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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
 Posted - 12/17/2001 : 00:10:54
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How many of us remember Candace Newmaker? The 10 year old killed during rebirthing therapy. Her dear loving adoptive mother's sentence for the death of this child. 400 fucking hours of community service and a 4 year suspended sentence and she doesn't even have to stay in CO. Now how asinine is that!
Rocky Article:
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/local/article/0,1299,DRMN_15_845693,00.html
It is by the goodness of God that in our country we have those three unspeakably precious things: freedom of speech, freedom of conscience, and the prudence never to practice either of them. -Mark Twain
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Lisa
SFN Regular
USA
1223 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2001 : 18:20:17 [Permalink]
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Grief counceling? Community service? And the woman can still work as a pediatric nurse? What on earth was the judge thinking? I wonder if the judge is taking the old "she's suffered enough" route. That's utter bullshit. The only person who suffered during this was the little girl who slowly suffocated and died during this "therapy". Mom is as guilty as either one of those two quacks. Before she hired them, did she do any research? I'm not talking about asking friends, I'm referring to queries to health care professionals. Apparently not. When her little girl was complaining about difficulty breathing, did she demand that the quacks go back to their pond? Obviously not.
Yeah, I'm doing a slow burn over this one too.
Lisa
If you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room. |
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Donnie B.
Skeptic Friend
417 Posts |
Posted - 12/17/2001 : 18:55:00 [Permalink]
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I'm still incensed that the "therapists" were not conviced of murder, or (at the very least) manslaughter. The cruelty of their act was hideous.
IIRC, the "mother" here was not the girl's natural mother, but a foster and/or adoptive mother, yes? And she was present at the fatal session, yes? In which case, she's as guilty as the others.
I'm gonna be steaming over this one for a looooong time...
-- Donnie B.
[spelling correction]
Edited by - Donnie B. on 12/17/2001 18:55:50 |
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Lisa
SFN Regular
USA
1223 Posts |
Posted - 12/18/2001 : 11:50:20 [Permalink]
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Trish, I curious. What are the Colorado newspaper editorials saying? What's the general feeling about the judge's decision?
Lisa
If you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room. |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 12/18/2001 : 11:52:40 [Permalink]
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The therapists were convicted of child abuse resulting in accidental death and given 16 years out of a possible 48. Yes the adoptive mother was present at the session.
What is the price of a child? Apparently, not much. People seem to be so damned concerned about a child that hasn't even been yet - but it is apparent to me that they don't even give a rat's ass (no offense Rat) about the one who are already here! Wonder if people would be so cavalier about the lives of their children if the end result of child abuse was Murder in the Second?
It is by the goodness of God that in our country we have those three unspeakably precious things: freedom of speech, freedom of conscience, and the prudence never to practice either of them. -Mark Twain |
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The Rat
SFN Regular
Canada
1370 Posts |
Posted - 12/19/2001 : 20:53:35 [Permalink]
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quote:
...they don't even give a rat's ass (no offense Rat)
None taken. This rat's ass is ready to dump on everyone involved in this sordid episode. I can't think of this incident without thinking of my own beautiful children, and how I do as much as possible to protect them. Some would say that I perhaps go too far, not giving them much opportunity to learn by 'hard knocks'. They may be right. But then, I would never risk my children's lives over some stupid new-age horseshit belief either.
I wish it was possible to outlaw stupidity.
Free speech; excercise it or SHUT UP! |
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James
SFN Regular
USA
754 Posts |
Posted - 12/19/2001 : 21:16:29 [Permalink]
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quote:
I wish it was possible to outlaw stupidity.
So do I, Rat, but that'd take out half of Hollywood.
"Necessity may be the mother of invention, but laziness is usually the father." -Bailey's First Law |
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gezzam
SFN Regular
Australia
751 Posts |
Posted - 12/19/2001 : 21:34:12 [Permalink]
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quote:
quote:
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I wish it was possible to outlaw stupidity.
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So do I, Rat, but that'd take out half of Hollywood.
And the majority of human existence.....
"Damn you people. Go back to your shanties." --- Shooter McGavin |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 12/20/2001 : 09:32:29 [Permalink]
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quote:
Trish, I curious. What are the Colorado newspaper editorials saying? What's the general feeling about the judge's decision?
Lisa
If you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room.
