also many new standard campaign settings for the good old "greyhawk" d&d world.
Now, the talk about a 4th edition has me worried... 3.5 worked out most of the kinks/balance problems from 3.0, so I'm not sue why (beyond money) they are talking about a 4.0edition.
(edited to add: the talk for 4.0 is about changing the class balance from a "encounters per day" concept to balancing the classes on an "encounter only" basis, that wouldn't limit the number of battles you could engage in (per day) as tightly as the current system does. That means a massive reworking of the spell system, healing, and so on. Seems like a bad idea to me based on the "if it aint broke" principle.)
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Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
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| Edited by - Dude on 02/05/2008 16:29:54 |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2008 : 04:54:26 [Permalink]
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| Some times I'm not sure that the suspension of the games were all that bad. Consider this: My Game Master had our party meet an half-elf named Elron.... That friend of mine, though I love him as a friend dearly, was never really that imaginative, to really bring that edge with him to the game. His characters were always playing it safe, and could always counted upon to not make all those unexpected or stupid actions that makes gaming interesting. |
Well at least he wasnt killing other PCs in their sleep like one of my PCs...:) |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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Dr. Mabuse
Septic Fiend
Sweden
9688 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2008 : 05:53:11 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by BigPapaSmurf
Well at least he wasnt killing other PCs in their sleep like one of my PCs...:)
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Ah, but you couldn't call a stunt like that predictable or boring... 
Unless that was his MO. |
Dr. Mabuse - "When the going gets tough, the tough get Duct-tape..."
Dr. Mabuse whisper.mp3
"Equivocation is not just a job, for a creationist it's a way of life..." Dr. Mabuse
Support American Troops in Iraq:
Send them unarmed civilians for target practice..
Collateralmurder. |
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BigPapaSmurf
SFN Die Hard
3192 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2008 : 05:59:26 [Permalink]
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It was his MO, he is pretty much like Belkar from Order of the Stick, stab first ask questions later. He's still better than the dwarf PC from my party...
(PC level 5ish)
"You are suddenly surrounded by 25 large demons who demand your attention"
Dwarf
"I run up and slash the closest one!"
Dead Dwarf |
"...things I have neither seen nor experienced nor heard tell of from anybody else; things, what is more, that do not in fact exist and could not ever exist at all. So my readers must not believe a word I say." -Lucian on his book True History
"...They accept such things on faith alone, without any evidence. So if a fraudulent and cunning person who knows how to take advantage of a situation comes among them, he can make himself rich in a short time." -Lucian critical of early Christians c.166 AD From his book, De Morte Peregrini |
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Dave W.
Info Junkie
USA
26022 Posts |
Posted - 02/06/2008 : 07:28:20 [Permalink]
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Originally posted by BigPapaSmurf
Well at least he wasnt killing other PCs in their sleep like one of my PCs...:) |
I had a dwarf PC once with an insane strength, who walked out of a dungeon raid carrying a gem nearly as big as himself. The rest of the PCs in the game came out with some gold and trinkets. So we all go to the nearby city to celebrate, one big happy family, and then split up in town to run errands. The dwarf toddles off somewhere to exchange this huge rock for cash, and later meets back up with everyone else.
Unknown to me, two of the other PCs had gone off to hire an assassin to kill my guy in his sleep at the inn. The diamonds and gold he'd gotten for the monster gem were carefully hidden away inside a rather boring-looking axe, so he left with nothing but my PC's death.
When I asked the other players why they'd done in my guy, they said they didn't trust him because he was being too greedy and selfish. Seriously. They didn't even bother to ask if he was going to share the wealth, they just decided between themselves (no discussion with any other players, either) that if he didn't split up the proceeds from the gem voluntarily and as soon as Dwarvenly possible, that he was a detriment to the party overall and needed to be killed.
Asshats. I got my revenge. The next PC I got to introduce in that game had decent fighting stats, preached about teamwork and bragged about his skills, but would run if he got more than a scratch and loudly ask, "where's my share?" if we found treasure. |
- Dave W. (Private Msg, EMail)
Evidently, I rock!
Why not question something for a change?
Visit Dave's Psoriasis Info, too. |
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20th level Dork/Bard, your D&D history
