|
|
|
Wendy
SFN Regular
USA
614 Posts |
 Posted - 11/12/2004 : 07:54:47 [Permalink]
|
| I wonder if, before they bother to amend the Constitution (again), they will make the argument that since Bush wasn't elected by popular vote the first time, he should be eligible for another term. |
Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do on a rainy afternoon.
-- Susan Ertz
|
 |
|
|
Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 11/12/2004 : 09:02:47 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by furshur
I don't think we have to worry about Arnie, I would imagine that the republicans are already moving to over turn the 22nd amendment to the constitution so that we can have Bush in there for life.
That's a thought to give anyone nightmares.
Anyway, I'd pick Arnie anyday. I don't doubt he could get elected, either. |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
|
|
|
|
beskeptigal
SFN Die Hard
USA
3834 Posts |
Posted - 11/13/2004 : 04:24:22 [Permalink]
|
I'd love to see Clinton be able to run again, but thank goodness Bush can't. As far as Arnold, I suppose it isn't wrong for him to run. But he'd get votes for being the Terminator instead of how he does as California's governor.
I almost think Arnold's quotes about admiring Nixon and his cultural experience as a foreign born American make him inherently different than a native born person. OTOH, I'm sure there are foreign born citizens that are essentially like native born persons. I guess my prejudices about Arnold are interfering with my judgment about who should be eligible for Pres.
I have no doubt the GOP would like to have Arnold on the 2008 ticket in order to keep themselves in power. That should not be the reason for changing the law. It should be changed if it is no longer relevant instead. If you change it for Arnold, you'll be stuck with it for others. If we change it for cause, then it would be acceptable regardless of who the foreign born citizen was that might come along. |
|
|
|
Starman
SFN Regular
Sweden
1613 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2004 : 02:09:41 [Permalink]
|
This is an interesting rule. Is Arnold real a US citizen or are there different ranks of citizenship?
A more rational approach is that the Chief Of State should be a descendant from one of Napoleons field marshals.
 |
"Any religion that makes a form of torture into an icon that they worship seems to me a pretty sick sort of religion quite honestly"
-- Terry Jones |
|
|
|
Wendy
SFN Regular
USA
614 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2004 : 05:39:37 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Starman
This is an interesting rule. Is Arnold real a US citizen or are there different ranks of citizenship?
Yes, Arnold is indeed a real naturalized citizen, but he is not a natural-born citizen as he was born in Austria. Valiant Dancer concisely stated the basic reason the rule was made early in this post. There are those who think is has become obsolete. Some even go so far as to say the distinction is "un-American".
Here's a link that goes into a little detail for anyone who is interested:
http://washingtontimes.com/commentary/20031112-093409-8265r.htm
The one I posted in my first reply has even more info, and some pretty racy pictures as well.  |
Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do on a rainy afternoon.
-- Susan Ertz
|
|
|
|
Valiant Dancer
Forum Goalie
USA
4826 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2004 : 06:55:14 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Starman
This is an interesting rule. Is Arnold real a US citizen or are there different ranks of citizenship?
A more rational approach is that the Chief Of State should be a descendant from one of Napoleons field marshals.
The only distinction in rights between natal citizenship and naturalized citizenship is who can be President. Otherwise, there is no difference. |
Cthulhu/Asmodeus when you're tired of voting for the lesser of two evils
Brother Cutlass of Reasoned Discussion |
|
|
|
Wendy
SFN Regular
USA
614 Posts |
Posted - 11/15/2004 : 07:57:16 [Permalink]
|
| A naturalized citizen can't be Vice-President either, for obvious reasons. |
Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do on a rainy afternoon.
-- Susan Ertz
|
|
|
|
Doomar
SFN Regular
USA
714 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 21:59:30 [Permalink]
|
Perhaps we could have a national poll with this question on the ballot so someone could rig the vote like they did the last election. That would decide it, right?
|
Mark 10:27 (NKJV) 27But Jesus looked at them and said, “With men it is impossible, but not with God; for with God all things are possible.”
www.pastorsb.com.htm |
|
|
|
Dude
SFN Die Hard
USA
6891 Posts |
Posted - 11/18/2004 : 23:31:20 [Permalink]
|
There is nothing wrong with requireing people to be natural-born citizens of this country in order to be president.
There were very good reasons, at the time, for including the requirement in the constitution. While they may not be as valid today, there is still some concern there... imo.
|
Ignorance is preferable to error; and he is less remote from the truth who believes nothing, than he who believes what is wrong.
-- Thomas Jefferson
"god :: the last refuge of a man with no answers and no argument." - G. Carlin
Hope, n.