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/opinion/article/0,1299,DRMN_38_659481,00.html
http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/news_columnists/article/0,1299,DRMN_86_243087,00.html
You should be able to find readers comments from these two editorials. Most people I know would have liked to see them convicted of murder.
It is by the goodness of God that in our country we have those three unspeakably precious things: freedom of speech, freedom of conscience, and the prudence never to practice either of them. -Mark Twain |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 12/20/2001 : 09:35:37 [Permalink]
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quote:
None taken. This rat's ass is ready to dump on everyone involved in this sordid episode. I can't think of this incident without thinking of my own beautiful children, and how I do as much as possible to protect them. Some would say that I perhaps go too far, not giving them much opportunity to learn by 'hard knocks'. They may be right. But then, I would never risk my children's lives over some stupid new-age horseshit belief either.
I have one child - most of you know - and have in the past two months had to make some really hard decisions (hurtful to me only) to see that she has better opportunity and a few essentials in life that I can't give her right now. It should be parents making the effort with their kids, not the kids making the effort with their parents.
It is by the goodness of God that in our country we have those three unspeakably precious things: freedom of speech, freedom of conscience, and the prudence never to practice either of them. -Mark Twain |
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Xev
Skeptic Friend
USA
329 Posts |
Posted - 01/15/2002 : 20:12:58 [Permalink]
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I'd like to see them convicted and executed, personally. Anyone who kills a child should have thier flesh- right, no emotional outbursts.
There are only a few things I hate, Osama Bin Ladin and company, and anyone who'd kill or hurt a child.
The thought of a little girl begging for air as adults looked on makes me sick and angry as hell.
Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people. People with no minds rewrite inspirational e-mail and send their new versions out over the Internet. -The Brothers Grinn.com |
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Kaneda Kuonji
Skeptic Friend
USA
138 Posts |
Posted - 01/23/2002 : 08:27:40 [Permalink]
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As a paralegal-in-training, I can say this. That should have been involuntary manslaughter, minimum! I'd bring it up to murder 2, but it doesn't meet the criteria of that crime, no mens rea. The actus reas (the body of the crime) was there, but no criminal intent.
Rodney Dean, CI Order of the Knights of Jubal
Ivbalis.org
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Megan
Skeptic Friend
USA
163 Posts |
Posted - 02/02/2002 : 18:37:19 [Permalink]
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Could there be any chance that the mother actually wanted the child killed?? I have no no idea why, but is it something to think about??
~Megan~
"If in the last few years you haven't discarded a major opinion or acquired a new one, check your pulse. You may be dead." - Zandermann |
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Trish
SFN Addict
USA
2102 Posts |
Posted - 02/03/2002 : 17:19:05 [Permalink]
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Unfortunately Megan, the mother may have wanted attention through the child but probably didn't intend any harm. Though she was told there was nothing wrong with Candace by several people. Then she heard about these quacks here in CO.
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There is no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our world. It underscores our responsibility to deal more kindly with one another, to preserve and cherish the pale blue dot, the only home we've known. Sagan |
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Lisa
SFN Regular
USA
1223 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2002 : 13:48:44 [Permalink]
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Munchausen by proxy? Could be. By saying she had a troubled child (whether the kid was troubled or not), she got the attention and sympathy of these two "therapists". I've never heard of Munchausen by Proxy used successfully as a defense. (and IMO, it shouldn't) Poor Candice died because mom needed some attention. I still don't think her punishment was harsh enough. The law allowed for much more.
Lisa
If you're not living on the edge, you're taking up too much room. |
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PhDreamer
SFN Regular
USA
925 Posts |
Posted - 02/04/2002 : 14:57:35 [Permalink]
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quote:
Munchausen by proxy? Could be. By saying she had a troubled child (whether the kid was troubled or not), she got the attention and sympathy of these two "therapists". I've never heard of Munchausen by Proxy used successfully as a defense. (and IMO, it shouldn't) Poor Candice died because mom needed some attention. I still don't think her punishment was harsh enough. The law allowed for much more.
Interesting. I would say that your thinking here is consistent with the facts Lisa. I was under the impression that most MbP cases involved induced physical maladies, but this page suggests that fabricated psychological disorders are also used sometimes: http://www.munchausen.com/
Adventure? Excitement? A Jedi craves not these things. - Silent Bob |
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