The handmaiden of desperation; the opiate of despair; the illegible signpost on the road to perdition. ~~ da filth |
|
|
|
|
filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2004 : 04:21:33 [Permalink]
|
I could be wrong, but I don't think the Republicans will try to repeal the 22nd any time soon simply because it would open the door for Clinton. Clinton could concievably win it in a walk-away. Slick Willy and Wes Clark would be an act tough enough to give Rove the gibbering fantods.
Hell, they don't need to repeal it to keep power -- they got Bush in twice, didn't they? If they can do it with that pathetic dipshit, they can do it any other, pathetic dipshit.
I seem to recall the same buzz going around during Nixon's mercifully abbreviated, second term.
 |
"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist! 
|
|
|
|
furshur
SFN Regular
USA
1536 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2004 : 08:50:02 [Permalink]
|
Filthy, that is a good point. I bet the rabid conservatives probably do not think it is possible for Clinton to get reelected so they might do it anyway. I can't think of anything that would be funnier than having the republicans repeal the 22nd ammendment and then have Clinton take the election. The weeping and nashing of teeth by the fundies would be priceless...
|
If I knew then what I know now then I would know more now than I know. |
|
|
|
filthy
SFN Die Hard
USA
14408 Posts |
Posted - 11/19/2004 : 09:29:59 [Permalink]
|
A veritable symphony of sanctimonious agony, music to the ear and a soothing balm for the soul.
|
"What luck for rulers that men do not think." -- Adolf Hitler (1889 - 1945)
"If only we could impeach on the basis of criminal stupidity, 90% of the Rethuglicans and half of the Democrats would be thrown out of office." ~~ P.Z. Myres
"The default position of human nature is to punch the other guy in the face and take his stuff." ~~ Dude
Brother Boot Knife of Warm Humanitarianism,
and Crypto-Communist!
|
|
|
|
Wendy
SFN Regular
USA
614 Posts |
Posted - 11/20/2004 : 13:08:49 [Permalink]
|
quote:
Originally posted by Doomar
Perhaps we could have a national poll with this question on the ballot so someone could rig the vote like they did the last election. That would decide it, right?
Oh, man! You just gave me the creeps!
quote:
Originally posted by filthy
Clinton could concievably win it in a walk-away. Slick Willy and Wes Clark would be an act tough enough to give Rove the gibbering fantods.
If I ever doubted that, I don't now. I just got back from the dedication of his library. I have never seen so many people (or so much rain) in my life. The support was overwhelming. 
|
Millions long for immortality who don't know what to do on a rainy afternoon.
-- Susan Ertz
|
|
|
|
Cuneiformist
The Imperfectionist
USA
4955 Posts |
Posted - 11/22/2004 : 07:48:15 [Permalink]
|
Well, Wendy, looks like the New York Times' own word-wonk/conservative echo-chamber mouth piece Bill Safire has added his two cents in his op-ed for today (you'll need to log in (it's free) to the paper's website to read the piece).
His stance is clear: quote:
It's time to end discrimination based on place of birth that denies the equal right of every citizen to run for president.
He argues that Article II of the constitution quote:
makes all naturalized citizens - including taxpayers, voters, servicemembers - slightly less than all-American.
He's right to some extent, though the assertion that quote:
this has caused pregnant women to race back to our shores to make certain their children's political potential is not somehow beclouded.
is absurd. (In fact, I have anecdotal examples of the opposite-- or at least the place of their child's birth was not determined by the desire not to ruin her or his chance of being President.)
Of course, as Wendy already noted, all of this talk didn't spring up out of nowhere. Instead, as Safire makes clear, this is all a slow-but-sure attempt to try and change things so that there will be as many viable Republicans eligible for the office of President as possible. Indeed, Safire concludes be suggesting that quote:
After ratification of the 28th Amendment in 2007, I envision a G.O.P. ticket the next year with Rudy Giuliani or John McCain on top and Schwarzenegger as running-mate. For Democrats, Evan Bayh or Hillary Clinton for president, Peter Jennings (Canadian-born) for v.p.
In typical Safire fashion, he offers a plausible Republican ticket, but then counters it with a laughable Democratic one, but suggests that they're both equally viable.
|
|
|
|
Siberia
SFN Addict
Brazil
2322 Posts |
Posted - 11/22/2004 : 08:21:52 [Permalink]
|
| ... Hillary Clinton is not American? As in... born in US? |
"Why are you afraid of something you're not even sure exists?"
- The Kovenant, Via Negativa
"People who don't like their beliefs being laughed at shouldn't have such funny beliefs."
-- unknown
|
|
|
 |
|
Topic Locked
